NLBS #28: Detoxing Cleanses Don't Do Anything For You

a reply to: theNLBS

A healthy diet and exercise is a given, which is why most supplements come with a statement on the bottle-

"VITAMIN SUPPLEMENTS SHOULD NOT REPLACE A BALANCED DIET."

However you never see that statement in advertisements because that could affect sales, so they conveniently place that disclaimer on the packaging so you would only notice it after you've made the purchase, and even then it's hard to spot due to the fact that it's printed in the smallest font size possible-Clever girl.

Good video.
Apologies for not replying to your message earlier.

a reply to: TrueBrit

My attitude to this might be somewhat unique, but I am of the opinion that if I reach retirement age, I will have seriously messed up along the way. The simple fact is, that I cannot afford to retire, and will never be able to afford to retire, and that is why I eat what I want, drink like a fish, and smoke like an underwater geothermal vent. I intend to either go out from living what small life I can access to its fullest, or in a massive, balls out sword fight with ninjas, pirates, ninja pirates, and those morons from the MMA who do not understand that humping your opponent to death is not an acceptable tactic, and that you should win a fight while standing up, in order to call it a win at all.

*sniff* that was moving, I can taste my sour mash tears as the stream down my cheeks.

My future is not bright either-that die was cast a while ago. I have nothing against the 3S diet (scotch, smokes, steak) but I want to live long enough to see something truly remarkable like a colony of Mars or the discovery of life on Mars so I better look after myself.

Who knows? maybe I'll have the pleasure of seeing pirates fighting ninjas at the base of Olympus Mons, If that were to happen I think my heart would punch out.

Next level BS really is some next level BS. The sad part is that they knew this would cause controversy, it's the ONLY reason it was the subject of this show. Similar to CNN/FOX tactics. Well, that's the low we've sunk to I guess.


Maybe ATS got bought out by a bunch of midwestern suburbanites? Feels like it.

1 day. no food. lot of water.

there's your detox. free, and works like a charm.

originally posted by: humanityrising
Next level BS really is some next level BS. The sad part is that they knew this would cause controversy, it's the ONLY reason it was the subject of this show. Similar to CNN/FOX tactics. Well, that's the low we've sunk to I guess.


Maybe ATS got bought out by a bunch of midwestern suburbanites? Feels like it.

Hey humanityrising!
Isn't the real conspiracy the fact that we're ingesting poisons from all directions now? That we can't trust the 'authorities' because all they're interested in is money? That people are sick, depressed and medicated...and TRYING to get healthy?

So now attempting to cleanse the toxins from your body is narcissistic?

My daughter is a personal trainer and an RHN (Registered Holistic Nutritionist). She has helped many people, myself included. I have fasted and cleansed...and am doing much better than I was when taking a bunch of prescriptions.

I won't insult this site, because I love it...but the statements in the OP definitely felt like an insult.

jacygirl

a reply to: TrueBrit

I bet if you quit drinking and smoking and put that money toward retirement, you could easily retire at a decent age.

Just sayin'

originally posted by: jacygirl

originally posted by: humanityrising
Next level BS really is some next level BS. The sad part is that they knew this would cause controversy, it's the ONLY reason it was the subject of this show. Similar to CNN/FOX tactics. Well, that's the low we've sunk to I guess.


Maybe ATS got bought out by a bunch of midwestern suburbanites? Feels like it.

Hey humanityrising!
Isn't the real conspiracy the fact that we're ingesting poisons from all directions now? That we can't trust the 'authorities' because all they're interested in is money? That people are sick, depressed and medicated...and TRYING to get healthy?

So now attempting to cleanse the toxins from your body is narcissistic?

My daughter is a personal trainer and an RHN (Registered Holistic Nutritionist). She has helped many people, myself included. I have fasted and cleansed...and am doing much better than I was when taking a bunch of prescriptions.

I won't insult this site, because I love it...but the statements in the OP definitely felt like an insult.

jacygirl

As I've stated in the video, the body is capable on its own already to metabolize "Toxins". Here is some reading material about "Xenobiotic Metabolism"

What Is Xenobiotic Metabolism?
Metabolic Detoxification
Metabolism of Xenobiotics

Your diet and life choices directly reflected in the chemical process. After a cytochrome begins the transformation process, the resulting product is actually more toxic than the original. Smoking and drinking slow the process, allowing for more toxics products to hang around your body.

The products of phase I metabolism are potentially more toxic than the original molecules, which does not present a problem if the phase II enzymes are functioning at a rate to rapidly neutralize the phase I products as they are formed. This, however, is not always the case. Factors which increase the ratio of phase I to phase II activity can upset this delicate balance, producing harmful metabolites faster than they can be detoxified, and increasing the risk of cellular damage. Some of the factors include: diet (some foods and supplements increase phase I enzyme activity), smoking and alcohol consumption (both induce phase I), age (which can decrease phase II UGT, GST, and SULT activity), sex (premenopausal women show 30-40% more phase I CYP3A4 activity than men or postmenopausal women), disease, and genetics (reviewed in 54).

