BATFE To Ban Common AR-15 Ammo

originally posted by: neo96
Wasn't aware that that ammo was such an issue.

Didn't make the main stream news fear mongering cycle.

The BATFE just makes it up as they go along.


Zeig Heil!

This rule change goes through it'll be a real big deal as it inherently affects somewhere over 5 million AR-15 and variant owners (I think the number is higher) that will suddenly wake up and discover that .223 rounds are either unavailable or prohibitively expensive. There will be a lot of angry voters on that day.

originally posted by: riffraff
I don't understand what I read about the 7.62x39 ammo.
That's what I shoot. Are you saying its illegal now?

That cheap Russian import 7.62x 39 will be now thanks to those idiots.

originally posted by: riffraff
I don't understand what I read about the 7.62x39 ammo.
That's what I shoot. Are you saying its illegal now?

Executive orders having to do with Russian sanctions have impacted imports and ATF as I understand has ruled steel core as armor piercing.

Reference the sidebar stories in the link in original OP and its detailed in one of the news updates.

a reply to: Phoenix

There will definitely be a lot of angry voters. But the question is, will it be too late? Obama definitely isn't worried about votes anymore. I don't really think he is much worried about how his actions will affect Democrat efforts in 2016.

That makes me wonder what, if anything, is planned and what's coming in 2016.

originally posted by: EternalSolace
a reply to: Phoenix

There will definitely be a lot of angry voters. But the question is, will it be too late? Obama definitely isn't worried about votes anymore. I don't really think he is much worried about how his actions will affect Democrat efforts in 2016.

That makes me wonder what, if anything, is planned and what's coming in 2016.

Yeah, I think many of his own party may not be to happy of late. In the larger picture this ban which is couched as rule making is but one of many actions that essentially negate the constitutional rights of citizens, patriot act renewal, NDAA, many executive orders couched as routine house keeping etc.

One thing sticks out to me on the ammo ban issue is that its making Thomas Jefferson's words ring very true,

""When governments fear the people, there is liberty. When the people fear the government, there is tyranny. The strongest reason for the people to retain the right to keep and bear arms is, as a last resort, to protect themselves against tyranny in government." - Thomas Jefferson

Are they afraid???

Time to go buy as much ammo as I can afford.......Again.......I wonder how much is sufficient, if SHTF and it is never again available. I need 7.62x39 and various loads of 12ga..

I probably have a couple thousand of the rifle ammo and maybe 1000 of the 12ga.

Maybe I have 20yrs of life left, maybe. lol

originally posted by: EternalSolace

originally posted by: riffraff
I don't understand what I read about the 7.62x39 ammo.
That's what I shoot. Are you saying its illegal now?

No, it isn't illegal now. Not yet. The article is pretty much saying that the BATF, under the direction of Obama and executive order, wants to reclassify ball ammo as armor piercing. If that reclassification takes place, it would likely make a LOT of ammo illegal.

This isn't that far reaching. It would only remove an exemption that 5.56 rounds loaded with M855 and SS109 type bullets currently have to the 18 USC 921 ban on 'armor piercing' ammo that may be usable in handguns. This is a direct and inevitable result of the increase in popularity of AR-pistols and applies only to those rounds.

This should not affect anything else, including other types of .223 or 5.56 ammunition.

a reply to: vor78

"This should not affect anything else, including other types of .223 or 5.56 ammunition."

The other types will increase in cost and be unavailable due market demand. That's what seems to be motivation.

a reply to: Phoenix

I disagree. Assuming this only pertains to those specific bullets mentioned, then by eliminating those lines for civilian consumption, manufacturers should be able to produce even more of XM193 and other variants, for instance. Granted, that's medium/long term. In the short term, yes, I expect considerable panic-buying to result even from this possibility and the current glut of .223/5.56 is probably going to disappear and remain somewhat scarce for several months.

a reply to: vor78

We'll have to disagree then,

I believe demand will outstrip supply for far longer and price will go out of sight to boot.

Heres a Idea. just go back to solid lead. OR.... something softer than steel but heavy and not posionous to wild life.

a reply to: yuppa

Gold! That'll keep the guns outa the poor hands!

On a serious note... Idk why but I was at the store tonight and saw the ammo cabinet just jammed packed... I took it as a bad omen.. "Eat much in summer for winter is bare" popped into my head.. Bought as many of the new Winchester train and defend 9mm they had lol

Secondary funny story... So Winchester has a new ammo line called "train and defend". No grain differences. No +p. Nothing fancy, it's as simple as it gets. In 9mm they have 147g hollow point and 147g ball for target.... Ok so even with this unreal easy change... The person at the store was like "ok wait what ammo???" And stared at the train and defend boxes for like 2 minutes looking for God knows what... I don't reckon it's the ammo is to complicated I think the ammo sellers are probably too simple outside gun shops lol.

a reply to: yuppa

What you've described is copper jacketed lead bullet just like ATF is proposing to ban.

Funny that.

a reply to: Phoenix

They laugh to themselves, thinking themselves above us.

They think with their paid lapdogs that they will never taste the steel of fire and battle.
That somehow, their money and influence will stop someone from putting a .45 through their neck.

I'm just waiting now.

I feel like a kid about to start his first day of school but I can settle down enough that I won't get a nice visit from our friendly government representatives.

They just keep pounding in nails on the coffin of freedom and we keep stacking rounds in boxes of hope.

Sooner or later, something is going to give.
Hint: We outnumber them 100 to 1.

originally posted by: Phoenix
a reply to: yuppa

What you've described is copper jacketed lead bullet just like ATF is proposing to ban.

Funny that.

Hold the train here. Didnt you say STEEL CORE was what they were banning? A lead core isnt steel is it? SO which is it STEEL or LEAD or both?

a reply to: yuppa

You cannot put a solid lead bullet through many modern weapons as the gas operated feed system can become fouled.

Lead bullets have a copper jacket to prevent lead particulates from accumulating in the mechanisms.

originally posted by: AugustusMasonicus
a reply to: yuppa

You cannot put a solid lead bullet through many modern weapons as the gas operated feed system can become fouled.

Lead bullets have a copper jacket to prevent lead particulates from accumulating in the mechanisms.

YES i know that BUT they are TRYING according to the OP to BAN..STEEL CORED FMJ right? Leads to soft to be used in AP rounds. Which under that bill would be the only way to skirt it is going back to lead cores.

a reply to: yuppa

There is still lead-cored ammunition available so they would not have to resort to going back to it.

And frankly, I would rather be shot with a steel-cored round than the lead-cored which will mushroom on impact.

The proposed ban is retarded but look who wants to implement it...

originally posted by: yuppa

originally posted by: AugustusMasonicus
a reply to: yuppa

You cannot put a solid lead bullet through many modern weapons as the gas operated feed system can become fouled.

Lead bullets have a copper jacket to prevent lead particulates from accumulating in the mechanisms.

YES i know that BUT they are TRYING according to the OP to BAN..STEEL CORED FMJ right? Leads to soft to be used in AP rounds. Which under that bill would be the only way to skirt it is going back to lead cores.

Sorry for the confusion, a poster upstream asked about 7.62X39 issues and steel core was in reference to that question, that one is classed as AP already.

The SS109 and M855 have a small steel penetrator tip but were exempted as AP rounds by the ATF, now they are trying to re-class them because some weapons classed as handguns are available.

Not all ball ammo will banned.

I am confident that the nra will reach a compromise.