Holy trinity dogma is polytheistic.

originally posted by: Rasalghul

originally posted by: chr0naut

originally posted by: wisvol
a reply to: chr0naut

Well with the nuance it's easier. Thanks.

My recollection of reading the texts attributed to שאול התרסי do not present or imply that anything other than G is equal to G but I mean cool sure. Still interested in the actual quote, with chapter and verse if that's not too much trouble.

The first chapter of the Gospel of John, identifies Jesus as God.

Philippians 2:6 says that although Jesus was God, He still 'emptied' Himself to become a subservient and 'base' human.

I'm repeating myself but the concept of Gods word becoming manifest in a prophet comes from ZOROASTRIANISMs Zend Avesta. Zoroastrianism is WAY older than christianity so all that passage proves is they borrowed a Persian concept. Jesus is not God.

Yeah, exactly, just totally different??!!

Jesus wasn't just a prophet. If He was so, then his death was just another meaningless, insult to our human state. If Jesus wasn't God, He couldn't forgive sin.

"It may be that the Deity can forgive sins, but I do not see how." - Socrates comment to Plato @ 500 BC.

a reply to: chr0naut

Moses taught forgiveness of sin.
Mohammed taught forgiveness of sin.
The Avesta teaches forgiveness of sin.

God forgiving the sins of the repentant is not unique to Jesus Christ. The resurrection solidifies his right to make his claim, but all the other prophets taught the same message of a God who punishes sin but forgives those who repent.

Even Plato was wise enough to understand that the Devine can forgive even if the concept was to great to fully grasp.

originally posted by: Isurrender73
a reply to: chr0naut

Moses taught forgiveness of sin.
Mohammed taught forgiveness of sin.
The Avesta teaches forgiveness of sin.

God forgiving the sins of the repentant is not unique to Jesus Christ. The resurrection solidifies his right to make his claim, but all the other prophets taught the same message of a God who punishes sin but forgives those who repent.

Even Plato was wise enough to understand that the Devine can forgive even if the concept was to great to fully grasp.

Moses taught that adherence to the Law prevents us from sinning and that sin could only be absolved with multiple and repeated absolution ceremonies (animal sacrifices).

Mohamed taught adherence to the Law prevents us from sinning and that sin could only be absolved with multiple and repeated absolution ceremonies (Haj).

Zoroaster taught adherence to the Law prevents us from sinning and that sin could only be absolved with multiple and repeated absolution ceremonies (prayers for forgiveness).

Jesus taught that our love of God and then our love of our fellow humans Is the intention behind the Law, being so motivated will prevent us from sinning and also that His one sacrifice provides absolution from sin, once and for all time.

originally posted by: chr0naut

originally posted by: Rasalghul

originally posted by: chr0naut

originally posted by: wisvol
a reply to: chr0naut

Well with the nuance it's easier. Thanks.

My recollection of reading the texts attributed to שאול התרסי do not present or imply that anything other than G is equal to G but I mean cool sure. Still interested in the actual quote, with chapter and verse if that's not too much trouble.

The first chapter of the Gospel of John, identifies Jesus as God.

Philippians 2:6 says that although Jesus was God, He still 'emptied' Himself to become a subservient and 'base' human.

I'm repeating myself but the concept of Gods word becoming manifest in a prophet comes from ZOROASTRIANISMs Zend Avesta. Zoroastrianism is WAY older than christianity so all that passage proves is they borrowed a Persian concept. Jesus is not God.

Yeah, exactly, just totally different??!!

Jesus wasn't just a prophet. If He was so, then his death was just another meaningless, insult to our human state. If Jesus wasn't God, He couldn't forgive sin.

"It may be that the Deity can forgive sins, but I do not see how." - Socrates comment to Plato @ 500 BC.

Different how? What, I know something you don't so you have to TRY and insult me??

Sorry, but if you only study Christianity, your only gonna learn Christianity. If you study all the great religions from Brahman to Zoroastrianism, you will see they are all connected somehow, someway.

If you study ancient Mesopotamian religion you will learn that El isn't just a Hebrew word for God, El is God. Yahweh is a Jewish invention and does not mean Lord. Baal means lord. Yahweh just means He is. To worship Yahweh is a fools errand, he isn't the Messiah's father. And Jesus is not God, a god or the god

originally posted by: chr0naut

originally posted by: Rasalghul

originally posted by: chr0naut

originally posted by: wisvol
a reply to: chr0naut

Well with the nuance it's easier. Thanks.

My recollection of reading the texts attributed to שאול התרסי do not present or imply that anything other than G is equal to G but I mean cool sure. Still interested in the actual quote, with chapter and verse if that's not too much trouble.

The first chapter of the Gospel of John, identifies Jesus as God.

Philippians 2:6 says that although Jesus was God, He still 'emptied' Himself to become a subservient and 'base' human.

I'm repeating myself but the concept of Gods word becoming manifest in a prophet comes from ZOROASTRIANISMs Zend Avesta. Zoroastrianism is WAY older than christianity so all that passage proves is they borrowed a Persian concept. Jesus is not God.

