A tax cut for the Middle Class.....

Not watching the Liar.

His nuts are in a jar and his pen has invisible ink.

Nothing this man says should be believed.

originally posted by: PsychoEmperor
a reply to: FyreByrd

Great, why didn't they do it when they had a super majority in the Senate and majority in the house and a democratic president?

Lord...Right leaning politihacks love to snark this theme.

The Dems only had both houses and the WH for a brief spell during 2009 n 2010...

And the razor thin majority in the house made getting anything past a GOP filibuster virtually impossible...AND THEY FILIBUSTERED EVERYTHING.

HERE...A look back in time to when "they had a super majority in the Senate and majority in the house and a democratic president"!!


2010: GOP Senators Reject Tax Cuts for Middle Class

Republicans in the Senate shot down two Democratic plans to extend Bush-era tax cuts to the middle-class, because the proposals did not also extend them for the wealthiest two percent of Americans.

After two hours of debate, cloture vote failed to gain the 60 votes necessary to bypass a filibuster.

www.cbsnews.com...

December 4, 2010..Senate Republicans Block Middle Class Tax Cut
talkingpointsmemo.com...

14 September 2010
Senate Republicans Will Filibuster Extension of Middle Class Tax Cuts if Wealthy Excluded From Extension
www.politicalruminations.com... tml

a reply to: Eunuchorn

Yup, charities that are not church based will go bye bye. I should have been more clear.
People will give their organs to churches.

I wonder when the rich will learn that they only gain wealth when the middle class is strong and has money to spend? It seems that by not being in favor of tax cuts (which will help the middle class a bit), they're cutting themselves off at the knees.

It's pretty basic, when you don't have any customers because they don't have any money -- you don't make any money.

a reply to: Indigo5

The Dems only had both houses and the WH for a brief spell during 2009 n 2010..

Stop lying.

The Democrats held both the House ,and Senate from 2006-2010 then picked up the White House in 2008 then lost the Senate last year.

Plenty of time to screw the evil rich.

Oh wait THEY ALREADY DID.

Full List of Obama Tax Hikes

originally posted by: Hoosierdaddy71
a reply to: Eunuchorn

Yup, charities that are not church based will go bye bye. I should have been more clear.
People will give their organs to churches.

Well, like I said, maybe some charities would become less neccessary. Maybe the government would nationalize the act of founding a charitable organization & use a portion of the new tax income to make sure they don't all just shut down overnight or at least can be easily restarted under new paperwork.
Doesn't the government already give money to churches?
Maybe 90% of all charities would shut down because the selfish rich were truly only doing it for the tax breaks. This could maybe cause a huge chain reaction & lead to massive revolution by the poor & hungry, & create less disparity in the long run, abandoning any need for "charities" purely funded by the excessive wealth of those only looking for a "tax break".

Sorry, was that too many maybes?

Yea, let's stick with the status quo. Humanity as we know it probably doesn't have another 50 years anyways.

a reply to: neo96

Funny how the dems are all rich just like the GOP...

originally posted by: MystikMushroom
I wonder when the rich will learn that they only gain wealth when the middle class is strong and has money to spend? It seems that by not being in favor of tax cuts (which will help the middle class a bit), they're cutting themselves off at the knees.

It's pretty basic, when you don't have any customers because they don't have any money -- you don't make any money.

They are probably keenly aware that we are running out of oil & water. It's easier to not care about anything except your own material comfort when you know "the end" is within or just after your lifetime.

Or they're truly that ignorant. Or greed is truly that powerful.

Sadly, Id guess all of the above.

originally posted by: Hoosierdaddy71
a reply to: neo96

Funny how the dems are all rich just like the GOP...

Oh it's damn right hilarious!

Democrat Tax Evaders, But Hey Lets Raise Taxes

Plus this guy:

As Sharpton Rose, So Did His Unpaid Taxes

White House staffers owe more than $800,000 in back taxes

All this tax hike crap just shows how nonsensical the D's are.

And they will buy every lie the Potus says tonight. Hook,Line, and sinker.

originally posted by: neo96
a reply to: Indigo5

The Dems only had both houses and the WH for a brief spell during 2009 n 2010..

Stop lying.

The Democrats held both the House ,and Senate from 2006-2010 then picked up the White House in 2008 then lost the Senate last year.

Uhh...not sure how to help you there? They picked up the White House in 2009, not 2008?

No they didn't have the house and Senate from 2006-2010? they didn't have the Senate until 2009 and the house until 2007?
www.infoplease.com...

Again...they only had technical majorities in both houses and the whitehouse for 2009 and part of 2010...and it was razor thin where the GOP successfully broke all historical records for filibuster.

This isn't an "opinion" debate or even a historical debate (it was just a few years ago)..the above is literal, verifiable reality.. don't know how to help you there.

Not sure how to respond to someone that angrily shouts 2+2=7!!

Maybe look it up?

Well then maybe before we the people demand flat tax - we should demand term limits for all of our "leaders". And then make them accountable to the laws they make for us (like no more legal insider trading for them). And then eliminate the lifetime benefits and, of course, like someone else said, outlaw lobbyists. Then maybe we can get a flat tax.

Oh yeah, also outlaw the democrat and republican parties... but enough thread drift.

