'Project Dorian'; 1960s Eye in the Sky (never implemented)

www.scientificamerican.com...

in the 60s el Pentagon was developing a manned eye-in-the-sky project called Dorian. Apparently involved a modified Gemini capsule, and was to be used for on-the-spot recon.

"While the program never actually lofted a crewed space station, those nearly six years were quite eventful, featuring the selection of 17 MOL astronauts, the remodeling of NASA's two-seat Gemini spacecraft, the development of the Titan-3C launch vehicle and the building of an MOL launch site at Vandenberg Air Force Base in California."

presumably satellite tech developed to the point where Dorian was considered un-needed. Some of the astronauts flew in Apollo / Shuttle I believe.

hopefully Mr. Oberg can fill us in on some details?

a reply to: ElGoobero

Seems to me that while unmanned, the X-33 program is a continuation of this initiative. Developing the capability to put specific recon resources over a specific target on short notice.

a reply to: ElGoobero

I always wonder, when it comes to such projects, how we can be so certain they weren't implemented. The Star Wars program, for example, I don't believe was cancelled when they claim. How would we know?

originally posted by: LadyGreenEyes
a reply to: ElGoobero

I always wonder, when it comes to such projects, how we can be so certain they weren't implemented. The Star Wars program, for example, I don't believe was cancelled when they claim. How would we know?

good point. some congresspersons went berserk when the CIA wanted the SR-71 grounded; did it occur to them that there was already a replacement?

as I understand it, nothing gets launched / in orbit without the world knowing about, from anywhere, so I don't think we could deploy a manned mission without the world knowing.

a reply to: LadyGreenEyes

Probably still working on a viable portable power source to power there particle beam weaponry.

a reply to: ElGoobero

If this was a CIA black op, Mr Oberg might not know about it.

They were sending up astronauts with cameras well before the U2 became a thing & were in space before NASA had any manned capsules.

The MOL was to have been the successor to the individual orbital shots.

originally posted by: ElGoobero

originally posted by: LadyGreenEyes
a reply to: ElGoobero

I always wonder, when it comes to such projects, how we can be so certain they weren't implemented. The Star Wars program, for example, I don't believe was cancelled when they claim. How would we know?

good point. some congresspersons went berserk when the CIA wanted the SR-71 grounded; did it occur to them that there was already a replacement?

as I understand it, nothing gets launched / in orbit without the world knowing about, from anywhere, so I don't think we could deploy a manned mission without the world knowing.

These days, I wouldn't bet on a replacement, if I wasn't 100% sure there was one. Some in authority want to weaken the military, instead of strengthening it. Members of Congress also are known to work for various factions other than the People, as well. The system isn't functioning as it should.

As for a manned mission, well, who knew would depend on a lot of factors. They launch a LOT of things they state are unmanned, and I don't think it would be that hard to send people, if no one was looking closely. Plus, there are always the rumors of some other way to get people into space, such as teleportation devices. None proven yet, to the public, but there are rumors. I recall some of that sort WAY back when my eldest was still in school. If such a thing were possible, they could send people whenever they wanted. No launch needed.

Welcome to the site, btw!

originally posted by: ElGoobero
presumably satellite tech developed to the point where Dorian was considered un-needed. Some of the astronauts flew in Apollo / Shuttle I believe.

There is an excellent article on the Space Review regarding the KH-10 DORIAN system. Essentially, the supposition quoted above is correct. The technology advanced to the point where a man-tended observation satellite was not only un-needed, the equipment necessary to keep the crew alive actually limited the capabilities of the observation satellite.

The equipment necessary to keep a crew alive - air circulation and conditioning, CO2 removal, water purification, waste disposal, etc. - was (and remains) very heavy. Every pound of satellite devoted on DORIAN to crew support would have been a pound that could not be used for cameras, film, etc. In addition, life support equipment would have created vibrations - albeit very small vibrations - on the spacecraft, which would have affected the resolution of the camera. Anyone who has taken a picture using an extreme zoom setting knows that even the slightest vibration can cause a photo to be out of focus. Taking photos from orbit requires a very stable platform - the more stable, the better.

good post Mr. Phan.
back in the day they needed film for quality pics; I guess telescopes / video developed to where they could do the job so no need to retrieve the film canisters.

a reply to: PhloydPhan

Looking though this thread I think you offer the most reasonable response as to if the program was ever put into use. Back then, all they had was film which requires very stable platform to make a decent picture. If the US government wanted to do some spying from space, they would want a camera that would not be effected by little vibrations.

originally posted by: ElGoobero
good post Mr. Phan.
back in the day they needed film for quality pics; I guess telescopes / video developed to where they could do the job so no need to retrieve the film canisters.

That happened eventually, but recovery of actual film from spy satellites such as the KH-9 HEXAGON series continued long after development of the KH-10 DORIAN program was cancelled. The HEXAGON satellites were active from 1971 through 1984 (the last satellite, which was launched in 1986, was destroyed in a launch failure). Here's another source with some HEXAGON information.

Each of the KH-9 satellites carried either 4 or 5 small reentry capsules which were used to return film to Earth. What I find most amazing about this program is that the film canisters were captured in mid-air by specially equipped C-130 Hercules transports. There's a great article about such captures here. NOTE: The preceding link is a PDF. It also links to the cia.gov site. FYI.

Other spy satellites, like the KH-8 GAMBIT series, used the same method of recovery. Electronic transmission of spy satellite images did not begin until the introduction of the KH-11 KENNAN series satellites in 1976. These satellites were operated concurrently with previous generations of satellites, which used film, for some years.