A cautionary tale about eavesdroppers in pubs and anti-terrorsim.

a reply to: Freeborn

. . . I asked if he wanted a glass with that and he said Yes. When I automatically offered him a half glass he looked at me strangely and asked for a pint glass.
Everyone, and I mean everyone, knows that Newcastle Brown Ale is either drank out of a half glass or out of the bottle . . .

This worries me. You're drinking Newkie Brown out of glasses now? I knew things had gone downhill but I didn't realise it was that bad.

Grandson hassling for attention. Gotta be quick.

Something's going on. If you're in a sensitive position in a foreign land you get watched for everybody's protection.

If it's dodgy, intuition tells me there's a water connection. Times aren't as innocent as they used to be.

a reply to: Freeborn

As a general rule unless someone is an alcoholic I don't really trust anyone who doesn't drink

Thats a bit harsh!
I went for many years (decade or two) without drinking, quite simply because even a single pint makes me feel bloody awful!
Eventually I discovered I love expensive Cognac, cheap stuff is nasty, luckily I cant afford much of it so its really just a christmas treat for me.
I know quite a few people who wont touch alcohol, but will take part in consuming other intoxicants, so your idea that people don't drink because they're afraid of losing control of their mouth is not imo likely to be the reason.

As for your OP.
I feel the police revealed too much during their inquiries for this to be any kind of surveillance op, most likely a nosy bod heard some of the conversation and blabbed to the old bill.

It happened to me! I was on my landline (many years ago now) to my mate chatting about how far I'd gotten in our new pc game, I told him I'd got a hand gun, a shot gun, and a rocket launcher. My neighbor heard our conversation and I got a visit from the local plod, he laughed and told me he knew what had happened when he received the report. He stayed for a cuppa while I showed him the game, then the serious questions started!
He wanted to know what hardware he'd need to play!
That was back when the british coppers were nice guys.

one of X's party must have already been under suspicion and/or surveillance?

originally posted by: Kester This worries me. You're drinking Newkie Brown out of glasses now? I knew things had gone downhill but I didn't realise it was that bad.

this should have been a red flag

originally posted by: VoidHawk

I feel the police revealed too much during their inquiries for this to be any kind of surveillance op, most likely a nosy bod heard some of the conversation and blabbed to the old bill.

If the nosy bod worked anywhere on the front line in schools/hospitals/councils/youth services etc., he/she may have had relevant training under RIPA (Regulation_of_Investigatory_Powers_Act_2000) laws to know/follow official blabbing channels.

en.wikipedia.org...

www.liberty-human-rights.org.uk...

a reply to: VoidHawk

Thats a bit harsh!

It was said a bit tongue in cheek, you know, a bit of banter not really meant to be taken literally......a bit like X and his reference to Ricin.

I was on my landline (many years ago now) to my mate chatting about how far I'd gotten in our new pc game, I told him I'd got a hand gun, a shot gun, and a rocket launcher.

Just goes to show how paranoid some people are and how they are all too keen to poke their noses in other peoples business.
Some people really need to get out more and join the human race.

What an intriguing tale! I'm not sure where I stand on any possible explanation.

At one extreme, it almost seems like you have been the victim of a wind-up. You didn't see Jeremy Beadle lurking anywhere, did you? I am not being entirely facetious when I say this: you didn't actually see the police (or should I say "police"), after all. What's more, I can't believe they would actually question you over the phone. Nor can I believe they would reveal so much of what they knew - why would they do that?

There are some unknowns in the whole saga: X had "only just met" the American? Where - in the street? I just find it a bit of a stretch that X bumps into a complete stranger, a foreigner, one minute and the next he's in a round with him down at his local. I can imagine, nonetheless, that others may find this situation quite plausible.

When the American left the pub, did he leave alone or with X? Where was he staying?

I'm not having a go at you - merely trying to get my head around the details and the possibilities.

If the police were genuine (and I am minded to say they were, despite their unorthodox mode of questioning), my money is on their being tipped off by someone who overheard the conversation. Given that there have been two high profile terrorism cases in Newcastle recently, they would have had to have taken the "ricin" conversation seriously. And there's another thing: you're in a pub, being friendly with a foreigner you've just met. What do you talk about? The weather, sport, what the local area has to offer, ricin. Wait, what? I think alarms bells would have been ringing in my head at that point, to be honest.

Anyway, please let us know if you hear anything further about this most interesting incident.

By chance I bumped into X and the American last night.

I came out of the bookies over the road from the pub - having backed Boro to beat Man Utd - and X was talking to the American on the street corner.

The American told me that the police had visited him at his place of work - the large Pharmaceutical company he works for has a rather large factory in a town about half an hours drive away from where I live and where he is staying in a hotel.
He said they grilled him for about an hour before they were satisfied with his explanation that it was just a conversation in a pub the likes of which occur everyday / night in almost every pub and club across the UK.
They told him that they had received a 'tip-off' from a concerned member of the public and due to the high terror footing this country are currently on they have a duty to act upon such information.
They then thanked him for his cooperation and apologised for any inconvenience they had caused the American.

And that was that.

When I was speaking to both X and the American they both seemed to be rather stressed about the whole incident and both were visibly shaken when I actually spoke the word 'Ricin'.
I laughed and said 'don't worry, there's no microphones on street corners recording everyone's conversations' but they were in no way re-assured.

The American said he had spoke to his girlfriend back home in the US and she was a bit frightened but he refused to give her all the details and told her she would have to wait till he got back home.
Again I laughed and tried to allay his worries by saying it was all finished with now but he wasn't having any of it.

I told him that I'd never experienced or even heard of anything like it before in the UK and that I didn't think it was representative of everyday British life.
We aren't spied on every minute of every day......but privately I'm not exactly certain of that now.

He said he will pop in the pub to see me before he goes home and we parted on friendly terms....he even seemed to raise some sort of dry smile.

Was it two random strangers who reported a conversation they'd overheard and misunderstood?
Was it two undercover police officers who'd overheard something of concern?
Or was the American under observation due to the nature of his job and his travels within the UK?

All raise further questions.

But that's the end of things, allegedly.
I doubt we'll ever know all the circumstances surrounding this.....but one thing is certain, I'm going to be a bit more circumspect about what I talk about and with whom in pubs / clubs from now on because you just never know who is listening!

I don'

a reply to: Freeborn

What a horrifying example of social conditioning.

The system goes through a dry run.

The American goes back across the water.

And crucially,

. . . they both seemed to be rather stressed about the whole incident and both were visibly shaken when I actually spoke the word 'Ricin'.

The terror is unleashed.


Who's for a facebook campaign to make my 'Ricin' song the Christmas number one?

It goes like this . . .

Ricin ricin ricin ricin ricin ricin Oh! Oh!

Ricin ricin ricin ricin ricin ricin Oh!

Riiiiiciiiiiiin!

Riiiiiciiiiin!

Ricin ricin Oh!

The chorus is pretty much the same.

a reply to: Freeborn

Thanks for letting us know how it turned out. This has been the most intriguing thread in a long time. It probably is the end of the matter at this end. However, if the British police have been in conversation with US Homeland Security at any stage, you can bet that the American's cards are well and truly marked once he gets back home. Paddy Power wouldn't even give you odds-on for that!

a reply to: lacrimoniousfinale

I actually said jokingly to the American, who I shall now refer to as C as I now know his name, that his card will be marked and Homeland Security will be keeping tabs on him when he gets home. He nearly crapped himself and he replied 'Do you really think so'?
I casually laughed it off and said 'no, of course they won't'....but who knows?

I can see the funny side of it all now - a massive mountain made out of a very small molehill - but it does raise some interesting questions.