Private messages at work can be read by employers, says court

They also can be read by the site admins on ATS also.. have you Read the fine print>?
Please Note: Your private communications between members is provided as a service by AboveTopSecret.com and are subject to review in the event we receive reports of messaging that may be outside the boundaries of the site Terms & Conditions. Abusive private messages may result in immediate account termination without warning or recourse. www.abovetopsecret.com...
How much ATS admin uses this i highly think is almost non ex-extent
Point being how is this surprising to ANYONE YOUR EMPLOYERS do this regularly.

a reply to: peck420

Yes. Everyone has the opportunity to just quit working and start their own business.

It's really easy....just ask Trump.

a reply to: starfoxxx

Oh crap...

a reply to: forkedtongue
I basically agree with you. If you can do more, get paid for it. If they want x in y hours, you do x in y then that should be OK. They got what they contracted for. They could add for you half the other guy's pay while you do twice the work, fire him and they come out ahead.

But greed is the driving force behind most companies so you won't get the reward.

a reply to: peck420

I care about the world and people in it, I care about the future of everyone and the human species. It has very little to do with myself but humanity as a whole. The bulk of humanity is kept in poverty to force us to work for scraps so that businesses can take advantage of that desperation to pay us as little as possible for the work we do, knowing full well the work we do and the time we invest is worth more than what we're offered. But since the choice is starve and be homeless or accept this reality, we're forced to accept the scraps or die.

While some of us may be capable of sacrificing our lives to crawl out of this hole, it does not excuse it's existence.

Unless you pay well, you are taking full advantage of conditions created by this wealth disparity. If you're honestly paying all you can afford, but it's still not enough, then is quite possible you're in the same position as us, with your small business unable to compete due to the unfair business practices of your wealthy competitors. Well that or your business is a failure cause it's not making enough to pay you and your employees a decent wage.

originally posted by: roadgravel
But greed is the driving force behind most companies so you won't get the reward.

Hence why some employers feel they have the right to subpoena your personal phone for sending a text while being a slave on their time. ........

originally posted by: forkedtongue
I am a very good and hard worker, I usually can handle around 2 times the work load in the same time frame as my coworkers.

But I will be damned if I do 2 times more work for the same money.

Then you have no interest in advancing to a higher paying position?

Two very important things when looking at who to advance to a position of more responsibility and higher pay -
Are they clock watchers?
Do they go the extra mile in their work?

Minus those two things, most employers would never consider a person for advancement.

a reply to: Blaine91555

Does that include smokers who waste approximately 2 hours a day smoking?

a reply to: IslandOfMisfitToys

Why would an employer allow that?

What people do on breaks is irrelevant as long as its done on break.

I have smokers in my office and they save it for their breaks and it does not impact their work.

I'm more concerned with people who are always late, stop working early and stare at the clock and those who are always more concerned about what others are doing than they are doing what they are paid to do don't impress me at all. They could never manage others if they can't even take care of their own duties.

The yeah but look at what he or she is doing crowd usually end up being lousy workers themselves. Most of them don't last long.

originally posted by: roadgravel
a reply to: forkedtongue
I basically agree with you. If you can do more, get paid for it. If they want x in y hours, you do x in y then that should be OK. They got what they contracted for. They could add for you half the other guy's pay while you do twice the work, fire him and they come out ahead.

But greed is the driving force behind most companies so you won't get the reward.

Yup

Which is where I have problems with this mindset.

originally posted by: Blaine91555

originally posted by: forkedtongue
I am a very good and hard worker, I usually can handle around 2 times the work load in the same time frame as my coworkers.

But I will be damned if I do 2 times more work for the same money.

Then you have no interest in advancing to a higher paying position?

Two very important things when looking at who to advance to a position of more responsibility and higher pay -
Are they clock watchers?
Do they go the extra mile in their work?

Minus those two things, most employers would never consider a person for advancement.

It has been my experience, the biggest butt kisser or the bosses buddy get promoted, work ethics and ability be damned.

What you just said is how things used to work, they have not worked that way in a very long time.

a reply to: forkedtongue

After being diagnosed with a chronic life threatening disease I have come to the conclusion that work and work ethic aren't as important anymore.

If an employer doesn't like it either fire me or STFU......

a reply to: forkedtongue

Do you consider working harder, going the extra mile to be butt kissing?

How did a person become a "buddy" to the boss? Maybe by being reliable and going the extra mile showing that boss that they can be trusted and are capable of moving up the ladder?

Perception is not always reality.

You put in the extra effort and be reliable, you will advance and I don't buy that things have changed as to how people move up in companies. Nepotism has always been around, always.

I'm sure exceptions exist, but for a company to succeed and grow, the right people need to be advanced and that is not the clock watcher, whiners or those who are expert at looking busy when they are not. A future manager will be the one who walks up to their boss and says I'm done, is there something else I can be doing instead of farting around.

originally posted by: peck420

originally posted by: MotherMayEye
I wonder how many people commenting on this thread are at work, right now.

Right now? I find that part interesting. As an employer, I find that I don't actually have time off of work. I am either at work, in transit for work, or sleeping. Any time I have when I am not physically partaking in the previous, I am on call. 24/7/365.

It has been my experience that, as an owner, there is no separation between personal life and work life. They tend to become one entity, generally due to necessity. Which is an issue that the vast majority of employees don't have to deal with. So, you will have to excuse me for not being completely sympathetic to their plight about 'personal time'. That is a luxury that I can never seem to afford.