And yes, I stand my narcissistic comment. The majority of these "detox" programs are also aimed at weight loss. The lemonade, master, cleanse comes to mind immediately. But come on, We live in a society that's so rich that we make a big deal about when not to eat while the rest of the world wonders when they'll be able to.

P.S. here's a funny video about The Master Cleanse

Nobody is supposed to fast or 'cleanse' for more than 3 days. Yes, studies have shown that after 3 days of fasting your immune system resets. The body PULLS toxins out and refreshes, but it can harm you in the long run because most of these diets and cleanses leave out Macro-nutrients, mineral loss, endocrine shock....from the equation.

Try two weeks of depleting Magnesium, Iron, or B vitamins. I'd be surprised if anyone could sleep, have a normal heart rate, not have black circles under eyes, headaches, acid reflux, Hemorrhoid weakness, itchy skin, cramps, etc.

And while people are losing weight, the first week is water balancing, the second a third week is usually muscle AND fat breakdown and your body self cannibalizing people your're not getting Proteins or Fats...(Carbohydrates are almost useless btw)

Cleanses like this are unhealthy and can border dangerous and life threatening, but "detoxification" is not some hoax or fake industry. Detoxification is an actual process that CAN be boosted by processes and supplements OUTSIDE of the body's own natural mechanism. I could go on at length but I'll stop here.

a reply to: SlapMonkey

Extensive calculator abuse, combined with the fact that the retirement age is being pushed back again and again in this country, leads me to believe otherwise. I am not a COMPLETE fool, I did check into the situation before beginning this path

originally posted by: BatheInTheFountain
Why do I keep seeing these threads pop up from an OP who has obviously NO knowledge of Biology, Anatomy, Nutrition, Endocrine systems, digestive systems, "toxicity"...or any related area of health?

Getting tired of this.

The only real knowledge displayed in this thread so far.

I'm going to try and say this as nicely as possible and still get my point across. Joe, (I assume that's your name) the first place to detox would be your mouth...with a bar of soap....for a discussion board that for the most part keeps the language pretty clean, you can't go more than a sentence or two in your video without using profanity. It does nothing to help, and only takes away from any message you might have had.

Next, on the subject of detox. I could only force myself to make it through 6 minutes of this video, then I had to go to the bathroom and detox. I couldn't make it through all 12. Sorry my tolerance level isn't up there and probably never will be.
May I ask how you consider yourself to be an expert? Have you studied for years the effects of different foods on the body, have you gone through trial and error, where are you basing your hypothesis from? It's plainly obvious to me that you don't know what you're talking about. Of Course fast food is bad for us, and Of Course nutritious food is good, for lifestyle choices. I've studied the liver for quite a long time and based on my knowledge and firsthand experience, you know nothing of which you speak. I'm not going to argue the matter, it's your video. However stuff like this shouldn't be promoted on ATS. I have a much, much higher opinion of the general intelligence level here than what's portrayed in your video. This stuff just doesn't cut it. Youtube is FULL of nonsense like this.

You want to know if a detox/cleanse worked in a big way. Your body has The Herxheimer Reaction. All the different stuff I tired that only happened once, and that involved fasting.

So on the one hand I agree with Joe some of this marketed stuff does next to nothing, but maybe make you more regular at the bathroom. But fasting and drinking lemon and water for 7 days actually costs less than what you would normally pay to eat. And guess what, you do detox too.

Lets not get the "gimmick expensive detox" mixed up with the cheap fasting version.

originally posted by: Blue_Jay33
You want to know if a detox/cleanse worked in a big way. Your body has The Herxheimer Reaction. All the different stuff I tired that only happened once, and that involved fasting.

So on the one hand I agree with Joe some of this marketed stuff does next to nothing, but maybe make you more regular at the bathroom. But fasting and drinking lemon and water for 7 days actually costs less than what you would normally pay to eat. And guess what, you do detox too.

Lets not get the "gimmick expensive detox" mixed up with the cheap fasting version.

No it doesn't.
The Herxheimer Reaction has been as over-marketed as the "detox" fad itself.
I'm guessing it's used as it sounds scientific and does have some factual basis if you have syphillis (although not for "detox").
Which bit's the "gimmick" again?

A quote from the Pathology Guy.

