Bernie Sanders Raises $1.5 Million on First Day of Campaign

a reply to: PublicOpinion

Poverty does exist! Please don't mistake my take on my experience as saying it does not, that was never intended. To say that Europeans are somehow more 'poor' than Americans is kind of laughable.

Can you, perhaps, discuss some of the downsides for America to being more like Northern and Western Europe?

Bernie Sanders: What’s Wrong With Being More Like Scandinavia?

“I can hear the Republican attack ad right now,” Mr. Stephanopolous said Sunday morning on “This Week.” “He wants America to look more like Scandinavia.”

“That’s right,” he said. “That’s right. What’s wrong with that? What’s wrong when you have more income and wealth equality. What’s wrong when they have a stronger middle class in many ways than we do, a higher minimum wage than we do and they’re stronger on the environment than we are.”

a reply to: links234
Thanks for the reply, I agree. Dind't intend to suggest Europeans are poorer than Americans either, seems like a pointless discussion to me anyway. Laughable indeed, you nailed it.

Can you, perhaps, discuss some of the downsides for America to being more like Northern and Western Europe?

Scandinavia? Where exactly? Iceland did a marvellous job not bailing out their banks, priceless!

Iceland’s commitment to its program, a decision to push losses on to bondholders instead of taxpayers and the safeguarding of a welfare system that shielded the unemployed from penury helped propel the nation from collapse toward recovery, according to the Washington-based fund.

www.bloomberg.com...

Sweden was once what Norway somehow managed to keep (thanks to lots of oil), that's how I would describe their transition in the last years.

Sweden once had a reputation as some kind of ‘social-democratic model’ with far-reaching public services and social support. But that has been dismantled by two decades of attacks – what the Economist magazine calls a ‘silent revolution’

www.socialistworld.net...

But Western Europe? Nah... we successfully applied Brave New World economics with a fresh round quantitative easing while harassing our southern partners with neoliberal austerity cuts, so they just have to watch how refugees die in the Mediterranean Sea due to the lack of funds for a real navy to pick anybody up with.

Debt-ridden Italy of all countries showed the EU how to act after a boat capsized off the coast of the Italian island of Lampedusa in October 2013. Italian navy ships then started patrolling sea routes between North Africa and southern Europe as part of their "Mare Nostrum" operation. Even though Italy was able to save thousands of people from drowning, other European member states didn't want to help pay the 108 million euros ($117 million) needed annually to keep operations going.

www.dw.de...

One could actually think we Europeans are just a bunch of insane misanthropes...

Iceland, Bernie - not Sweden!

originally posted by: links234

originally posted by: bigrex
I was in France, many are poor due to high taxes, but it is that way all over Europe...

This is off-topic but, could you define 'poor' for me? I'm of the understanding that most of Western and Northern Europe have fairly high standards of living, meaning many are well educated and few go without a meal on a regular basis. I've spent some time in Germany and my experience didn't tell me the people there were 'poor.'

Relatively speaking they are rich, true, but I am saying in comparison to the average American. For instance, in most of America, you can get much more for your money when it comes to acreage and price per square foot in a home.

originally posted by: BuzzyWigs
a reply to: bigrex

Socialists are seen right along with murderers, bankers, and bank robbers here in America.

And that is the most ignorant, unsophisticated, blind, poorly educated, and unaware thing about this stupid-ass country.

Heh, quoting ol' Winston Churchill, "Winston Churchill once said... socialism only works in two places... Heaven where it is not needed... and Hell where they already have it! LOL!" But I will admit, socialism does sound grand if it actually worked, I actually have no problem with people making similar wages and salaries across the board. It's just when you get men involved, specifically government (which is usually like a money bloated corporation on steroids), it's too easy to fleece the public and give you back a few cents on every dollar that was taxed/wrung out of the masses.

a reply to: bigrex

But I will admit, socialism does sound grand if it actually worked, I actually have no problem with people making similar wages and salaries across the board. It's just when you get men involved, specifically government (which is usually like a money bloated corporation on steroids), it's too easy to fleece the public and give you back a few cents on every dollar that was taxed/wrung out of the masses.

It does work, in Scandinavia. Democratic Socialism is a good system. Thanks for your response, though.

Yes, we'd need to clean house entirely if Sanders gets in, but I'm very happy that he's standing up and running - I watched an interview on some news show this morning, where he talks about it.

originally posted by: links234
a reply to: Dfairlite

Good question, even if you meant it as rhetorical...the answer is that Bernie would prefer that federal elections be publicly funded with no one candidate having more or less money than any other, which, in turn, would allow all candidates an equal chance at being elected based not on their donor base, but on their qualifications and the will of the people.

So the short answer is, yes, he would spread that $1.5 million if he could.

He could. He can make a donation to anyone he wants.

originally posted by: Tazkven
Bernie is the man. He is the only guy telling you exactly what his plans are. Don't believe him then look up his records and his votes. There is nothing anyone can say to take away from this man and his ideas could actually pull America out of the slump it is in, Lord knows the way we been going ain't working out to well.

This is one thing I absolutely respect about bernie. He comes right out and tells you just how crazy he is. Good on him. I can definitely respect the man. His ideas, not so much.

originally posted by: BuzzyWigs
a reply to: bigrex

Socialists are seen right along with murderers, bankers, and bank robbers here in America.

And that is the most ignorant, unsophisticated, blind, poorly educated, and unaware thing about this stupid-ass country.

How so, they take what you've earned under threat of kidnapping (which if you refuse they'll kill you), so they can give it to someone else who didn't earn as much. Well that's the theory, what they really do is the first part but then they keep a bunch of it for themselves.

