Cannabis As Addictive As Heroin, Major New Study Finds

I have a sister who owns her own business, good thing though because I don't figure she has pissed clean since she was 16.

She's 54 now and can't start her day without a 1 hitter and her coffee, it is hard to watch because she spends so much money on dope she can barely get by most times.

...No, She ain't addicted...

a reply to: Calalini

3.5 hours away from 72 hours of pharma/hard drug induced withdrawals.

I don't doubt that mj withdrawals and addiction may be intense for some. We're all different after all.

Although, I feel pretty darn safe saying the the most severe MJ addiction/WDs won't hold a candle to the most minor of this kind.

As for negative aspects of cannabis use. In my expierience, if someone is prone to anxiety, it can magnify the symptoms and help panic attacks manifest.

It's not perfect, but all these combined opinions are out of whack, we're on a bumpy road right now. A mixture of 1936 propaganda, and true long term intimate expierience, with everything in between.

originally posted by: MyHappyDogShiner
I have a sister who owns her own business, good thing though because I don't figure she has pissed clean since she was 16.

She's 54 now and can't start her day without a 1 hitter and her coffee, it is hard to watch because she spends so much money on dope she can barely get by most times.

...No, She ain't addicted...

Yes and terribly sorry to hear that...but again...that is THAT story

Let me tell you about my friend and colleague, a fellow therapist who smoked every day for eight straight years whose only side effect was a wee bit of extra stomach. Then a year ago he completes his PsyD in Clinical Psych and found an amazing job but UH OH....first drug test ever...four months out he cut cold turkey ((in case they decided to test hair)) and sold his remaining stash to a friend...not even a single bit of grumpiness past a day or two and hasn't touched it since

We can throw out anecdotes all day on either side

What about professional experience? ((not that anyone believes anyone else anyway))

I am an LPC and work crisis and therapy...I know many smokers who have found great relief for their issues through cannabis and before you ask YES said issues were in place before smoking

Now, as a professional who works in a state that has not yet legalized it for recreational use...I do not condone it

But the hordes of heroin, meth and ((a few)) PCP and crack users I have seen have literally smoked or injected definitive mental illness into what used to be a sane person.

How about personal experience?

Thanks to the military ((and admittedly my own weakness...I am not victim here)) I spent 1.5 years on a fabulous mix of Vicodin, Valium and Flexeril when a simple surgery could have fixed my issue with maybe a four week course of pain pills and a good sling and physical therapy. I became addicted to the tune of 10 Vicodin, 2 Valium and a couple Flexiril at the same time ((my liver was quite please with all that Tylenol lemme tell you)). I had to buy it, fake injuries or exaggerate symptoms to get more and don't even get me started on Dilaudid...

I tried to quit a few times with no success...I needed it...my body physically AND mentally had to have it...I was a hulking and frail mess of a shell of a person and while my own mental issues were with me prior to addiction, my anxiety and panic skyrocketed even after I was clean...now, every VA I go to, on my own free will, I have to tell my new doctor to voluntarily withdraw me from opiate and benzo use unless it is a major emergency with serious pain ((such as my kidney stone))

I am an addict...very addictive...now it's sugar which I am having a REALLY hard time battling

and yet...during the times I smoked, I never once had a single issue, withdrawal effect or difficulty stopping...and continue to be very productive

point is, anecdotal 'evidence' is great for a story, but it doesn't prove any points

a reply to: LewsTherinThelamon

Your whole premise is absurd.

Yes to you because completely misinterpreted it

Like I said, shoot up heroin everyday for three years and then come back and tell us that nicotine is the #1 addictive substance. I will listen to your stupidity patiently between your screaming, vomiting, and seizing.

Sorry but you're a fool and an idiot and a bit sick in the head in my opinion to suggest this to anyone.

Nicotine is not the most addictive substance on Earth, opiate-based drugs are.

Chemistry says otherwise as per my reading and experience in all substances discussed.

It's the people that do it everyday for years that become irrevocably addicted.

Not years, just takes about 3 months, give or take a month depending on the persons biological chemistry in the frequency you suggest.

This is why your anecdote about using is complete bunk, you're simply ignorant of how opiates take over the body.

No you are ignorant of what I am saying about nicotine vs heroin and how the body handles or battles the process of chance that leads to addiction.