I would have to say it’s been my experience, and the experience of many authors of books I have read on the subject of entrepreneurship, that if you find it difficult to separate your personal time and your time running your business than you are doing an ineffective job managing your business.

Often is the case that when an entrepreneur find themselves in a situation where they cannot afford downtime it is because they are an ineffective manager. They are often very good technician (ie they have the skill to do the technical work and turn it into a business), but they are not well versed in the management side of the business. They are often ineffective planers, delegators and strategists; a completely different set of skills than are necessary to complete the technical work that is making the business go.

Downtime should not be seen as a luxury to the entrepreneur; it should be seen as a necessary and healthy part of running a business. It won’t do the entrepreneur any good if they manage to create a thriving business only to have it collapse because the entrepreneur burns out. Further one of the most important tasks for an entrepreneur is strategizing and this cannot be done effectively if the entrepreneur is over worked.

This concept is not at all different from the needs of an employee. Study after study show that an employee who is over worked, does not have adequate personal time, begins to degrade in efficacy. Effective businesses understand this and adopt utilization metrics to keep track of how much time an employee is working; and just as important as it is to know how much time an employee is wasting playing mind sweeper during their shift; it is equally important to measure and manage how much down time an employee has.

You are correct; most employees never have to even think about these concepts. They just take for granted the separation between their work and their personal time. But just because they don’t pay the issue any mind shouldn’t be a reason to scorn the idea of “Personal Time”. An argument could very easily be made that the entrepreneur cannot afford to not have personal time.

originally posted by: Blaine91555
a reply to: forkedtongue

Do you consider working harder, going the extra mile to be butt kissing?

How did a person become a "buddy" to the boss? Maybe by being reliable and going the extra mile showing that boss that they can be trusted and are capable of moving up the ladder?

Perception is not always reality.

You put in the extra effort and be reliable, you will advance and I don't buy that things have changed as to how people move up in companies. Nepotism has always been around, always.

I'm sure exceptions exist, but for a company to succeed and grow, the right people need to be advanced and that is not the clock watcher, whiners or those who are expert at looking busy when they are not. A future manager will be the one who walks up to their boss and says I'm done, is there something else I can be doing instead of farting around.

I don't think its necessarily Nepotism that led people to feel the way forkedtongue expressed.

There is defiantly a growing trend with in large and mid-size businesses where in an employee is being measured on more than just their work ethic and skill level. A leading contributor to hiring and promotion these days is how well an employee “fits into” the cooperate culture. Promotions will go to an employee who the Evaluator feels they could be or are friends with.

This is not to say that this employee won’t have the skills needed or doesn’t have a good work ethic; just that they have an advantage over other who may have a better work ethic or skill level leading to the perception that only the bosses buddy gets the promotions.

originally posted by: Blaine91555
a reply to: forkedtongue

Do you consider working harder, going the extra mile to be butt kissing?

How did a person become a "buddy" to the boss? Maybe by being reliable and going the extra mile showing that boss that they can be trusted and are capable of moving up the ladder?

Perception is not always reality.

You put in the extra effort and be reliable, you will advance and I don't buy that things have changed as to how people move up in companies. Nepotism has always been around, always.

I'm sure exceptions exist, but for a company to succeed and grow, the right people need to be advanced and that is not the clock watcher, whiners or those who are expert at looking busy when they are not. A future manager will be the one who walks up to their boss and says I'm done, is there something else I can be doing instead of farting around.

What you are saying here is true in small to medium sized business. Really in any business where the owner is intimately involved in the day to day operations of each individual employee. This starts to fall apart as soon as a business reaches the size that intermediate or department managers are placed in between the ultimate authority and individual employees.

In this case an over-achiever will be kept in place at all costs as an "ace in the hole" for the manager. Someone he or she can always depend on to save the day or make up the difference when production falls for whatever reason. The owner, entrepreneur, CEO, whatever will never even hear this employee's name let alone have him or her recommended for promotion.

Lesser employees are very often advanced as a way to "get them out of my hair" by an intermediate manager. Where I work we call this being "fired UP". It happens frequently. And as long as the overall department figures look good, upper management will NEVER get involved in someone else's "back yard". Seen it, lived it, known it well for over 25 years.

In reference to the OP, if you are on the company clock using company resources the company owns whatever you do. Use your own time and your own resources and it belongs to you.

a reply to: DanDanDat

I'm sure there is a difference related to the size of a company. The smaller, the more people getting along matters.

I have a small office and staff which is quite a different thing than dealing with so many employees that decisions are made regarding people by someone who knows only what is in the records. A slacker in my case sticks out like a sore thumb.

Still, performance is key to advancement as it should be. A person who does just enough should not advance to their level of inadequacy. I recall in the 1980's reading an article about one of the biggest problems with large companies, was promoting people to a level they could not handle. Then they loose a person who was doing a very good job before they screwed up by not recognizing they had peaked.

I can't see a case no matter the size of the company that promoting a clock watcher who does just enough is desirable.

a reply to: Montana

That makes sense.

While this may be news to the EU, this is nothing new in North America.

The Supreme Court ruled on this several times. When you're using an employers equipment, whether it be their computer, internet connection, or email account, they are allowed to track you.

Want privacy? Buy your own damn computer and pay for your own internet connection.

a reply to: DanDanDat
I see you have been talking with my wife...

Or my management team...

One day I will overcome most of my flaws and bad habits (or burn out), but that day hasn't arrived just yet.