Unprecedented sex harassment in Helsinki at New Year, Finnish police report

originally posted by: luthier
... to the refugees who want a better life and want to assimilate ...

But do the migrants, of whom some are refugees, really want to assimilate into Western culture?

The evidence is that they do not and their religion disallows this to happen anyway. For example, the treatment of women (i.e. equality) is not really a Muslim thing is it? These differences ensures reduced assimiliation chances and increased risk of marginalisation within their host country.

This is part of the problem. Men who are brought up as Muslims, are not inclined to view women as equals. You can see that in the UK through employment rates of Muslim women and the lack of freedom within their communities. In the UK we still have FGM, forced marriage and all that, even though these practices are illegal. Some women are just culturally repressed and silenced by men.

Talking about these things could land you in jail.
To hell with free speech, personal freedom etc.

Long live the collective

originally posted by: paraphi

originally posted by: luthier
... to the refugees who want a better life and want to assimilate ...

But do the migrants, of whom some are refugees, really want to assimilate into Western culture?

The evidence is that they do not and their religion disallows this to happen anyway. For example, the treatment of women (i.e. equality) is not really a Muslim thing is it? These differences ensures reduced assimiliation chances and increased risk of marginalisation within their host country.

This is part of the problem. Men who are brought up as Muslims, are not inclined to view women as equals. You can see that in the UK through employment rates of Muslim women and the lack of freedom within their communities. In the UK we still have FGM, forced marriage and all that, even though these practices are illegal. Some women are just culturally repressed and silenced by men.

It's not all Muslims. The king of Jordan for instance is married to a white woman. No headscarfs worn. President of Indonesia wife doesn't wear a veil either. Indonesia and Pakistan have had female president and PM.

Syria prior to the war had equality amongst the sexes look it up. Had a high equality of education between the sexes. Female drs, engineers etc. Iraq as well. Indonesia as well. Jordan as well. Turkey as well. Though Erdogan is bringing it backwards.

But there is a problem for sure with many Muslims societies in the ME. But that is not all Muslims. Just like not all jews are Orthadox conservatives, or all Christians are westborow church idiots.

Maybe do a little anthropological research before condemning the whole religion. There is some reform happening. That doesn't mean there isn't a real problem but there was a real problem with Christianity in the past as well. It wasn't until the 1970's that spousal rape could be prosecuted, 20's voting rights etc. There can be change and it should be encouraged. That doesn't mean covering up the monstrosities being done but there are Muslims trying to reform the faith to a modern age.

originally posted by: luthier

I said strawmans not straws.

Your very first paragraph dismisses there is a Muslim issue. It is not just a regional issue. It's following the original version and interpretation of the Koran.

Just like Christianity had its schisms that is what is needed in Islam to change human rights issues. It is in fact their religion which dictates these subjugation laws and practices.

Or rather their interpretation of the religion. Any way you slice it your trying to say Islam has no part in these crimes. Which just isn't true. The Islamic way of life in the ME does in fact come into play when considering the issue.

You are aware that Islam does actually have it's divisions? You are aware that there are two types of people who call themselves Muslims, those that think they can do wrong things and hide behind their bible, and those that know better.

originally posted by: symphonyofblase

originally posted by: luthier

I said strawmans not straws.

Your very first paragraph dismisses there is a Muslim issue. It is not just a regional issue. It's following the original version and interpretation of the Koran.

Just like Christianity had its schisms that is what is needed in Islam to change human rights issues. It is in fact their religion which dictates these subjugation laws and practices.

Or rather their interpretation of the religion. Any way you slice it your trying to say Islam has no part in these crimes. Which just isn't true. The Islamic way of life in the ME does in fact come into play when considering the issue.

You are aware that Islam does actually have it's divisions? You are aware that there are two types of people who call themselves Muslims, those that think they can do wrong things and hide behind their bible, and those that know better.

You can read correct? Read my posts. Particularly the one right above your post.

originally posted by: luthier


You can read correct? Read my posts. Particularly the one right above your post.

Sure I can read correct. We appear to be on the same page, maybe.