Should we just focus on Building 7?

originally posted by: Anthem0
There is NO PROOF that a plane hit the Pentagon,

Except for the damage caused by a 757 sized aircraft,
except for the 757 fuselage parts found inside and outside the Pentagon,
except for the 757 engines found inside the Pentagon,
except for the 757 undercarriage and wheels found inside the Pentagon,
except for the 757 seats found inside the Pentagon,
except for the bodies and body parts from all passengers and crew of Flight 77 found inside the Pentagon,
except for luggage from Flight 77 found inside the Pentagon,
etc. etc.

So what evidence do you have that Flight 77 did not hit the Pentagon?

None at all.... which is why truthers are largely ignored.

a reply to: LaBTop

This thread is a great example of legimate issues with WTC7 and if anything it's already proven that NISTs investigations were flawed at best and possibly even criminal, at worst.

This thread is also a great example of trolls and their methods of deflecting away from the actual issues, some are even making stuff up, at least that's what it looks like, they could be mistaken but I know for a fact that there are trolls lurking in this thread.

DO NOT FEED THEM and do not listen to people who make claims with absolutely no links to at least substantiate what they say, if it isn't deliberate then it's just being damn lazy in whatever research you have done on the subject.

If you are truly interested and possibly even already skeptical of the officla version of events, then you could do a lot worse than checking out this thread.

originally posted by: Zcustosmorum
some are even making stuff up, at least that's what it looks like,

Care to list the things you claim people who you disagree with have made up? Unless.......

This is one example I think of what he's talking about. Except for photos of a few small pieces of fuselage and that one engine, the only proof you have of anything else you just listed is word of mouth. If you have more I'd love to go to a link, or see a photo. Anything besides a link to some interview with the DNA guy. That's the only other thing I've seen or heard. Y a reply to: hellobruce

originally posted by: hellobruce

originally posted by: Zcustosmorum
some are even making stuff up, at least that's what it looks like,

Care to list the things you claim people who you disagree with have made up? Unless.......

I wan't link verifications on EVERY point you just made, I look forward to it:

Except for the damage caused by a 757 sized aircraft, except for the 757 fuselage parts found inside and outside the Pentagon, except for the 757 engines found inside the Pentagon, except for the 757 undercarriage and wheels found inside the Pentagon, except for the 757 seats found inside the Pentagon, except for the bodies and body parts from all passengers and crew of Flight 77 found inside the Pentagon, except for luggage from Flight 77 found inside the Pentagon, etc. etc. So what evidence do you have that Flight 77 did not hit the Pentagon?

No linky then I'm not playing

originally posted by: TheBolt
the only proof you have of anything else you just listed is word of mouth.

So you really have not done any research on 9/11, apart from silly conspiracy theory sites. All the facts I stated have been shown here many times before.

originally posted by: TheBolt
This is one example I think of what he's talking about. Except for photos of a few small pieces of fuselage and that one engine, the only proof you have of anything else you just listed is word of mouth. If you have more I'd love to go to a link, or see a photo. Anything besides a link to some interview with the DNA guy. That's the only other thing I've seen or heard. Y a reply to: hellobruce

Precisely. That troll and his ilk know exactly what they're doing. They have no actual proof that anything they're saying in support of the OS is true and they know it. They'll scream til their blue in the face demanding proof and anti-proof of anything contradicting the proofless OS, but won't even blink at the notion that the "terrorists" (who they have NO PROOF of boarding the airplanes to begin with) just happened to fly in a route around the entire perimeter of the Pentagon and yet somehow managed to remain in a continuous blind spot the entire time, even unto the point of impact. They'll claim that none of the 80-something videos the government has admittedly logged but refuse to share with the public show an airplane during that entire descent and impact. But they don't actually believe it. It's just a method to control the discussion. That's how trolling works.

Stop feeding them, people. You're playing into their hands.

originally posted by: Anthem0
just happened to fly in a route around the entire perimeter of the Pentagon and yet somehow managed to remain in a continuous blind spot the entire time,

This again shows truthers have no clue at how things work, why do they think security camera's are set up to watch the sky?

They'll claim that none of the 80-something videos the government has admittedly logged but refuse to share with the public show an airplane during that entire descent and impact.

Please list these 80 odd video's, and again explain why you think video camera's are set up to watch the sky....

The actual trolls here are truthers that refuse to do any research at all, and refuse to look at any evidence that destroys their silly conspiracy theory.

Are you trying to tell me that you have seen photographic evidence of plane seats, bodies, etc yet you have no idea what 80 plus videos there are of the pentagon impact? And you have the nerve to tell me I haven't done my research. a reply to: hellobruce

originally posted by: TheBolt
you have no idea what 80 plus videos there are of the pentagon impact?

You obviously have done no research at all if you think there are 80 video's showing the impact of Flight 77 at the Pentagon - you still do not realise what video camera's are used for!

www.911myths.com...

