Ted Cruz was born in Canada

originally posted by: MotherMayEye
No. I want the eligibility requirement -- which is exclusive NOT by my doing, but by the decisions of those that drafted the document -- to be regarded or amended.

Well, it is regarded, so exactly how do you want it amended?

a reply to: yesyesyes

I don't know you, you very well could be a racist or a bigot, that is your deal.

and yet thats exactly what you called me

It's a troll thread to you because it doesn't benefit your political allegiance, don't play coy. I have searched out birther threads on ATS that are well over 50 pages long, I didn't see you in there damning the "obvious troll thread".

No its a troll thread because youre deliberately saying things about the guy thats not true, lol repeatedly and you KNOW it

THATS why its a troll thread......

Had you brought up legitimate issues youd have a point, however you keep saying both his parents are Canadian when you know for a fact his father is Cuban and his mother is American...

And you keep parroting the line, thats why its a troll thread

You dont see me in that thread because I wasnt an Obama Birther, and I thought the whole premise was ridiculous

I wonder if the GOP would accept a Mexican born president, with an American born mom who lived and voted in Mexico. (I will refrain from writing lol x 100 to the prospects of that)

As long as the mother is an American Citizen they would have to

Thats kind of the point

originally posted by: hellobruce

originally posted by: MotherMayEye
When you wrote this: "Yet you want other countries to remove the rights of US born citizens!"

Which is exactly what you want! You want US natural born citizens to have the right to be eligible to become POTUS removed.

Why do you want other countries to be able to remove the rights of US natural born citizens?

And by the way, the illegal overthrow of the Hawaiian Kingdom by a group of white American men -- in violation of an international treaty -- disqualifies Obama from being president.

That is unless you have such xenophobic disregard for Native Hawaiians that you believe the U.S. had a right to coerce their queen into forking over her nation to the U.S. under threats of killing her people.

But the fact is, a native Hawaiian could infiltrate the highest office in the U.S. to enact revenge for that wrongdoing because we have opened a door that should never have been opened...instead of simply returning the land to the people it belongs to.

To this day, the Kingdom of Hawaii does not regard the jurisdiction of the U.S. government. Nor should they.

Obama is not eligible. And neither is Ted Cruz.

originally posted by: ManBehindTheMask
a reply to: yesyesyes

The term anchor baby is used in a bigoted fashion by many in the GOP political circles.

You are being PC, it is not bigoted to point out that the most profound block of bigots in America are not very consistent when they apply their bigotry or policies for that matter.

I almost choked on my water at someone saying the term Anchor baby is bigoted, while telling me because i dont find it bigoted , that im being PC

What kind of mental gymnastics does that take

Bravo man Bravo

Now you are trolling my thread aren't you?

What you said is not articulated well enough to formulate a response.

originally posted by: hellobruce

originally posted by: MotherMayEye
No. I want the eligibility requirement -- which is exclusive NOT by my doing, but by the decisions of those that drafted the document -- to be regarded or amended.

Well, it is regarded, so exactly how do you want it amended?

It is not regarded. We are allowing people who are made citizens by positive law to become president.

I am all for amending the requirement to say 'citizen' -- sans 'natural born' -- if that is the will of the People.

a reply to: TerryMcGuire


I was speaking in general sense concerning the democratic party supporters who said Obama was considered natural born and that he was "natural born" even though he spent much less of his young life in the United States being raised in American culture and values.

It is either wrong for both, or it is right for both. No two ways. Anyone who believes that Obama is able to be POTUS must likewise accept Cruz as eligible to be president. Anyone who does not believe Obama is able to be POTUS must disregard Cruz.

However, it cannot be both ways, good for one and not for another. It is either accept both, or deny both. In the end, I think its up to the courts, and I believe they already ruled on that.

originally posted by: ManBehindTheMask
a reply to: yesyesyes

I don't know you, you very well could be a racist or a bigot, that is your deal.

and yet thats exactly what you called me

It's a troll thread to you because it doesn't benefit your political allegiance, don't play coy. I have searched out birther threads on ATS that are well over 50 pages long, I didn't see you in there damning the "obvious troll thread".

No its a troll thread because youre deliberately saying things about the guy thats not true, lol repeatedly and you KNOW it

THATS why its a troll thread......

Had you brought up legitimate issues youd have a point, however you keep saying both his parents are Canadian when you know for a fact his father is Cuban and his mother is American...

And you keep parroting the line, thats why its a troll thread

You dont see me in that thread because I wasnt an Obama Birther, and I thought the whole premise was ridiculous

I wonder if the GOP would accept a Mexican born president, with an American born mom who lived and voted in Mexico. (I will refrain from writing lol x 100 to the prospects of that)

As long as the mother is an American Citizen they would have to

Thats kind of the point

Any moment now they will close the thread down, bravo master troll!

I didn't call you a bigot, you just quoted me as saying, I do not know you one way or the other. lol

What am I saying about the guy that's not true? The leading presidential candidate for the GOP is posing the same
questions.

