Do you remember when it was normal for American families to own two houses?

a reply to: onequestion

I know what you mean. The American middle class has been paying the tax debts for corporations and the poor for 30 yrs, paying to keep the world and oil safe with perpetual war,the destruction of county medical and hospitals for the poor. That was to pass the cost to Feds which means all tax payers.
Then there were the institutions designed to remove free market and set prices amongst like minded thieves. Like the The landlords assoc.,real estate assoc.,the chamber of commerce. Then there are the local elected prostitutes who make impossible zoning laws that the middle class can't afford. We got no one but ourselves to blame for selling our souls for a minimum wage jobs

a reply to: onequestion

I never really had it that good. It sounds to me like your family was in the higher end of the "middle class". With the hyperinflation (lowering dollar value), it's no surprise that families that used to seem like they were doing well are having a harder time now.

I would say that I came from the "average" middle class as it used to be in America. Most of the people in the class I came from are living paycheck to paycheck, or in dangerous debt. It's a shame, with all the prosperity in America.

It's also a shame that in 2016, there are over 23 MILLION homeless people in America. There are more people in prison in America than there are homeless people in America, and more prisoners in America (per-capita) than anywhere else in the world! These are but a few of the great shames to the country that I love to have come from.

Everybody talks about these and other issues all of the time (the smarter people). Most people don't know anything of what we discuss here, or dismiss it altogether. With the majority not paying attention, these types of things will continue and they will get worse.

Even a mass Exodus out of the USA by its citizens would not be enough to stop this train on the tracks. If 100 million people became refugees out of the USA, they would be replaced by refugees from all other parts of the world (sponsored by the $0R0$ empire. Good luck America. You're going to need it.

in the UK we have the Office of National Statistics, who collate data from Census, and here we have the details from the 2011 census for second home ownership.

hahaha No, only if you were wealthy or you handbuilt your own home. Grew up in Appalachia. So that white picket fence everyone talks about never existed where I grew up. Think a lot of people can say the same thing.

No. My mom and dad both had good jobs. We never owned more than 1 house.

Maybe too many people want to believe they are middle class (and thus better than the working class).

Thus there is problem of perception and an awful lot of people are not really "middle class".

Just a thought!

originally posted by: mirageman
Maybe too many people want to believe they are middle class (and thus better than the working class).

Thus there is problem of perception and an awful lot of people are not really "middle class".

Just a thought!

What You Need To Earn to be in the Middle Class by State:
twocents.lifehacker.com...

a reply to: queenofswords

What You Need To Earn to be in the Middle Class by State:
twocents.lifehacker.com...

Middle class” doesn’t have a definite, official definition..............

twocents.lifehacker.com...

People still do own two house: In fact they sometime own more than two. What you define as the middle class is gone. Most of the money have floated upward.

My grandparents owned 2 homes, my parents owned 2, I plan on owning 3 or 4 and don't even make that much. No idea why you think it's so rare.

If anything it's rarer because there are many more vacation options so people are not stuck going to their house in Florida, they can go all over the world.

a reply to: OccamsRazor04

Wow. You live in a world like that for real? Or are you being sarcastic?

Come to think of it my grandparents owned 2 houses and they were poor. An old dilapidated house they lived in and an outhouse that they #$*@ in.

originally posted by: MOMof3
a reply to: OccamsRazor04

Wow. You live in a world like that for real? Or are you being sarcastic?

Nope, completely serious. I make less than a couple each making minimum wage and own a 3br house in a great neighborhood and looking to buy my 2nd house in a few months when my wife gets her first job and we will be buying a house in another country for her parents in a few years that will be a long term vacation house for us. That's reality. How much is the mortgage on a vacation house, how much are families spending on cell phone plans?

a reply to: OccamsRazor04
I have never been in debt. I did not buy a house til 64 and paid cash. All my vehicles,cash. So yeah I will never own two houses.

a reply to: BatheInTheFountain
yeah you`re right about that, In 1976 I could buy a pack of cigarettes for 50 cents and the minimum wage then was $2.30 an hour. Now the minimum wage is $7.25 an hour and a pack of cigarettes is $7.00
In 1976 I could buy 4 packs of cigarettes for an hours wage and still have money left, today an hours wage buys you 1 pack.