Yeah, exactly, just totally different??!!

Jesus wasn't just a prophet. If He was so, then his death was just another meaningless, insult to our human state. If Jesus wasn't God, He couldn't forgive sin.

"It may be that the Deity can forgive sins, but I do not see how." - Socrates comment to Plato @ 500 BC.

I love how you couldn't find the word trinity in the bible and quoted a Greek philosopher instead.

Correct, Jesus wasn't just a prophet, he was the Messiah. Now look up prophet and then Messiah in a Hebrew online dictionary. Then look up God. Wouldn't you know, they don't mean the same thing.

Now learn about the pagan concept of a trinity. Then the paganism existent in Catholicism with the sun imagery and veneration of Mary as Isis/Semiramis.

Add that to the fact that Jesus calls God his God as well as Father.

If Jesus, by his own words has a God, and is not equal to his Father, the trinity falls under the definition of polytheism. If they aren't equal, as Jesus makes perfectly clear, then the trinity falls apart because they need to be equal to meet even the most liberal definition of monotheism.

a reply to: ketsuko

It's because the bible is based on Egyptian theology which came from the Sumerians andre had several gods and goddesses. Christianity failed when they tried to bring in the ideas of the Egyptians and place all those miracles (stories or fables) based on a single God.

People at least try to learn what you're worshipping. Do some research and find out why Catholicism was created in the first place. I think you will find it to be monetary and control based rather than faith based. I'm not dating the writings in the aren't true but take a look at the stories in the bible and find out why most things also happened over 3000 bc. Educate yourselves. Never follow blindly.

originally posted by: chr0naut

originally posted by: Isurrender73
a reply to: chr0naut

Moses taught forgiveness of sin.
Mohammed taught forgiveness of sin.
The Avesta teaches forgiveness of sin.

God forgiving the sins of the repentant is not unique to Jesus Christ. The resurrection solidifies his right to make his claim, but all the other prophets taught the same message of a God who punishes sin but forgives those who repent.

Even Plato was wise enough to understand that the Devine can forgive even if the concept was to great to fully grasp.

Moses taught that adherence to the Law prevents us from sinning and that sin could only be absolved with multiple and repeated absolution ceremonies (animal sacrifices).

Mohamed taught adherence to the Law prevents us from sinning and that sin could only be absolved with multiple and repeated absolution ceremonies (Haj).

Zoroaster taught adherence to the Law prevents us from sinning and that sin could only be absolved with multiple and repeated absolution ceremonies (prayers for forgiveness).

Jesus taught that our love of God and then our love of our fellow humans Is the intention behind the Law, being so motivated will prevent us from sinning and also that His one sacrifice provides absolution from sin, once and for all time.

I happen to have the Zend Avesta right here, could you tell me in what fargard that teaching is in? Is it in the Sirozahs, yasts, nyayis, tell me. I'm calling shenanigans. BS.

a reply to: chr0naut

You are correct. But the Quran that tells us why God did this.

God gave man rituals because we wanted them. We didn't believe in ourselves. We thought we needed some external God to determine our ways for us. So God sent his Son to give us the Law and be our God. As his son is YHWH the Co-creator. The reason Genesis is written from a plural account not a singular account.

Men also believed that God sought retribution through blood. In their ignorance men brought God down to a human level. As if God created something that he then needed something from.

Love is our Father.
The Holy Spirit is the Light within, the good voice, the good conscience that leads those who follow the Light, which the Father declared good and pleasing.

Jesus Christ who made man from dust and blew the Spirit of Life into him, became man and declared himself equal to man, even though in truth he was created equal to his father. And through him we are all being made to be Like him.

Childeren of God our Obedient to the Law because they are obedient to the Spirit of Unconditional Love. Jesus Christ

a reply to: Isurrender73

The reason Genesis is written from a plural account not a singular account.

That is simply not true...

The plurality in the genesis account is not meant to mean a trinity or multiple Gods... or three equals one God

Said trinity has absolutely no bearing on Judaic scripture... there is no trinity in the bible...

Only in Christian circles does such a thing exist, and Christians impose their beliefs on a religion that isn't even theirs

Ask anyone who is from that belief system... they will flatten said nonsense in a second...

Further more, all anyone needs to do is a quick google search to find the truth of the matter...

Its nothing more then Christianity desperately searching for proofs of their trinity that don't exist

a reply to: Akragon

My claim has nothing to do with the trinity.

My claim has everything to do with believing what is clearly written.

Jesus said he is the Light. He was speaking to the Jews who knew the Light was in reference to their God. What the Jews didn't understand is that YWHW is the Light created when the Father said Let there be Light in Genesis. Elohim is the Father of YHWH Elohim.

If Jesus is not the Light/Holy Spirit of the OT then what he said about himself was blasphemy.

This is not a trinitarian view.

There is One Father and One Son created by the Word of the Father "Let there be Light". One Son who created Adam. One Son who is the reason for the plural in Genesis.

