Complete Control...One Flag at a Time

First...this is not about the Confederate flag. Please read the whole rant if you are interested.

In addition to many things, I am not a racist, I am an American and I am a businessman who sells a musical product based upon graphic designs. I run a number of websites and sell products on Amazon and Ebay. Today...Amazon and Ebay removed a few of my products that feature the Confederate flag. No big deal...of the 1500 plus designs I offer, only 4 include the Confederate flag. That is about .003% of my products.

Here is the problem. A knee-jerk reaction to a horrible murder has caused the lemmings to jump off the cliff and (at least in my opinion) many people have decided to ban a flag instead of addressing the real problems with racism, hate, insanity and murder. And now I am a victim. No big deal...I haven't been injured badly by any means. But think about what has happened.

Flags are being taken down and people are being paid to do so. Places are being renamed and all the expense involved in that. And my little business has lost a few products...not by my choice. I wasn't asked if I would remove them...I wasn't consulted about why I'm selling them...I wasn't even informed that they were removed. I can't blame Amazon or Ebay too badly because they are just businesses reacting to a misguided mass-insanity that believes by removing a flag, they are somehow fixing a problem. It doesn't work that way.

Nazis exist even though no one flies the Nazi flag. Hate exists even though no one wears KKK garb or burns crosses. Destroying a symbol doesn't do anything, anymore than terrorists burning the American flag does something.

But here is the real problem. Because of the structure of our business and government in America, businesses and the government have to power to meddle in my business. Yes...I maintain a website to sell my products but that is beside the point. What happens when "they" decide the American flag is bad? When the Catholic Cross is bad, sugar is bad, soda is bad, fatty food is bad...or that anything the citizens of the USA believe in or support is bad? It can all go away in a few days because of the power we have given these entities. That is scary!

How far is that really from a dictatorship? How far is that from complete control of the citizens? You may believe that "this is only a little thing that most people don't care about". Fine...but that is how it starts. Ban smoking to applause...then ban soda and who knows what else. How about ban conservative beliefs? How about banning the American flag and making a new flag...and we know no one would consult us on the design.

Our government...the corporations we frequent have far too much control over our lives. Health care, taxes, property rights, etc. We the citizens of the US have set ourselves up to be conquered simply and in one swoop.

a reply to: WeAreAWAKE

Imagine that, we posted the same topics at the same time. Thank God I'm not the only one who sees that us Americans are sick of this crap.

In a similar post i talked about how america is young, and it has knee jerk reactions that are typical of a teenager.
Once again, i am not saying that out of some sense of european superiority, we all know how many problems we have on this side of the world.
But america reacts to things with an all or nothing approach that is typical of impulsive teenagers, and much like you said, these things don't fix the real problem, they just feed the illusion of something being done so everyone feels happy about themselves.
This "destroy the flag" thing that has been going on is much like a kid that doesn't want his parents to know he's smoking, so brushes his teeth right after but doesn't bother to air out the room.
It's a matter of giving out an immediate appearance of "doing the right thing" while the problem is still hanging in the air.
The country is still finding itself, it's still growing up, and until that happens, these kind of reactions are to be expected.

a reply to: WeAreAWAKE

The US government has nothing to do with Amazon or any other retailer deciding to stop selling the confederate flag. I don't think there were even any petitions asking them to. In each case it was a business decision. Retailers work off of demand but also trends and this trend was obvious and they got out ahead of it. Perhaps people would have started petitioning them to stop selling anything with that flag on it, as it's consumers right to... either way the choice was theirs to make.

I'm sure you can capitalize on the situation though. Sell your items at a flea market or something.

a reply to: WeAreAWAKE

I completely agree with your statement, aside from in one particular.

People DO wear hoods and dress up like spooks, and the KKK is an existent thing. Some people DO fly all manner of clearly racist banners, logos, tattoos, car decals, and so on and so forth. There ARE people out there who take any and every opportunity to disrupt, and dissolve interracial unity wherever they go. It is cracking down on these people, not removing symbolism, which will have the greatest effect on unity going forward, not the banning of a culturally important flag, or the renaming of a huge plethora of locations and businesses.

Hurt the racists, and only the racists, and the tension level will collapse into obscurity. Mess around on the edges, and the problem will only become worse.

