Social Democracy Is 100% American

originally posted by: onequestion
a reply to: FyreByrd

Weather or not it's built into this country I believe in the principle of it.

It's time to start changing anyway.

It's takes fewer and fewer people to produce more and more goods.

Why are we still living in the 1920's?

You realize your preaching to the choir right?

Have you been paying attention to the Billionaires and what they are saying about robots and artificial intelligence?

Now take a look at the "Georgia Guidestones"!

Communism, Capitalism, Socialism, are nothing more than distractions from the slavery we will all face when the elite have their way with "GLOBALISM"!

a reply to: seeker1963

I know I find it totally asinine when people talk about skills and wages and jobs.

It's clear to see for anyone who isn't looking for confirmation bias that we are entering well hell we have been in new territory all century with technological advancements. It's just a matter of time. We should be discussing how we are going to implement these things rather than if we are going to because there either be upheaval or change.

originally posted by: onequestion
a reply to: seeker1963

I know I find it totally asinine when people talk about skills and wages and jobs.

It's clear to see for anyone who isn't looking for confirmation bias that we are entering well hell we have been in new territory all century with technological advancements. It's just a matter of time. We should be discussing how we are going to implement these things rather than if we are going to because there either be upheaval or change.

Well in certain areas automation and robotics will take over, in many fields they can be more accurate and work in conditions that are harmful to people.

But we have vaste areas of prouductive work that are better served by skilled labor - such as healthcare, farming, teaching and all creative endeavors. In these 'service to others' domains most workers are undertrainted and underpaid. We need to provide the training and wages to bring people into these fields.

Skilled labor jobs - the traditional ones as well as the 'white collar' ones. Customer service, plumbing, computer services, painting, etc. None of those things can be 'well done' with automation or robots no matter how 'fancy'. The human touch has value and needs to be compensated adequately.

I wrote a paper years ago about "High Tech requires High Touch" that the more we rely on technological answers the more we become isolated from other people and the world. We need to include human interactions and interaction with nature as part of our daily lives.

I'm drifting here....

I don't think technology is THE answer; I think it can be a very useful part of the multiple answers necessary for a 21st century society.

a reply to: FyreByrd
In all honesty, there is no such thing as unskilled labour. People love to talk down on "unskilled labour" as if they are subhuman garbage, but I challenge these morons to live without the "subhumans" for a few months. Without "unskilled labour" that a lot spit on, the western world would come to a screeching hault. I wish it would happen soon, a huge "unskilled labour" protest. I am personally "skilled labour", but I have worked "unskilled labour" jobs before. I was illegally running wendy's drive through at night on school nights, for minimum wage. At the time I thought it was awesome, got to do what I wanted, got paid, got to work way more hours than I was supposed to on school nights. Knowing what I know now, I was taken advantage of, earning minimum wage, while doing management's job, other than counting money, which was all management was doing while I ran the place lol. I also made that same mistake running macy's night crew in receiving the year after that, but for a whole dollar more per hour than minimum wage. Damn idiot kid I was.

a reply to: TKDRL

But the only value is in the perceived skill and not in the service it provides the community.

They all take grocery shopping for granted. Imagine if they had to close all the grocery stores>

a reply to: onequestion
It's retarded, I guess most people that think that way have never had a garden, or relied on hunting, personal livestock, and fishing as their sole source of protein

a reply to: TKDRL

Oh please stop. I'm having to actually think for a split half a billisecond in order to understand your post!

a reply to: onequestion
Sorry, had a bit too much firewater lol. But seriously, any employer that thinks they can do without any employee, why did they hire them in the first place? Because they didn't want to do that job themself of course. Pay them a living wage, or do that # yourself! Simple concept I think, and no amount of namecalling like unskilled is gonna change that. Don't want to pay a man/woman enough to clean your bathrooms to live on their own? Do it yourself then! Argh, the logic is killing the economic vampires I bet lol.

I appreciate the thought provoking topic and civil discourse of this OP. I don't like the idea of socialism because it doesn't fit my ideas of personal responsibility and how I want to live. It is far to invasive in to lives of people that want to live free from Government. My concerns are that I will be forced to live in and participate in your society. I like the idea of leaving someplace like Alaska available for people who still want to live free.

a reply to: TKDRL

Please stop. Your making to much sense for me.