/end thread hijack/

originally posted by: Eunuchorn
a reply to: Hoosierdaddy71

originally posted by: Hoosierdaddy71

originally posted by: tallcool1
That may be swell and all, but I haven't yet heard of a good argument against a flat tax percentage for everyone with zero deductions. Just for arguments sake, say we make it a flat 2% tax - by the very nature of a flat tax, the rich will pay far more than us poor people. If you make $50,000.00 per, your tax $1,000.00. If you make $50,000,000.00 per year, your tax is $1,000,000.00. I don't get how this would not be fair.

And maybe add in that if you earn less than say $50,000.00 per year as a family, you pay nothing.

Why are so many against a flat tax? I'm really asking. I don't understand how a flat tax with no loopholes would be unfair.

You can kiss every charity goodbye with that plan. Those contributions are tax deductible. That would also eliminate tax breaks like buying an electric car.

Like I said, tax breaks wouldn't even be a definable term. People would find other reasons to do these things. I am hard pressed to see any downsides to a flat tax. People want to avoid taxes by keeping money overseas? Force them to expatriate. That would at least force our economy & world to at least move in a new direction of some sort. I stand by my belief that the status quo of economic materialistic slavery & unwarranted, uncontrolled wage disparity is evil & needs to be eliminated. Arguing that someone can make as much money as they want & do what they like with it doesn't make them any less of a slave, just a willing one.

Be glad you don't live in my reality, enlightenments a real b/tch.

The only argument against a flat tax is that it would hit the lower classes harder than the upper classes. For example, let's say the tax is 20% across the board. It would hurt someone making $30k a lot more to pay $6k than it does someone making $1 million to pay $200,000. However, most proponents of the flat tax have not problem with giving credits to the poor effectively making their contribution zero. Personally, I don't want anyone to get any credits as it just opens up the slippery slope for other credits and we wind back up in the same spot.

I want zero corporate income tax (corps don't pay taxes, consumers do). A flat tax on all income, regardless of source of 15%. No deductions of any kind. No carve outs, loop holes, exceptions, etc. Everyone from your minimum wage worker to your private equity executive should be able to fill out their taxes in two lines on a post card. Then tax day should be moved from April 15th to the week prior to elections to remind people who they are voting for.

The only deduction I would like to see is maybe some credit or something for encouraging people to save for their own retirement. There is no logical reason 401k contributions are capped at 15%. We should be encouraging people to take care of their own retirements, especially when you consider how screwed up social security is at the moment.

There is no logical reason we have an entire industry built around helping people pay their taxes. I have an MBA and still barely understand my personal tax returns.

a reply to: Indigo5

I'm sure they could have taken 5 minutes to pass this legislation...if they had wanted too.

Not like the GOP would do it either.

Can't blame it on the other guy.

a reply to: Edumakated

This is why a consumption tax would work better than an income tax. People who buy more pay more. People who buy more expensive things pay more. Overconsumers pay more for the privilege. People who don't consume as much can save. Why tax income at all?

But in any case, with either a flat tax or consumption tax there would have to be a set amount you would have to reach before you were taxed at all.

Welcome to Gridlock...

At least neither one of these groups of fools get their way.

We have too many laws. We don't need anymore.

The best system would be a flat tax system with deductions.
A 13% flat tax on income over 40k.
Married folks get 60k (that includes gays that should be able to marry)
5k deduction per dependent.
Add on deductions for medical bills and charities.
Home improvements that increase energy efficiency should be included.
Absolutely no deductions for political contribution.
Capitol gains will need tweaked to, no reason to lose the family farm to the govt.

originally posted by: whyamIhere
Welcome to Gridlock...

At least neither one of these groups of fools get their way.

We have too many laws. We don't need anymore.

Way to see the silver lining! LOL

Which would be the first law you would undo if you could undo a law?

No flat tax.

No income tax.

Any tax they create will be gamed.

Just like it is now.

And use to divide, and conquer the masses. To get us, and keep us fighting each other instead of who we should be.

Those shills on capitol hill.

originally posted by: tallcool1
That may be swell and all, but I haven't yet heard of a good argument against a flat tax percentage for everyone with zero deductions. Just for arguments sake, say we make it a flat 2% tax - by the very nature of a flat tax, the rich will pay far more than us poor people. If you make $50,000.00 per, your tax $1,000.00. If you make $50,000,000.00 per year, your tax is $1,000,000.00. I don't get how this would not be fair.

And maybe add in that if you earn less than say $50,000.00 per year as a family, you pay nothing.

Why are so many against a flat tax? I'm really asking. I don't understand how a flat tax with no loopholes would be unfair.

Amen, The greatest thing we could ever do for our country is a easy, simple flat tax plan. Less loop holes, just easy.

It would be the best thing ever. If you were poor...you would pay nothing or next to nothing, middle class, you wouldn't feel like you were being squeezed, rich,, you could aspire to be rich knowing that you wouldn't get all your wealth taken away. Then get rid of all the stupid taxes, cut the military budget to something we could actually afford.

Simple and easy and fair. That's why it will never pass.

originally posted by: ~Lucidity

originally posted by: whyamIhere
Welcome to Gridlock...

At least neither one of these groups of fools get their way.

We have too many laws. We don't need anymore.

Way to see the silver lining! LOL

Which would be the first law you would undo if you could undo a law?

The only thing I want to see is Term Limits.

We will never get anywhere with these Lifers.