Anything you post or sell on the internet usually has terms and conditions regarding hate, racism etc that you may or may not have read at the time you chose to post the items to sell. That might be where your consent or lack thereof is to be found and noted.

I don't know, I'm just guessing, since it's the general rules with everything else online , like YouTube.
I don't personally care about this or any other flag but if it offends , it offends and there's other regulations that come into play regarding that matter.

Things get banned all the time. It's not a new idea. Of course I agree in all fairness, how were you to predict this one? That's just the nature of business though, things fall out of fashion.


Like the other guy said. There's people out there that want them. Sell at flea markets. Banned items are a hot ticket. Soon before there's a new law banning distribution of them .

I had a thread on this and people were offended that I didn't go along with the pathetically....er politically correct thing to do. Taking away a symbol will change nothing. It will make some folks happy, make them think they did something about the problem, but that's all it is, a balm to make them feel better and they can say "Look What We Did"!! and then move on to their next Cause Du Jour.

a reply to: WeAreAWAKE

I actually think we're quite close to having a dictatorship. The current tyrant keeps giving himself more and more powers. With this fast track thing for the TPP that they snuck in the other day while the hubbub over the Battle Flag of Northern Virginia (so-called Confederate flag) I think we're a step closer.

You decided to sell products with the confederate flag graphic, because you thought it was advantageous for your business.

These companies decided not to sell products with the confederate flag graphic because they thought it was not advantageous for their business.

originally posted by: Kali74
a reply to: WeAreAWAKE

The US government has nothing to do with Amazon or any other retailer deciding to stop selling the confederate flag. I don't think there were even any petitions asking them to. In each case it was a business decision. Retailers work off of demand but also trends and this trend was obvious and they got out ahead of it. Perhaps people would have started petitioning them to stop selling anything with that flag on it, as it's consumers right to... either way the choice was theirs to make.

I'm sure you can capitalize on the situation though. Sell your items at a flea market or something.

You seriously don't think that these giant conglomerates like eBay, Amazon and Walmart don't have a good supply of high level politicians in their pockets?

originally posted by: Skid Mark
a reply to: WeAreAWAKE

I actually think we're quite close to having a dictatorship. The current tyrant keeps giving himself more and more powers. With this fast track thing for the TPP that they snuck in the other day while the hubbub over the Battle Flag of Northern Virginia (so-called Confederate flag) I think we're a step closer.

I don't know if we're headed to a dictatorship or not, but....we are living through and witnessing Obama's and the Elites fundamental transformation of "America". Its difficult to describe what we're seeing emerge, but as the TPA and TPP proceed to passage and as the institutions they create come into existence, we're going to see the Globalization of Government functions and the abandonment of a huge chunk of US Sovereignty. So, for example, if what I've been reading is correct, (and it may not be), issues of US Immigration Law and Policy will be turned over to some International panel or commission.

While this is happening, we're seeing a sea change in the overturning of the previous, largely "white" US Over culture. In a sense, we're witnessing cultural suicide. So for example, today they will remove the Confederate Flag from the accepted "public square", but tomorrow, they may well demolish the Jefferson Memorial in DC.
www.latimes.com...

My question is....the Jefferson Memorial? Why stop there? What about George Washington, did he own slaves? Wait a minute. Didn't most of the Founders own slaves? Maybe the whole institution of the US Gov't is illegitimate!

I'm beginning to wonder if in the end, this all might not be a good thing.
First, the adoption of TPA and TPP will essentially pass a lot of legislative and legal authority away from Congress and over to an International body that will set many of the Labor Laws and Immigration and Trade Laws for the US. This will force huge changes in the US. So for example, and employer like Google will now have unlimited access to H1B visa candidates for employment. They'll no longer be constrained to hire mostly US born people who are...generally speaking only fluent in one language. Having access to dual language or multi-lingual candidates will hugely expand Google's ability to penetrate foreign markets.