In my circle of friends while growing up well.
one family actually owned two homes, one in NY the other in Florida. They were farmers and would spend the summer months in NY and a little before school started in Fla, they would pack up and move south. Somehow, they always came back to NY with a new car.
Another family had a small camp in the mountains, I wouldn't consider that a home. You couldn't get to it in the winter and well it really wasn't big enough to house the entire family, it was more like a hunting camp.
Another family had a camper and each summer they would go somewhere, once they went to alaska. Don't consider that a second home either. Quit frankly we were probably more comfortable when we went and visited my grandmother every year.
The last family I can think of the guy was a doctor. Ya, they had two homes.

Come to think of it, we kind of had two homes briefly after my grandmother died. We grandkids were grown by then and well we shared the title of the property till it was sold off.

There's a couples reasons I can think of off the top of my head why it might be rarer now days...
First, many obtained that second home through inheritance. Now, it's so much more possible for the medical bills to require the sale of that home to pay them off when settling the estate. And well, you have to own something to leave to your heirs to begin with.

The second thing I can think of would be that well, two homes was good enough for the upper class, they wanted more, so in order for them to have four or five homes spread out across the globe, we have to do with less..

originally posted by: InFriNiTee

It's also a shame that in 2016, there are over 23 MILLION homeless people in America. There are more people in prison in America than there are homeless people in America, and more prisoners in America (per-capita) than anywhere else in the world! These are but a few of the great shames to the country that I love to have come from.

I live near Portland, Or. Lots of homeless since the city is very homeless friendly. What I have noticed is the vast majority of the homeless want that lifestyle for whatever reason. Those who do not want to be homeless but find themselves there tend to not stay homeless very long. I have seen the same homeless on the same street corner for over 5 years now...lol

So when you say 23 million what percentage of that are by personal choice?

Also, when you suggest there are more in prison is it because we enforce our laws better? Or that the freedoms people have in America allows them to pick and choose poorly compared to lets say in China where the indoctrination is to not get off the path and to accept you fate no matter what?

a reply to: MOMof3

It's not debt when the house is worth $70k more than I owe on it. If you want to do it your way you are welcome to. Just don't say it's not possible to own 2, it is, you choose not to, perfectly fine.

What? I grew up all over the income range, from po' to dad's 6-figure salary. We never knew anyone who had two homes. Come to think of it, as far as I know, my mom was the only one who had a mortgage on a home, too. My dad paid cash for his when they divorced. My mother wanted bigger, so she took out a mortgage to cover what the divorce's even-steven split of the savings account couldn't cover (she also had an ARM mortgage, take a guess as to how that worked out)
As best I can remember, none of the family friends had second homes, either. Neither did any of my friends' parents growing up.

None of my grandparents, aunts & uncles on both sides bought homes until they had the cash to pay in full. I think the few cousins I have have all gone through foreclosures (as well as my mother)

I really don't think this whole "second home" spiel is accurate to the middle class of the past. Sort of a weird, and likely incorrect, romanticized view of the middle class of the past, I suppose. What may be more accurate is that previous generations were less likely to carry a mortgage because they were more likely to buy in cash back then.

originally posted by: OccamsRazor04
a reply to: MOMof3

It's not debt when the house is worth $70k more than I owe on it. If you want to do it your way you are welcome to. Just don't say it's not possible to own 2, it is, you choose not to, perfectly fine.

Even if the value has accrued, that still seems incredibly risky to me, your mortgage depending. We're looking at buying in a year or two ourselves, but buying two places even if we were dual income would be financial suicide IMO. It only takes one job loss to ruin that set-up. And your credit score. Still your choice & all, but just way too "fast & loose" to me.