His mother voted in Canadian elections which may make her a dual citizen, Cruz himself was born in a different country.

a reply to: tothetenthpower
In this case, here is the issue: Ted Cruz's mother was not a citizen of Canada, at the time of his birth, did not have dual citizenship, this would not be an issue. However, there are questions that only a judge would be more qualified to answer.

But, the question that will come up, and it is one that is valid, is this: A citizen of the United States of America, moves to another country, and immigrates there, lives there and enjoys the benefits of that country, would their child be considered a natural born or a naturalized citizen of the United States of America?

According to most experts and those from Harvard, Ted Cruz is not a natural born citizen, but a naturalized citizen. If you go back to the intention of the founders, his citizenship would be based on where he was born and the citizenship of his father. Later on in a further act of Congress, they addressed that of women, however, it would go back to the prior question, about his mother.

And one other question that would have a bearing on this question on his mother is this: When she was living and working in Canada during that 8 years, did she pay the USA taxes on her income, or did those taxes go to Canada? And how often did his mother return back to the United States to visit? Those 2 questions would also help, and could resolve the question of if she was holding onto a dual citizenship or gave it up in favor of being citizen of one or the other country.

originally posted by: Kitana
a reply to: TerryMcGuire


I was speaking in general sense concerning the democratic party supporters who said Obama was considered natural born and that he was "natural born" even though he spent much less of his young life in the United States being raised in American culture and values.

It is either wrong for both, or it is right for both. No two ways. Anyone who believes that Obama is able to be POTUS must likewise accept Cruz as eligible to be president. Anyone who does not believe Obama is able to be POTUS must disregard Cruz.

However, it cannot be both ways, good for one and not for another. It is either accept both, or deny both. In the end, I think its up to the courts, and I believe they already ruled on that.

the difference is, Obama was born in America, while Cruz was not.

a reply to: yesyesyes

I didn't call you a bigot, you just quoted me as saying, I do not know you one way or the other. lol

No you called me a closet racist, which is why your post was removed, why are you running from that fact and being disingenuous?

Any moment now they will close the thread down, bravo master troll!

how am i trolling? ive posted nothing but facts regarding this candidate......

What am I saying about the guy that's not true? The leading presidential candidate for the GOP is posing the same
questions.

You mean the leading presidential candidate who stated not 3 months ago that there was absolutely no question that Cruz was eligible? That flip flopping candidate?

His mother voted in Canadian elections which may make her a dual citizen, Cruz himself was born in a different country.

Im still waiting for you to provide facts that determine hes not eligible...........

originally posted by: MotherMayEye
disqualifies Obama from being president.

If that actually happened it would still mean he was a natural born US citizen..

Obama is not eligible. And neither is Ted Cruz.

Obama certainly is, which is why every single silly birther court case, over 200+ of them have all failed.

It is so funny some armchair "experts" apparently know more than the courts who have declared Obama a natural born citizen!

originally posted by: ManBehindTheMask
a reply to: yesyesyes

I didn't call you a bigot, you just quoted me as saying, I do not know you one way or the other. lol

No you called me a closet racist, which is why your post was removed, why are you running from that fact and being disingenuous?

Any moment now they will close the thread down, bravo master troll!

how am i trolling? ive posted nothing but facts regarding this candidate......

What am I saying about the guy that's not true? The leading presidential candidate for the GOP is posing the same
questions.

You mean the leading presidential candidate who stated not 3 months ago that there was absolutely no question that Cruz was eligible? That flip flopping candidate?

His mother voted in Canadian elections which may make her a dual citizen, Cruz himself was born in a different country.

Im still waiting for you to provide facts that determine hes not eligible...........

I never called you a closeted bigot, for the last time, I don't know you so I can't speak about it. It is cute how you are now pretending that I did.

The Supreme court has never weighed in on this issue, so you are deluding yourself if you think you know with certainty.

The point of this thread was to discuss it, and as you see, many people have different perspectives, over 20 people.(Imagine that!)

I wonder, should all of ATS bow to your omniscient knowledge?

Are we really going to continue to go down this road of utter nonsense and stupidity?

Obama was eligible to become president and so is Cruz. It's a waste of our time to focus on such silliness and we need to focus on their ideas.

Defining Natural-Born Citizen

www.federalistblog.us...

What might the phrase “natural-born citizen” of the United States imply under the U.S. Constitution? The phrase has always been obscure due to the lack of any single authoritative source to confer in order to understand the condition of citizenship the phrase recognizes. Learning what the phrase might have meant following the Declaration of Independence, and the adoption of the Fourteenth Amendment, requires detective work. As with all detective work, eliminating the usual suspects from the beginning goes a long way in quickly solving a case.

What Natural-Born Citizen Could Not Mean

Could a natural-born citizen simply mean citizenship due to place of birth?

Unlikely in the strict sense because we know one can be native born and yet not a native born citizen of this country. There were even disputes whether anyone born within the District of Columbia or in the territories were born citizens of the United States (they were generally referred to as “inhabitants” instead.) National Government could make no “territorial allegiance” demands within the several States because as Madison explained it, the “powers delegated by the proposed Constitution to the Federal Government, are few and defined,” and those “which are to remain in the State Governments are numerous and indefinite.”