What that will mean is that more and more US employers will start demanding or requiring, at minimum, dual language proficiency and that will change the entire US education system. Several school districts in Texas now have dual immersion policies such that english only speakers are started off in Spanish only class rooms and vica versa. That should be expanded and mandated across the US in my opinion. Then as well, this will facilitate the offshoring of another huge problem, i.e. the spiraling cost of higher education because this would encourage policies that encourage US born College bound students to seek College educations overseas. They may or may not return, but I can see the day when a US born person graduates College in Mumbai and goes to work for Google in Singapore rather than being limited to having to work in the US. As well, US employers may well prefer US born graduates of foreign universities; we may see John Deer now setting up recruitment stations in Brazil.

As for the new "US Overculture"? I don't think it will be so much based upon "white privilege" as it is based upon International "fluency" and background. That's a complex subject to deal with but...there's a huge number of people in the US and the world that are called "Third Culture" people, or "Third Culture" kids. You can read about them here:en.wikipedia.org...

Barak Obama, and now Ted Cruz are examples of Third Culture kids. I'm a third culture kid, (adult). One of the distinguishing features of many TCK's is that they don't have any particular allegiance or alignment with any one country or culture. I think we're going to see them begin to take control at both the Government level and at the Corporate level and as they do, the traditions and trappings of that which had been the US "Culture" and of the US "Overculture" will be relegated to the museums as a bad memory of white racism, not unlike the relegation of the Nazi culture to the annals of world history.

If I'm right in my perceptions, and if TPA/TPP are passed as I think they will, one thing is certainly true, IMHO, and that is that the 2016 Presidential election will be less and less relevant and as laws about eligibility for the position of President are changed, who knows.....maybe we'll see Fareed Zakaria make a run for the White Hut!

a reply to: WeAreAWAKE

Liberals all over America are telling everyone how and what they should think, feel and say ....................... or else!

a reply to: WeAreAWAKE

Seems Amazon is rather selective in their policing.


AMAZON BANS CONFEDERATE FLAGS, STILL SELLS NAZI MERCHANDISE

originally posted by: Bilk22
a reply to: WeAreAWAKE

Liberals all over America are telling everyone how and what they should think, feel and say ....................... or else!

I am doing no such thing. That statement is divisive and will make some feel unwelcome here.

originally posted by: Kali74
a reply to: WeAreAWAKE

The US government has nothing to do with Amazon or any other retailer deciding to stop selling the confederate flag. I don't think there were even any petitions asking them to. In each case it was a business decision. Retailers work off of demand but also trends and this trend was obvious and they got out ahead of it. Perhaps people would have started petitioning them to stop selling anything with that flag on it, as it's consumers right to... either way the choice was theirs to make.

I'm sure you can capitalize on the situation though. Sell your items at a flea market or something.

No need for a flea market...I just incorporated more confederate flag designs (actually a big seller) and opened a new page full of them. But thanks for the suggestion.

originally posted by: violet
Anything you post or sell on the internet usually has terms and conditions regarding hate, racism etc that you may or may not have read at the time you chose to post the items to sell. That might be where your consent or lack thereof is to be found and noted.

I don't know, I'm just guessing, since it's the general rules with everything else online , like YouTube.
I don't personally care about this or any other flag but if it offends , it offends and there's other regulations that come into play regarding that matter.

Things get banned all the time. It's not a new idea. Of course I agree in all fairness, how were you to predict this one? That's just the nature of business though, things fall out of fashion.


Like the other guy said. There's people out there that want them. Sell at flea markets. Banned items are a hot ticket. Soon before there's a new law banning distribution of them .

Basically here is how that worked. The confederate flag was just fine a few days or so ago. This event happened and all of a sudden it was taboo. If something is racist (for example) it was...is...and will be. It doesn't become so overnight. The only thing that happens overnight is opinion. And opinion doesn't change reality.

originally posted by: Wetpaint72
You decided to sell products with the confederate flag graphic, because you thought it was advantageous for your business.

These companies decided not to sell products with the confederate flag graphic because they thought it was not advantageous for their business.

Yes...you are correct and they can choose what they do and don't want to sell. But they have not only been selling it for three years, but they approached me and set-up my products on Amazon. There was no problem until this horrible event. FYI.

originally posted by: Bilk22
a reply to: WeAreAWAKE

Seems Amazon is rather selective in their policing.


AMAZON BANS CONFEDERATE FLAGS, STILL SELLS NAZI MERCHANDISE

Hmmm...new product line to replace the one they took down? JUST KIDDING!!!