Oh its killing me.

originally posted by: TKDRL
a reply to: FyreByrd
In all honesty, there is no such thing as unskilled labour. People love to talk down on "unskilled labour" as if they are subhuman garbage, but I challenge these morons to live without the "subhumans" for a few months. Without "unskilled labour" that a lot spit on, the western world would come to a screeching hault. I wish it would happen soon, a huge "unskilled labour" protest. I am personally "skilled labour", but I have worked "unskilled labour" jobs before. I was illegally running wendy's drive through at night on school nights, for minimum wage. At the time I thought it was awesome, got to do what I wanted, got paid, got to work way more hours than I was supposed to on school nights. Knowing what I know now, I was taken advantage of, earning minimum wage, while doing management's job, other than counting money, which was all management was doing while I ran the place lol. I also made that same mistake running macy's night crew in receiving the year after that, but for a whole dollar more per hour than minimum wage. Damn idiot kid I was.

I stand corrected, and embarrassed you are 100% correct that no labor is 'unskilled'. Thank you for pointing out my used of 'language' designed to demean and belittle.

Again thank you.

originally posted by: Metallicus
I appreciate the thought provoking topic and civil discourse of this OP. I don't like the idea of socialism because it doesn't fit my ideas of personal responsibility and how I want to live. It is far to invasive in to lives of people that want to live free from Government. My concerns are that I will be forced to live in and participate in your society. I like the idea of leaving someplace like Alaska available for people who still want to live free.

Other people may have more generous ideas of 'personal responsibilty' that include being responsible for others in the community as well. I feel a personal responsibilty to care for the less fortunate regardless of the reason. I'm not opposed to private 'charities' but those often come with 'requirements' for service and I want the services to be available to all.

Social democrary is about getting personal/religious/corporate, etc agenda out of the business of caring for the well-being of ALL citizens of a society.

Idealistic - yes. Worth striving for - a resounding yes. Necessary for survival - undoubtedly.

I always thought that socialism was the best, most ideal system on paper.

It's when you add a corrupt system, corrupt leadership and a population that is growing more entitlement-minded, that it falls apart.

a reply to: beezzer
Socialism works great, on a small scale. I live in a small ass town, there is a lot of socialism that goes on, though those that live here would dare not call it that. A neighbor has some catastrophe happen, we help. I guess it's not the same as socialism perse, as it is all voluntary. For example, when grandma died, we didn't have to cook a meal for weeks. People just kept bringing food. A neighbor lost his wife, same deal. Hell, I even stopped by a few times with a big ass bottle of shine to keep him company for the night. A neighbor will never starve or freeze here due to hardship. Sounds a lot like socialism eh?

a reply to: FyreByrd
I try to watch my language, I did a lot of NLP type study. I think destructive language has a lot to do with what is wrong with our world, no proof on that of course, just seems to make sense to me. Even though I try to watch what I say, I still can't always stop myself from using retarded in a derogatory sense sometimes

a reply to: TKDRL

Being neighborly, being a good person, helping people in your community isn't socialism.

I see socialism as something that isn't voluntary.

It is dictated, demanded, determined by the state.

a reply to: beezzer
Yeah, I guess ultimately, you are right. It kinda sucks that some communities are so #ty, that they need to have a gun pointed at their face to do right. Or maybe that is the biggest problem, that the threat of violence is actually not needed at all. Who knows anymore.

originally posted by: TKDRL
It kinda sucks that some communities are so #ty, that they need to have a gun pointed at their face to do right.

This is a truth that many choose to ignore.

For example, a lot of people complain about government oversight, like the EPA, forcing companies to keep things clean but the reason it even exists is because some companies could not police themselves. It took the threat of force. What other option was there?

a reply to: daskakik
EPA lol.... They only bother with companies that don't pay them off. Legal distortion. I guess the same can be said about prettymuch every other government entity. They never stopped # from happening, they stopped # from happenning without paying them off first. Such a joke.

originally posted by: TKDRL
a reply to: daskakik
EPA lol....

It was just an example. You made the point and I was trying to back you up.