"Herxheimer Reaction

Over the years, I have had several correspondents who have written me telling they have gotten sick after taking some "complementary / alternative / holistic" remedy. (Most took fulvic acid.) They were told that they were experiencing the "Herxheimer reaction", that they were sick from toxic products from the bacteria killed by the remedy, and that they needed an additional remedy. Other names are "the healing crisis" and "the detox reaction."

You're being played for a fool. The Herxheimer reaction was well-known after a patient with advanced syphilis was treated with penicillin. The immune system reacted to the dead syphilis bacteria. It usually lasted only a few hours. In very advanced syphilis, it can last a few days and is managed with glucocorticoids (J. Neuroim. 18: 360. 2008). We are seeing it in the other spirochetal diseases -- Lyme disease, leptospirosis and borelliosis. Less than 1% of patients treated for borelliosis showed the reaction (Trav. Med. Inf. Dis. 7: 160, 2009), and severe Herxheimer reactions even in syphilis are now reportable. Not surprisingly (given that a Whipple patient has maybe a few pounds of bacteria on board), there's been one report of a Whipple's patient geting a herx-like reaction on initiation of treatment, which responded quickly to glucocorticoids (Gut 33: 132, 1992). I'd expect the same from bacillary angiomatosis.

In 1992, an Australian pathology group looked at the possibility that killing other bacteria (not just spirochetes) could release endotoxin and make people sick ("Antibiotic induced release of endotoxin: A reappraisal"; Clin. Inf. Dis. 15: 840, 1992), by analogy with the Herxheimer reaction and the tumor lysis syndrome. They came up with a "maybe." Anti-endotoxin therapy was a bust in subsequent years. This is the last I could find in the peer-reviewed literature.

The only place to deal with bunko artists is in a court of law, under oath -- not in "Wikipedia." If an "independent thinker" talks to you about the "Herxheimer reaction", "Herx", or "Jarisch-Herxheimer" because some phony remedy made you sick, contact a real physician, a good tort lawyer, AND your local district attorney. If you have been injured, I will take you case as a courtesy.

www.pathguy.com...

originally posted by: AreUKiddingMe
I'm going to try and say this as nicely as possible and still get my point across. Joe, (I assume that's your name) the first place to detox would be your mouth...with a bar of soap....for a discussion board that for the most part keeps the language pretty clean, you can't go more than a sentence or two in your video without using profanity. It does nothing to help, and only takes away from any message you might have had.

Next, on the subject of detox. I could only force myself to make it through 6 minutes of this video, then I had to go to the bathroom and detox. I couldn't make it through all 12. Sorry my tolerance level isn't up there and probably never will be.
May I ask how you consider yourself to be an expert? Have you studied for years the effects of different foods on the body, have you gone through trial and error, where are you basing your hypothesis from? It's plainly obvious to me that you don't know what you're talking about. Of Course fast food is bad for us, and Of Course nutritious food is good, for lifestyle choices. I've studied the liver for quite a long time and based on my knowledge and firsthand experience, you know nothing of which you speak. I'm not going to argue the matter, it's your video. However stuff like this shouldn't be promoted on ATS. I have a much, much higher opinion of the general intelligence level here than what's portrayed in your video. This stuff just doesn't cut it. Youtube is FULL of nonsense like this.

And ATS is FULL of Dunning-Krugers.
And never trust a man who doesn't swear. He's hiding something...

I've done saltwater cleanses a few times. I didn't do it to "detoxify" per say. It was mainly to give my digestive system a kick start. Due to my health problems I'm on a hefty dose of opiates , and they really do a wonderful job of making my digestive system quite sluggish. Laxatives did nothing to help the situation, so I did the
cleanse as a last ditch effort. Mind you, I only do it when I absolutely have to, as it's quite unpleasant.

I apologize if the above is tmi but when you have as many health problems as I do you pretty much lose any shame you once had about discussing bodily functions.

I would agree, that yes, there are a lot of BS cure-all snake oil out there. However, the intake of those chemicals do make you generally unhealthy. It's a known fact our food and water is garbage and eating and drinking crap will generally make you feel like crap. As the saying goes you are what you eat. It gives rise to other things though.

An unhealthy body goes hand in hand with bacteria and disease. So to say there isn't detox isn't entirely true. There is detox for Diseases and things like colon parasites and liver flukes. We all have em. It takes a while but it could be as simple as taking in garlic. Garlic generally is poison. Large doses of anything will harm you and probably kill you.

You hear stories about taking large doses of vitamin C and you feel better. Well that's because you killed whatever ails you. Taking it to long and it starts to do damage too. The key is controlling the intake and getting the toxic level just high enough for a while to wipe out the disease, but not harm your body and organs in the process.

In other words you have to use a toxic to kill whatever ails you. You see worse cases when the bodies immune system is overran and can no longer defend itself. Things like cancer you detox yourself by nuking your body! Same concept. We really are a walking chemistry lab.