I never said getting of smack is easier than cigarettes.

I never said it a worse addiction just that the substance has higher addictive properties than other things being discussed.

You see it as bunk and I'm ignorant, who cares?

I know what I post, especially when its personal, what you post, your suggestions are to kill myself practically,

Thanks but no thanks.

I hope I remember your screen name so as to avoid such negativity in future.

a reply to: Calalini

Gotta love how The Telegraph put such a negative spin on the study. The result of the study is that correlation is not causation.

If no one actually read the article for themselves, they would think "gee this 20yr study shows how bad cannabis is" when that is not the case at all.

a reply to: MyHappyDogShiner

There are people who can do hard core drugs that most would think of as addictive (can't actually say because it violates T&C) but it can be done recreationally without becoming addicted to it.

I have sex 5 times a week, recreationally, but I'm not addicted to it.

The main point is that everyone reacts to everything differently. Correlation is not causation.

Some people have addictive personalities. I do not. My boyfriend on the other hand, does. And it leads to a lot of arguments regarding smoking cigarettes, and other 'addictive' things.


I don't think that Cannabis is addictive. Maybe a gateway drug, but certainly not addictive. But that also goes into "do you have an addictive personality?" Someone with an addictive personality might feel that something that isn't addictive really is addictive because they are used to doing it. It's become a habit, which can be hard to change. The reason I say that it's a gateway drug is because it's easy to get. People who do drugs go for what's easy. In my town, heroin is easier to get than weed. I mean, they have seminars at the highschool talking about 'how to keep heroin away from your kids' all the time. A lot of the kids that started with weed (because it was easy to get at one time) moved onto heroin because it was easier to get and it gave them a better high. You know?

I think that in most cases (outside of Heroin, Meth and other chemically made drugs) addiction is just an excuse. It's as simple as finding a new habit, having strong will, keeping yourself busy, and just not doing the thing that is addictive. You feel like smoking a joint? Go run.


You know what I mean?

originally posted by: Lyxdeslic
Some people have addictive personalities. I do not. My boyfriend on the other hand, does. And it leads to a lot of arguments regarding smoking cigarettes, and other 'addictive' things.


I don't think that Cannabis is addictive. Maybe a gateway drug, but certainly not addictive. But that also goes into "do you have an addictive personality?" Someone with an addictive personality might feel that something that isn't addictive really is addictive because they are used to doing it. It's become a habit, which can be hard to change. The reason I say that it's a gateway drug is because it's easy to get. People who do drugs go for what's easy. In my town, heroin is easier to get than weed. I mean, they have seminars at the highschool talking about 'how to keep heroin away from your kids' all the time. A lot of the kids that started with weed (because it was easy to get at one time) moved onto heroin because it was easier to get and it gave them a better high. You know?

I think that in most cases (outside of Heroin, Meth and other chemically made drugs) addiction is just an excuse. It's as simple as finding a new habit, having strong will, keeping yourself busy, and just not doing the thing that is addictive. You feel like smoking a joint? Go run.


You know what I mean?

You are completely right, some people have addictive personalities. My Mom was an alcoholic but she has replaced her addiction with sugar & AA.

What the 20yr study actually reveals about the addictiveness of cannabis is this:

In drugs with high rates of addiction, such as nicotine, coc aine and alcohol, we can see a clear pattern of abuse. The drug hijacks the brain’s reward system, so that a smoke, line, drink, etc. is treated with the same urgency and necessity as food and sex. On the behavioral level, there are clear signs of dependency and withdrawal. Marijuana opponents have spent decades trying to show analogous patterns in pot smokers, but the results simply aren’t there. The closest they can get is to show that some people have difficulty quitting, and show signs of anxiety, difficulty sleeping, and other disturbances when they try to quit, as was demonstrated in the Hall study. That does show a non-zero level of dependency in a minority of users, but even in these cases, marijuana has nowhere near the capacity to ruin or end lives the way alcohol and heroin can, and is less addictive than tobacco or even caffeine. As an earlier AlterNet article points out, "9 percent of people who use marijuana will develop dependence at some point in their lives, compared with 15 percent for alcohol, 17 percent for coc aine, 23 percent for
heroin, and 32 percent for tobacco."