I don't need anyone to believe what I believe. What I say may contradict what you believe, but no one can show me scriptures that contradicts what I am saying.

It is likely Mohammed understood the Bible Story the same way I do, which is why he was adamant that Jesus was not God the Father, just as I am.

Their is no desperation, only comprehension.

a reply to: Isurrender73

Its not comprehension when your initial premise is flawed...

There is no plurality to the Jewish god... Period

Regardless of whatever book you choose to read from, the idea that said god is any more then ONE... is not correct

Jesus also said "YOU are the light of the world" as well... Just so you know

Pardon the Trinitarian assumption... You were Christian at some point in the past If I am correct?

Perhaps I am mistaken though, but if you were... why the switch?

originally posted by: Isurrender73
a reply to: chr0naut

As his son is YHWH the Co-creator. The reason Genesis is written from a plural account not a singular account.


Jesus Christ who made man from dust and blew the Spirit of Life into him, became man and declared himself equal to man, even though in truth he was created equal to his father.

Christ

I had to chop that down it was so much bs. Where do I start?

Yahweh is not the Father of Jesus he is more of a bastard half brother.

Jesus is not equal to God, he says this many times.

Jesus isn't God and didn't create anything. He is a creation. Only God Most High can create, not even Yahweh can create. Only the Most High God can create. He can dole out tasks to his Elohim offspring but he decides who gets to do what.

Last, the plurality of which you speak is in the word Elohim which translates as Gods but for some ridiculous reason it gets used to refer to God singular. No trinity, just El Elyon and the Elohim. Google that.

a reply to: Akragon

So this is what I found on the Holy Trinity:

"The Holy Spirit proceeds from the Father and the Son, but not in a generative sense; rather, in a spiration. "Spiration" comes from the Latin word for "spirit" or "breath." Jesus "breathed on them, and said to them, "Receive the Holy Spirit..." (John 20:22). Scripture reveals the Holy Spirit as pertaining to "God's love [that] has been poured into our hearts" in Romans 5:5, and as flowing out of and identified with the reciprocating love of the Father for the Son and the Son for the Father (John 15:26; Rev. 22:1-2). Thus, the Holy Spirit's procession is not intellecual and generative, but has its origin in God's will and in the ultimate act of the will, which is love."

Recently the Pope said that Jesus was not a spirit but just a man canceling out Catholicism own words.

The trinity is nothing more than the combination of the father and son to make the Holy spirit which is actually god. Neither the father or son are God. The God is merely a spirit or state of mind and nothing more. So if the entire religion is based on a state of mind then what of the stories and miracles performed by the mere "man" Jesus. Remember these are not my words but the Pope and the church have said as much. You can love and be loving without religion.

www.catholic.com...

a reply to: jazzy4

Hate to say it, but you will not find accurate info on the trinity in Christian material...

They do nothing but confirm what is absent from the book...

The trinity is a fabrication... Likely purposefully made to align with Ancient roman/pagan beliefs

Jesus was most definitely not a Trinitarian... Neither were any of the apostles

DP

a reply to: Akragon

Exactly! So if the Catholics exclude such things and steer their flocks to what they want them to believe how can believe anything that is presented? If the trinity is such a major part of religion and is a fabrication what else a fabrication? Is the religion itself real. Is the bible as presented real. The king James version is the most accurate version of the bible although it was not the first bible. If you look at the history of king james and Rome during the times the bible was constructed you'll see some reasons why the bible was presented as such.

a reply to: jazzy4

Your arguing for your own spiritual enslavement so vigorously I just have to give credit to the church they have got you mixing Judaism and paganism, your defending instead of having the ball$ to admit like a man it's not in the *%cking bible and dealing with it.

You love lies that bad you actually believe them because you lack strength to confront the hypocrisy.

That's the type of person that the Jews call goyim. Look that up.

a reply to: jazzy4

Oh trust me my friend I know the history of the bible...

The KJV isn't actually the most accurate either, but it is the one I prefer... I find it reads like shakespear

The bible is designed for Christian doctrine... but you'll find that there are many deliberate mistranslations that are there to promote their beliefs.

Though the trinity is the biggest false hood far above the rest... which is soo deeply ingrained into their doctrine, almost all Christian's are Trinitarians... They will even go so far as to claim that IF you're not a Trinitarian, you're not Christian... even though by the very definition, to be Christian only means to follow Christ, who was not a Trinitarian at all

a reply to: jazzy4
You love Paul, the trinity, probably don't even know Christmas is a pagan holiday as is Easter. Easter is even the anglo way of saying Ishtar the pagan goddess. Are you familiar with hiding things in plain site? I hope so, but that's what has been done to Jesus teachings. Overshadowed by a false prophet that he is documented as foreseeing. The Apostles and "all of Asia" rejected Paul and never called him an Apostle once. He is the leaven of the Pharisees you numnuts!

a reply to: jazzy4

Im just breaking ball$ but google the website problemswithPaul

And then jesuswordsonly

I don't know how to do links