Why stop at socialism. Why not just go full communist?

originally posted by: 3NL1GHT3N3D1
a reply to: ExNihiloRed

I'm not jumping on a bandwagon, but socialist policies seem to be the best option I've come across so far. Those words from Rubio are empty at this point, they have no substance to them.

I cannot convince you to change your mind on what you think is best for you and your ideologies. I do not know you or your life or how anything will impact you. I have my opinions on what is best for me and the country. A majority of the people who vote will set the path forward and because I support our democratic republic, I will need to concede to their decisions. I can disagree, however, and do my best to make sure everyone who is making such a vital decision is fully informed and properly educated on the issues.

The biggest problem, and my biggest fear, is that people are not taking the time to really consider what is on the table and the consequences (on a macro and micro scale). I think the dumbing down of our society is the greatest sin of modern times. We are a society of hashtags and 5 second attention spans. I worry.

originally posted by: 3NL1GHT3N3D1
a reply to: ExNihiloRed

I'm not jumping on a bandwagon, but socialist policies seem to be the best option I've come across so far. Those words from Rubio are empty at this point, they have no substance to them.

So socialism is just the default go-to option for you?

originally posted by: 3NL1GHT3N3D1
a reply to: ExNihiloRed

We pay state taxes as well as federal taxes. Both are socialist in nature at both the state and federal levels. Us paying state taxes is what funds education, that is a socialist concept through and through.

In an obscure sense.

Apparently, everything good you pay is socialism which is good.

Because socialism can't be bad.

originally posted by: DBCowboy
Apparently, everything good you pay is socialism which is good.

Because socialism can't be bad.

Newtons 4th Law of Marxism. Good Becometh Those Who Socialize.

a reply to: ExNihiloRed

I'm beginning to understand the followers of socialism.

If they can convince enough people that your local police force is socialism, your fire department (even if it's a volunteer one) is socialism, or if your dentist practices socialism, then they can paint a happy picture of socialism.

They are trying to normalize socialism.

And in turn, eventually, communism.

And it is working.

originally posted by: DBCowboy
a reply to: ExNihiloRed

I'm beginning to understand the followers of socialism.

If they can convince enough people that your local police force is socialism, your fire department (even if it's a volunteer one) is socialism, or if your dentist practices socialism, then they can paint a happy picture of socialism.

They are trying to normalize socialism.

And in turn, eventually, communism.

And it is working.

And free stuff. That's an important tenet we can't forget.

a reply to: DBCowboy

Where did I say that? All I've said is that it seems to be the best option I've come across so far. What are the alternatives? If it has anything to do with ponzi schemes like insurance or paying thousands out of pocket I'm not interested.

a reply to: ExNihiloRed

Yeah, socialism has nothing to do with people getting free stuff. If you pay taxes then you're paying for that "free stuff", which kinda means it's not "free" at all.

originally posted by: 3NL1GHT3N3D1
a reply to: ExNihiloRed

Yeah, socialism has nothing to do with people getting free stuff. If you pay taxes then you're paying for that "free stuff", which kinda means it's not "free" at all.

Well thankfully you understand that. Please go tell that to all the Bernie fans, because I swear none of them get it.

a reply to: ExNihiloRed

How is it obscure? Your taxes pay for children to get an education and for the teachers to be paid. That's socialism, there's nothing obscure about it.

a reply to: ExNihiloRed

So how is that any worse than paying hundreds of dollars a month on insurance or thousands out of pocket? It's not any worse at all yet some people think it's the end of the world.

originally posted by: ExNihiloRed

originally posted by: daaskapital

originally posted by: ExNihiloRed
a reply to: daaskapital

People can have an adequate standard of living and proper medical treatment without socialism. Why does that have to be the only solution?

Of course they can, but it is undeniable that many millions of Americans go without healthcare and don't have an adequate standard of living.

Granted, these policies aren't bulletproof. People will still fall through the cracks, but many more people will enjoy a right to healthcare and adequate living with these policies.

And it is impossible for conservative, small government policies to accomplish this? Socialism is the best option?

As i said before, it is possible to achieve such things with alternative measures. I never said socialism is the best option. Stop trying to guide the conversation a particular way.

originally posted by: 3NL1GHT3N3D1
a reply to: ExNihiloRed

How is it obscure? Your taxes pay for children to get an education and for the teachers to be paid. That's socialism, there's nothing obscure about it.

I just see a difference between the concept of social welfare being paraded as grand scale socialism. There is a fundamental difference between full enveloping the country in socialism and having social welfare programs. I just see a difference. Pretty sure every time a republican tries to call out the things you list as "socialism" he gets laughed out of office.

originally posted by: 3NL1GHT3N3D1
a reply to: ExNihiloRed

So how is that any worse than paying hundreds of dollars a month on insurance or thousands out of pocket? It's not any worse at all yet some people think it's the end of the world.

You're missing the sacrifice in liberties that I'm less willing to part with. Some people are willing to trade in their freedom, I'm not one of them.

originally posted by: DBCowboy
a reply to: daaskapital

When a government starts seeing to the healthcare needs of it's people, you have a nanny state. No matter how benign, it is a nanny state.

That may be so, but universal healthcare doesn't have to replace privatised systems. Australia, for example, has a universal healthcare system, and a private healthcare system. They aren't mutually exclusive. People still have options.

a reply to: ExNihiloRed

Universal healthcare is a form of social welfare.

a reply to: ExNihiloRed

What liberties are those exactly? You would rather have no healthcare than healthcare for everyone?

originally posted by: 3NL1GHT3N3D1
a reply to: DBCowboy

Where did I say that? All I've said is that it seems to be the best option I've come across so far. What are the alternatives? If it has anything to do with ponzi schemes like insurance or paying thousands out of pocket I'm not interested.

Have you ever spoken with a doctor and set up plans that didn't include insurance? Many, I'd say most, would prefer to do things off the books and out of pocket instead of including government and insurance into the equation.

Socialism is lazy. Socialism is easy. Communism is even lazier.

It's easier.

You don't have to work at it or even think about it, it's all taken care of for you.

Ultimate nanny state.

originally posted by: 3NL1GHT3N3D1
a reply to: ExNihiloRed

Universal healthcare is a form of social welfare.

I am getting confused now at where our debate is headed. My understanding was your advocacy was for socialism, not just social welfare programs. Although I do not agree with universal healthcare, I was discussing the next steps that some in our country want to take to further socialist agendas (and my disagreements with such a path forward). Again, ships crossing in the night.