Jurisdiction over citizenship via birth within the several States was simply an exercise of a States “numerous and indefinite” powers. Early acts of Naturalization recognized the individual State Legislatures as the only authority who could make anyone a citizen of a State. James Madison said citizenship rules “have obtained in some of the States,” and “if such a law existed in South Carolina, it might have prevented this question from ever coming before us” (question of Rep. William Smith being a citizen or not).

Framer James Wilson said, “a citizen of the United States is he, who is a citizen of at least some one state in the Union.” These citizens of each State were united together through Article IV, Sec. II of the U.S. Constitution, and thus, no act of Congress was required to make citizens of the individual States citizens of the United States.

Prior to the Revolutionary War place of birth within the dominions of the crown was the principle criterion for establishing perpetual allegiance to the King, however natural citizenship via birth could require being born to a British subject depending on the era in question. After independence this perpetual allegiance to the crown was abandoned for the principle of expatriation.

It should be noted this allegiance due under England’s common law and American law are of two different species. Under the common law one owed a personal allegiance to the King as an individual upon birth for which could never be thrown off. Under the American system there was no individual ruler to owe a perpetual personal allegiance to.

Furthermore, unlike the British practice, States required everyone including aliens to take an oath of allegiance to the State as a condition of residency. Children born to these residents were considered born into the allegiance of the State. In addition to this, States also had specific laws that banned citizenship to alien born who were not resident aliens who had declared their allegiance. New York for example, responded through enactment of a law to the ruling in Lynch v. Clarke (1844) that had used common law rules of citizenship by birth to specifically exclude children born to “transient aliens, and of alien public ministers and consuls, etc.”

In other words, unlike under the common law, birth by itself did not create allegiance to anyone due merely to locality.

According to this article, Cruz is NOT a natural born citizen.

scholarship.law.georgetown.edu...

Page 1, second paragraph.

originally posted by: MotherMayEye

originally posted by: hellobruce

originally posted by: MotherMayEye
He was born a dual U.S. citizen/British subject -- by his own admission.

Nothing in the constitution states a dual citizen cannot become POTUS....

WRONG. Article II specifically states the POTUS must be a 'natural born Citizen.' SINGULAR. 'CITIZEN.' It does NOT provide that the POTUS may have multiple citizenshipS in multiple nationS.

Guys the point is mute when it comes to Obama as he was born in an American state to an American mom.

originally posted by: ManBehindTheMask
a reply to: yesyesyes

I don't know you, you very well could be a racist or a bigot, that is your deal.

and yet thats exactly what you called me

It's a troll thread to you because it doesn't benefit your political allegiance, don't play coy. I have searched out birther threads on ATS that are well over 50 pages long, I didn't see you in there damning the "obvious troll thread".

No its a troll thread because youre deliberately saying things about the guy thats not true, lol repeatedly and you KNOW it

THATS why its a troll thread......

Had you brought up legitimate issues youd have a point, however you keep saying both his parents are Canadian when you know for a fact his father is Cuban and his mother is American...

And you keep parroting the line, thats why its a troll thread

You dont see me in that thread because I wasnt an Obama Birther, and I thought the whole premise was ridiculous

I wonder if the GOP would accept a Mexican born president, with an American born mom who lived and voted in Mexico. (I will refrain from writing lol x 100 to the prospects of that)

As long as the mother is an American Citizen they would have to

Thats kind of the point

Yet, did you post this common sense rebuttal, in any Obama birther threads? Or just now, in this time, did you find the need to explain presidential eligibility?

originally posted by: hellobruce

originally posted by: MotherMayEye
disqualifies Obama from being president.

If that actually happened it would still mean he was a natural born US citizen..

Obama is not eligible. And neither is Ted Cruz.

Obama certainly is, which is why every single silly birther court case, over 200+ of them have all failed.

It is so funny some armchair "experts" apparently know more than the courts who have declared Obama a natural born citizen!

Please stop with the 'silly' stuff. You use it entirely too often to take seriously.

The courts don't have jurisdiction to interpret natural law. That's why SCOTUS said we need to look 'elsewhere' to find the answers. I stated that much 20 comments ago.

originally posted by: Spider879

originally posted by: MotherMayEye

originally posted by: hellobruce

originally posted by: MotherMayEye
He was born a dual U.S. citizen/British subject -- by his own admission.

Nothing in the constitution states a dual citizen cannot become POTUS....

WRONG. Article II specifically states the POTUS must be a 'natural born Citizen.' SINGULAR. 'CITIZEN.' It does NOT provide that the POTUS may have multiple citizenshipS in multiple nationS.

Guys the point is mute when it comes to Obama as he was born in an American state to an American mom.

An American state that is in dispute even to this day. Kingdom of Hawaii

And I believe you mean MOOT, not mute.

a reply to: yesyesyes


Actually I read your post earlier where you did indeed call the poster a closet racist

It's really nasty and dishonest of you to deny that then accuse people of things while you thought the thread have carried in accusing members of things and making attacks

Despite all that. Your whole thread isn't founded he's eligible without s doubt
that's coming from a person that's going to vote for Bernie

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