Exploring the Wage Gap as Objectively as Possible

I have lately been hearing alot about the wage gap between men and women and wanted to have an open discussion about what does the wage gap really look like, how it can be bridged, and whether or not it is productive for the government to get involved.

Here's an article written recently by the Pew Research Center (a group which I believe to be fairly non-biased) that goes into some of the possible factors for a continued wage gap:

www.pewresearch.org...

From the article:

In spite of its narrowing, the gender pay gap persists. Why is this? In our survey, women were more likely to say they had taken career interruptions to care for their family. And research has shown that these types of interruptions can have an impact on long-term earnings. Roughly four-in-ten mothers say they have taken a significant amount of time off from work (39%) or reduced their work hours (42%) to care for a child or other family member. Roughly a quarter (27%) say they have quit work altogether to take care of these familial responsibilities. (Fewer men say the same. For example, just 24% of fathers say they have taken a significant amount of time off to care for a child or other family member.)

But there are others who say that this explains only part of the wage gap, and still others who claim that women are steered towards lower paying careers as children. And interesting article from the other side:

thinkprogress.org...

"The first year out of college is the prime time for women and men to make comparable earnings: they are young, childless, and have just as much inexperience as their male counterparts. But women make less than men in their first year after graduating, even when factors such as schools, grades, majors, and others are taken into account. That educational gap will follow them no matter how much more higher learning they invest in: at any educational level, a man with the same degree earns more, on average."

My thoughts on the whole issue - There is a small and shrinking percentage of the wage gap that can be attributed directly to sexism in the workplace. My best estimate after looking at figures presented in these articles is somewhere around 2 cents on the dollar. The majority of the gap is due to two factors: extra hours worked by men and the amount of time the average woman spends out of the workforce.

I strongly believe that women should have paid maternity leave and that the government should encourage employers to allow women more flexibility in how they return to work (part time, flex time, ect.)

I also believe that, since the majority of men do not discriminate against women in their daily routine, it's obnoxious to have to hear about it over and over again. It's worse than the "feed the kids in Africa" commercials that they used to run all the time (maybe they still do, I don't have a TV). I'm looking at YOU, Potty-Mouthed Princess Video

Warning: video drops the f-bomb alot
www.youtube.com...


Anyways, I've had my say, let's hear yours!

The gap is entirely due to the effects of maternity leave as well as differing career choices. When I graduated from business school, women got the same exact offers as men from major companies. No difference whatsoever. Where the gap occurs is in the type of jobs. For example, in my graduating class about 30% of the class went to work on Wall Street. Another 30% went into marketing. the wall street jobs were more favored by men while more women went into brand management / marketing. When you look at average income of women vs men in total, it is lower because women overwhelmingly chose career paths that doesn't pay as much as men.

As women are moving up in the workforce, where their gaps occur is that women may sometimes take off for maternity leave. They get out of the race for 4 mos to a year or more. This slows down their progression. In addition, women's priorities may start to change once a child comes along and they begin to favor things like work life balance over simply making more money. I see this with my wife. She is an executive at a major company. Our first child was born this year. Now my wife cares more about having time with our son instead of being promoted to the next level. She still works hard and is good at her job, but simply making it to CXO is not really her goal anymore as she has other priorities now. This change in attitude can show up in raises, promotions, etc.

the bottom line is we are not equal and never will be equal. There will always be situations where one group statistically is doing better than another group and it isn't necessarily a bad thing.

a reply to: Edumakated

What do you think about the claim that girls are pressured by society to take up careers that are less financially rewarding?

a reply to: sdubya

That only holds true if you believe that gender is a completely artificial construct with no biological basis at all.

That is simply false.

I work in a publishing company. The office is packed with women, top to bottom. Why? Women tend to have greater facility with language than men. Therefore, it's natural to find a lot of women in jobs that have to do with the written word.

My husband works at a pharmaceutical company. His office is a pretty even split men and women. His own number two is a woman he hired himself. In fact, of the people he has brought on, most have been women. Granted, bios are seen a "soft" STEM option, but there do seem to be a good number of women in the biosciences at least where he's at.

In fact, society is going overboard to push women into STEM despite the fact that men's brains are better at spatial reasoning like women's are better with language.

originally posted by: sdubya
a reply to: Edumakated

What do you think about the claim that girls are pressured by society to take up careers that are less financially rewarding?

I'm of the camp that if you're pressured into something you don't really have anyone to blame but yourself.

a reply to: sdubya

Here's what I'd like to see, that would actually solve the wage gap.

Give women all the Maternity Leave options that we have in 1st world countries, like Canada and Sweden.

Extend those benefits to men as well, since after all, they are fathers and deserve some time with their new born children.

Here in Canada, most couples split the Mat leave 50/50. Mom takes off the first 6 months, Dad takes off the rest. It's a much better way of doing things.

As for the wage gap, yeah it doesn't really exist. It's just a talking point now for Elections and Extremist feminism.

~Tenth

Who cares about the wage gap between men & women, wage disparity as a whole is the only real problem.

85 people having more accumulated wealth than 3.5billion is ludicrous. The system deserves to totally collapse & take all of us with it.

originally posted by: sdubya
a reply to: Edumakated

What do you think about the claim that girls are pressured by society to take up careers that are less financially rewarding?

I don't think about it. I've never personally seen where any woman has been told they can't do something. About the only jobs that I believe women really shouldn't be doing are those where physical labor is of utmost importance like firemen, front line infantry combat roles, etc. If some butch lesbo chick can complete the same exact physical requirements as men, then I don't care, but I absolutely do not believe physical standards should be lowered in those positions where people's lives are on the line.

Certain jobs are just not compatible with certain lifestyles which is why I think women avoid those jobs. Wall Street is a boys club and the work culture is BRUTAL. 80-100 work weeks are norm. It is absolutely not compatible with raising a family, etc. Are there successful women in this field? Yes. But the reality is most men can't even take the hours required and most women don't want to make the sacrifice so they avoid it. It isn't because of any gender bias. It is just reality.

a reply to: Edumakated

I think a 100 hr/week Wall Street job is one of our societies inherent issues.

a reply to: Eunuchorn

When seen in this light, the wage disparity between men and women seems like squabbling over pennies.

originally posted by: Eunuchorn
Who cares about the wage gap between men & women, wage disparity as a whole is the only real problem.

85 people having more accumulated wealth than 3.5billion is ludicrous. The system deserves to totally collapse & take all of us with it.

I agree that growing income inequality more generally is a far more serious issue.