Homeless people to be fined up to £1,000 for sleeping rough.

a reply to: lordcomac
There are MORE than enough criminals in the UK to help "make money" for the powers that be. They don't need homeless people to do that. Plus they won't be incarcerated long enough to make this so called profit

originally posted by: rossacus
a reply to: lordcomac
There are MORE than enough criminals in the UK to help "make money" for the powers that be. They don't need homeless people to do that. Plus they won't be incarcerated long enough to make this so called profit

Oh, I dunno, how much money does it cost to process these statutory fines? I wouldn't mind betting that it's private companies that have the contract for the administration side of this.
There's a huge pool of tax money to be siphoned off in admin fees etc even if the recipient of the fine hasn't any money to pay.

a reply to: SprocketUK

So provide more jobs and reduce the probability of more people being homeless?

a reply to: rossacus

That won't help the poor folks relying on the income from these shady practices for their new jag or holiday home in the Algarve, will it?

originally posted by: rossacus
a reply to: grainofsand
You would be distraught if your job security was jeopardised to fund people, who 90% of them, have made poor choices throughout life.

Nope, I was made redundant myself 8 years ago when the central government grant was cut for the main advice agency we know and love in the UK.
Picked myself up and moved on.

If that is what the people of Hackney want then so be it.
I'm glad my community cares about our homeless population though, I spent 6 months on the streets as a 16 year old in the days when there were no support services, I know the difference such things make.
And yep, sorry for the bin men who lost their jobs, but they'd get housing benefit for their rent, and can jump straight into agency work if they want to.
Plenty of crap work around, just ask anyone from Eastern Europe here who finds it quite easily.

a reply to: grainofsand

the only answer really is for the entire population of the homeless in London , gravitate towards hackney... don't like the homeless do they ? im sure the homeless could make quite an amusing stand

funbox

a reply to: funbox

I think if I was homeless in Hackney I would just move to the nearest local authority which wouldn't punish me for sleeping in a public place.
I think London is one of the worst choices to move to if one is homeless though, massively expensive rents for a start.
UK benefits are set at a national rate so your money can go a lot further 'in the regions'. When I ran away from South Wales aged 16, London was the last place on my mind and I ended up here on the coast of SW England.
Plenty of places free from people to sleep safely, friendly and helpful police, and importantly cheap rented rooms to find.

At that time my weekly benefits were about £25 per week and the cheapest rented room was £45 per week but they all wanted 4 weeks rent in advance to provide enough time for housing benefits to be awarded after moving in.
It took 6 months for me to save up £200 and stay alive on £25 per week, but once I got my tiny little room (an address) I was working washing up in a hotel within a week.

I passionately support homeless hostels and outreach services so others find it easier to get out of their hole in life.
...even if it puts my local taxes up by a small amount.

a reply to: grainofsand
If you are homeless looking for money (alot resort to begging to eat/survive, understandable ) London is the place to beg. People make careers out of begging, one recently could afford a chip and pin device and begged in Mayfair. He earned more in a week than I ever could. People in London have more sense than money, I. E giving money to a begger with a chip and pin device.

a reply to: grainofsand

why? their not goats? Hackney council herders , the H.C.H should be ashamed of themselves , recall this nonsense and deal with their people in their own district , are they special in some way ? Hackneys , homeless .. not in hackney they're not.

they should all be capped for voting it in , and not a wage cap ethier .. or something placed by a tripod

funbox

a reply to: rossacus
I guess that is why I didn't move to London then, I have never begged in my life. I came close to it once, freezing cold in February (I stupidly ran away in January) but I just couldn't do it.

My routine was wake up cold, walk to a public toilet which had hot showers for twenty pence, walk to the job centre and apply for jobs I knew I wouldn't get because I had no address, but it was a requirement to get my £25 a week benefits, then food at a cheap cafe, then hours reading in the public library before going back to my sleeping place.

Personally, I can't imagine anywhere worse in the UK to be homeless than London, but then as I said, I've never begged off anybody.

a reply to: grainofsand

Plenty of jobs , just the beneath us mentality and benefit culture that detracts us from hard working ( more about today's youth).

I'm glad you were fortunate enough to be able to move on, others living from paycheck to paycheck won't be as fortunate.