They are thieves and would be murderers.

originally posted by: BuzzyWigs
a reply to: bigrex

But I will admit, socialism does sound grand if it actually worked, I actually have no problem with people making similar wages and salaries across the board. It's just when you get men involved, specifically government (which is usually like a money bloated corporation on steroids), it's too easy to fleece the public and give you back a few cents on every dollar that was taxed/wrung out of the masses.

It does work, in Scandinavia. Democratic Socialism is a good system. Thanks for your response, though.

Yes, we'd need to clean house entirely if Sanders gets in, but I'm very happy that he's standing up and running - I watched an interview on some news show this morning, where he talks about it.

Then move there. Why fight to change here when you could move to a place that has what you want?

For years I've been pushing for a program that would get people like Bernie out of here. If you want socialism, then by all means, move to a place that has it. The tax payers should foot the bill and the only requirements should be that you denounce your US citizenship (which you may never have back) and surrender all that you have (you can keep a weeks worth of clothes and some other essentials). The proceeds from selling your goods can go to the country which you are going to and as a thank you for leaving, we tax payers pay your ticket (maybe even your first months rent if you're good!).

But with no socialist ideas to fight about, what would politicians talk about? I mean, people don't want to vote for the guy who says "I won't change a thing" or "We're going to give your hard earned money back to you".

a reply to: Dfairlite

Why would after observing effective and successful government policies around the world would you just ignore them when we have so many problems here?

I'm not a Sanders supporter, its way to early to pick a candidate IMO.

I do love the topics he is running on though as I feel these are everyday topics that affect everyday Americans compared to religious freedom laws or more wars in the middle east.

originally posted by: LDragonFire
a reply to: Dfairlite

Why would after observing effective and successful government policies around the world would you just ignore them when we have so many problems here?

I'm not a Sanders supporter, its way to early to pick a candidate IMO.

I do love the topics he is running on though as I feel these are everyday topics that affect everyday Americans compared to religious freedom laws or more wars in the middle east.

Success is defined by the metrics you are measuring. I don't view Scandinavia as a success in pioneering the future of technology. I don't view Scandinavia as a place where I can build up wealth for myself and family. Scandinavia is definitely a success if I just wanted to float through life with a decent living and decent conditions. Scandinavia is like a nice farm, you can have a good life there if you just do what you're supposed to. I don't want to be a farm animal. I want to be free to make what I can of myself.

The fact that you look at one region as a success that everyone else should emulate is very typical of the socialist mind set. There should be different countries with different qualities and styles of government. Maybe I'm muslim and I want to live in a sharia country, would you recommend I push for that here or should I just head on over to Saudi Arabia? It takes all kinds to make up this world so stop trying to force your (not just you in particular) ideas onto everyone else when a place exists that has what you want. Take the initiative and go to that place.

Different strokes for different folks as the saying goes.

ETA: and before you ask if I think America should never change I'll say this: America was founded on a set of ideas, on a philosophy, and what we perceive as the appropriate way to achieve that philosophy is going to change. But there should be goals and metrics attached to every bill passed to measure the success of that bill and if the metrics do not show a bill to be successful, it should be eliminated. If the metrics are close then maybe a tweaking of the bill is in order. That's my opinion.

a reply to: links234

Fools must like wearing chains of apathy and ignorance. How does bigger government and less freedom equal being better for the average person.......Really how does a bigger nanny state help?



Progressive pipe dreams are all I see today. The citizens at the bottom demand action and boy the masters at the top will bring it. If people actually wanted change they would have voted for Mr. Paul. He would have actually brought change for the little guy. All the rest of the progressive leaders will only have you wear more chains. And I also believe both political parties are controlled by the same Oligarchy.

a reply to: Dfairlite

For years I've been pushing for a program that would get people like Bernie out of here. If you want socialism, then by all means, move to a place that has it.

I do not agree with what you have to say, but I'll defend to the death your right to say it.

Voltaire

Scandinavia is definitely a success if I just wanted to float through life with a decent living and decent conditions.

He who knows nothing is closer to the truth than he whose mind is filled with falsehoods and errors.

Jefferson

Well, Sanders would like to tax certain peoples at 90%, bless his heart (being fairly facetious),

louderwithcrowder.com... wants-to-tax-americans-at-90-his-reasoning-is-priceless/

He is getting much more support than I thought he would I heard he is at $4million with a average donation size at $42 each, plus 200k volunteers.

On CNN’s State Of The Union, Democratic presidential candidate Sen. Bernie Sanders (I-VT) announced that his presidential campaign against corporate greed, the attempted Koch hostile takeover of the government, and income inequality has now raised over $4 million from 100,000 contributors.

Bernie Sanders’ Koch Killing Movement Grows To $4 Million Raised and 100,000 Contributors

99% of all income being created is going to the 1% is a excellent talking point.

His donations will dry up as soon as the donors run out of tax refund money.

a reply to: xuenchen

Whatever.
That is SO not funny.

a reply to: Dfairlite

Then move there. Why fight to change here when you could move to a place that has what you want?

For years I've been pushing for a program that would get people like Bernie out of here.

LOL!!!!
Really?

Well, "for years I've been pushing" for everyone else who is NOT LIKE Bernie "to get out of here."

I can't "move there" because - I DON'T HAVE ENOUGH MONEY!!!!
Despite having an advanced degree, and so forth - yeah -

Let me tell you, I'd LOVE to move there - so - will you subsidize my departure?
You've already subsidized all the megacorps...how about little old me???

a reply to: LDragonFire

99% of all income being created is going to the 1% is a excellent talking point.

Ok, 99% taxes for the ultrarich 1% then. Sounds fair to me.