TPP vs. Democracy: Leaked Draft of Secretive Trade Deal Spells Out Plan for Corporate Power Grab

originally posted by: FyreByrd

originally posted by: greencmp

originally posted by: FyreByrd

originally posted by: greencmp

originally posted by: FyreByrd
Some Big Trans Pacific Partnership (plus 'fast-track' gang):

Senate Majority Leader Mitch McConnell (R-Ky.)

Committee chair Orrin Hatch (R-Utah),

Sen. Ron Wyden (D-Ore.)

and libertarian darling:

Meanwhile, House Ways and Means Committee chair Paul Ryan (R-Wisc.) pointed to two upcoming events—a visit to Washington, D.C., in late April by Japanese Prime Minister Shinzo Abe, and a ministerial meeting of the 12 Trans-Pacific Partnership countries in May—as reasons to push full steam ahead with Fast Track.

"We've got exterior deadlines that I think we need to be mindful of," Ryan told reporters last week.

www.commondreams.org...

For future reference, Paul Ryan is not a libertarian.

If I haven't communicated clearly I should reiterate that truly free trade requires no legislation, only the removal of obstacles to it.

Never in history has there been 'free trade' - it's a bloody myth, a nice story to tell around the fire, but a myth.

There actually was a near anarchy here in north america in the 17th century that lasted for 80 years and was the most successful colony as a result.

Holy Experiment

"If we will not be governed by God, we must be governed by tyrants."

-William Penn

I guess that would depend the definition of success. Thanks for the reference, I'll take a look at it.

Update after looking at the reference:

the experiment failed

And it could not really be labeled as anarchy when Penn owned all the land - he may have been a benevolent dictator but nonetheless a dictator. And they were following a set LAW as defined by Penn and the Quaker doctrine. It's called 'norms' and all groups have them - non written rules.

The Quaker's actually have an excellent 'governance' model they've been using for 350 years based on consensus. But it only works if all participants are school in it's methods and committed to following them even when they don't agree.

The closest I've seen to a working anarchic governance is Alcoholics Anonymous - and they are not a true anarchy either (though it really acts like one at some levels.

True, it was thwarted by external government, but it is the closest example I have been able to find of a state sized liberal government (minimal) which comes close to anarchic that existed in relatively modern times and in north america with clear evidence of viability.

I should point out that it is the free trade aspect that we are really talking about here which does not require political anarchy, only economic anarchy. By that measure it was a resounding success.

originally posted by: Flux8
a reply to: LewsTherinThelamon

It's simple. The people need to regulate their gov't, hence our democracy. That means we, the people, need to hold them accountable, and we have been failing miserably over the decades. I think I addressed your position in my post above, which was in regard to greencmp.

And how do we do that? You're not being very specific.

originally posted by: FyreByrd
Never in history has there been 'free trade' - it's a bloody myth, a nice story to tell around the fire, but a myth.

Singapore gets damn close. But they have some state intervention that keeps the whole thing running smooth.