I am concerned about your point that adleast the bin men can receive benefit for rent. That sort of mentality is crippling Britain, adleast someone will pay for it at the expense of others. You know more than anyone most probably that to a man of the house, providing for your family independently is a priority and to many traditionalist, a sign of character.

Can I ask where your from. The fact that your shelters are sustainable leads me to believe you don't live in a high density population, high living cost area like hackney

a reply to: grainofsand

That's good to hear, no matter how bad it got your morals remained intact. Fair play to you. You were fortunate enough not to have a substance addiction and allocate your money properly to be alive today.

a reply to: funbox

I see what you're saying but if I was homeless in Hackney their new rules would be successful in moving me on.
I'd want to try rebuild my life in a place without added problems such as punishment for sleeping in public places.

...but if my local council tried it on here there would be many people such as myself protesting outside the town hall and calling them out as scum. I've never been a member of any activism type group but I have tagged along with any demonstration or protest which I agree with, locally and nationally.

a reply to: grainofsand

fair play to you , let them protests boards give them what for, lets your voice burn their receptive ears , as I sit here listening to this # itv news broadcast *content less and without detail* , I hear osborns wielding the axe again ...

what a truthful metaphor ,, *nose rub nose rub*

o how those protest boards scream them to sense

sorry about the cynicism, mass protests to me, is like shouting at the sea to stop making that irritating sloshing sound

ah , that's what osbournes doing , the rest of the royal mail up for grabs to the shareholders* , conservative does what conservative does

funbox

*not really the public now are they

a reply to: andy06shake

Just when i thought the world had shown me everything, some genius comes up with this ridiculous twaddle.

This world gets denser by the hour.

originally posted by: rossacus
The fact that your shelters are sustainable leads me to believe you don't live in a high density population, high living cost area like hackney

Lol, of course, even our biggest city in the South West (Plymouth) has less people living in it than Hackney, and yep our rent prices are much lower, couldn't that be said about pretty much everywhere in Britain outside of London though.

Our shelters are not 'sustainable' as such either, they depend on a mixture of donations by local people, and a direct grant from the local authority, ultimately funded by local taxpayers. All staff are volunteers except for the mental health nurses and the weekly doctor service.
When the beds are full, or if homeless folk are intoxicated then they can sleep in a relatively safe space outside with cover from the rain and free blankets/tea/soup. The hostel and outreach service has a high resettlement rate, and to me, is the best way of tackling homelessness than just punishing them for sleeping in a public space.

If the people of Hackney want to punish folk for sleeping rough then that is the choice of the people of Hackney, I'm just glad we have volunteer outreach workers instead who direct our homeless to the 'safe place' away from tourists, then try to help them.
Our communities socially/economically/environment wise are apples and oranges of course, but that explains why I've never ever wanted to live in London.

a reply to: funbox

Ah, I understand your sentiments but I look at it this way, the day we all stop shouting is the day we've all given up.
I will never stop shouting when something needs to be shouted about.

I was a fox hunt saboteur in the 90's and attended protests in London, we got a partial victory there, but be sure that without direct action and protest many foxes would be cruelly chased and killed to this day.
Apathy stops nothing, but direct action and protest sometimes can. At least when I die I know I did everything I could about the things I cared about.

a reply to: grainofsand

I passionately support homeless hostels and outreach services so others find it easier to get out of their hole in life.

Absolutely.

...even if it puts my local taxes up by a small amount.

What constitutes a small amount? Not that I necessarily disagree, but one persons small amount, is another persons cause for revolution...

originally posted by: seagull
What constitutes a small amount? Not that I necessarily disagree, but one persons small amount, is another persons cause for revolution...

Valid question, just checked, and the grant provided by my local council to help fund the homeless hostel and outreach service is 0.05% of the total council budget.
I pay Council Tax of just under £1000 per year so by my sums the homeless cost me 50 pence a year. I'd be happy to double it to a pound a year.

a reply to: grainofsand

OK. that's a small amount to me, too... No revolution today.

Seriously though, a hostel accompanied by counselling, and/or job training. Or even work in exchange for a safe place to sleep wouldn't be that expensive.

We aren't talking about five star accommodations here. Just warm, and safe where one can get a hot meal, a shower as needed.