I'll even give you a debunkers website just to show both sides talk about it. 911myths.com...

The debate started over the press release made by the FBI I believe, but it says this:

56 "of these videotapes did not show either the Pentagon building, the Pentagon crash site, or the impact of Flight 77 into the Pentagon on September 11."
Of the remaining 29 videotapes, 16 "did not show the Pentagon crash site and did not show the impact of Flight 77 into the Pentagon."
Of the 13 remaining tapes, 12 "only showed the Pentagon after the impact of Flight 77."
Only one tape showed the Pentagon impact: the Pentagon's own security camera footage, that would later be released.

Some understandably find it a touch fishy that only ONE video shows the impact site at the time of impact but still reveals nothing. You don't have to agree with it, but even the beginning researcher knows about these videos.

a reply to: hellobruce

originally posted by: TheBolt
you have no idea what 80 plus videos there are of the pentagon impact?

As I said, there are not 80+ video's of Flight 77's impact....

And you have the nerve to tell me I haven't done my research.

Funny how what you just posted shows that there are 80+ video's of Flight 77 hitting the Pentagon is just another truther lie.... so as we see you clearly have done no real research!

I'll take that link to the photos now. I'll settle for plane seats. a reply to: hellobruce

I didn't say they specifically showed an impact. Maybe someone else did. I said they had videos and CLAIM that only one showed it. You on the other hand said right out that you've seen photos of bodies, plane seats, etc INSIDE the pentagon "many times". Surely theN you can quickly find one, jus one, link to them? Even if that'sa reply to: hellobruce

originally posted by: TheBolt
I'll take that link to the photos now. I'll settle for plane seats. a reply to: hellobruce

Where exactly did I state there were photo's of seats? However, have a look at

www.vaed.uscourts.gov...

I didn't say they specifically showed an impact.

You said....

yet you have no idea what 80 plus videos there are of the pentagon impact?

originally posted by: TheBolt
You on the other hand said right out that you've seen photos of bodies, plane seats, etc INSIDE the pentagon "many times".

Where did I claim that?

a reply to: TheBolt

. You on the other hand said right out that you've seen photos of bodies, plane seats, etc INSIDE the pentagon "many times". Surely theN you can quickly find one, jus one, link to them?

If you only visit conspiracy sites . . . .
Try looking for real evidence.

Body Parts
Entire body
Entire body
Half a body

But you wont believe it because it contradicts you conspiracy belief.

a reply to: samkent

And those bodies are from the aircraft? Or pentagon workers who died as a result of the impact?

originally posted by: Flatcoat
a reply to: samkent

And those bodies are from the aircraft? Or pentagon workers who died as a result of the impact?

ww2.dcmilitary.com...

Its always the same on this forum, this thread is no different.

We are on page 21, have gone from a debate about WTC-7 to the attack on the pentagon and the OP has left the building. This happens on almost every thread on 9/11 and its getting rather dull we just seem to descended into this off-topic tit for tat debate that is never going to be won.

I often use the analogy of a bike chain to describe 9/11 conspiracies, each link represents another little bit of the grader theory that makes up the chain. For example thermite is on link, the "missing trillions" and "Northwoods" are all other little links in that chain. Once we (the real truthers, those who seek out the truth and not grandiose conspiracies) start to smash up those links the grand conspiracy becomes weaker but the man in the tin foil hat will just move onto another link in his chain. That is why we have gone from WTC-7 to the pentagon. It is also probably why the OP has left the building because his original OP was destroyed in the first few pages.

As a individual who has truly been researching the events of 9/11 for years now i find this pattern of behaviour very frustrating. The debates never change, there are probably hundreds of thread now on ATS were somebody eventually posts "what about the pentagon CCTV" like is some grand new discovery. As someone who has seen all these arguments before and debated them until i am blue in the face, this is getting very dull.

As I think i read another member on this thread saying, most of the time trying to argue against the 9/11 false flag conspiracy theorist is akin to trying to argue the creationist. It cannot be done, I find that for about 90% of "truthers" on this site they are beyond help, they have been fed off this idea that 9/11 was a false flag by their fellow conspiracy theorists for so long, that they base their world view around it. Trying to point out to them that actually WTC-7's collapse is explainable is just like trying to explain Darwinism to creationist who has built up a world few based on the existence of God.

Quite simply, those of you who are reading this and have spent your time on this thread rambling on about the speed at which WTC-7 fell or demanding to know why there is only one camera shot of AA-77 and were flight 93 wreckage ended up...... well you are in denial.

not a popular view I know, I know some of you will say "no its the OS who are in denial!" in a typical knee-jerk response but that does not make it any less true. The volume of evidence to back up the official story is immense, but so is the level of ignorance i see from both sides when it comes to 9/11 on these threads.