This is what the 20yr study revealed about the gateway effect:
It’s 2014, and we’re still hearing about the gateway effect. People who use hard drugs are very likely to have tried cannabis first, but the suggestion that smoking pot causes hard drug use falls to the first lesson of any statistics class: correlation is not causality. Pot, being the most popular and available illicit drug, tends to be the one that people try first. Furthermore, gateway theory advocates consistently omit alcohol from their calculations, as if there could be no connection between legal and illegal drugs. Virtually everyone who has tried any recreational drug, marijuana included, has had a drink at some point in their life. Many of them have had a cigarette or two as well. So why is the gateway label never attached to alcohol? Because the people still making noise about the gateway theory have an agenda, and they are willing to ignore logic to push it.

I agree with you about the last part, some addictions are more a matter of mind power than an actual addiction.

Cannabis fires the pleasure and addiction centers of the brain, this has been proven on brain scans taken while people smoke pot.

Heroin is so bad because it replaces certain receptors in the brain with other receptors that aren't normally present that crave the drug, making it a particularly bad drug for addiction. However, pot fires many of the same receptors in the brain that other more addictive drugs do, if not in the same amounts.

a reply to: babybunnies
Same with Oreo cookies, the same part of your brain that reacts to heroin to make it so addictive, reacts the same way to the cookie. Why aren't Oreo cookies illegal than?
(being serious, not sarcastic)

originally posted by: Sabiduria

originally posted by: Lyxdeslic
Some people have addictive personalities. I do not. My boyfriend on the other hand, does. And it leads to a lot of arguments regarding smoking cigarettes, and other 'addictive' things.


I don't think that Cannabis is addictive. Maybe a gateway drug, but certainly not addictive. But that also goes into "do you have an addictive personality?" Someone with an addictive personality might feel that something that isn't addictive really is addictive because they are used to doing it. It's become a habit, which can be hard to change. The reason I say that it's a gateway drug is because it's easy to get. People who do drugs go for what's easy. In my town, heroin is easier to get than weed. I mean, they have seminars at the highschool talking about 'how to keep heroin away from your kids' all the time. A lot of the kids that started with weed (because it was easy to get at one time) moved onto heroin because it was easier to get and it gave them a better high. You know?

I think that in most cases (outside of Heroin, Meth and other chemically made drugs) addiction is just an excuse. It's as simple as finding a new habit, having strong will, keeping yourself busy, and just not doing the thing that is addictive. You feel like smoking a joint? Go run.


You know what I mean?

You are completely right, some people have addictive personalities. My Mom was an alcoholic but she has replaced her addiction with sugar & AA.

What the 20yr study actually reveals about the addictiveness of cannabis is this:

In drugs with high rates of addiction, such as nicotine, coc aine and alcohol, we can see a clear pattern of abuse. The drug hijacks the brain’s reward system, so that a smoke, line, drink, etc. is treated with the same urgency and necessity as food and sex. On the behavioral level, there are clear signs of dependency and withdrawal. Marijuana opponents have spent decades trying to show analogous patterns in pot smokers, but the results simply aren’t there. The closest they can get is to show that some people have difficulty quitting, and show signs of anxiety, difficulty sleeping, and other disturbances when they try to quit, as was demonstrated in the Hall study. That does show a non-zero level of dependency in a minority of users, but even in these cases, marijuana has nowhere near the capacity to ruin or end lives the way alcohol and heroin can, and is less addictive than tobacco or even caffeine. As an earlier AlterNet article points out, "9 percent of people who use marijuana will develop dependence at some point in their lives, compared with 15 percent for alcohol, 17 percent for coc aine, 23 percent for
heroin, and 32 percent for tobacco."

This is what the 20yr study revealed about the gateway effect:
It’s 2014, and we’re still hearing about the gateway effect. People who use hard drugs are very likely to have tried cannabis first, but the suggestion that smoking pot causes hard drug use falls to the first lesson of any statistics class: correlation is not causality. Pot, being the most popular and available illicit drug, tends to be the one that people try first. Furthermore, gateway theory advocates consistently omit alcohol from their calculations, as if there could be no connection between legal and illegal drugs. Virtually everyone who has tried any recreational drug, marijuana included, has had a drink at some point in their life. Many of them have had a cigarette or two as well. So why is the gateway label never attached to alcohol? Because the people still making noise about the gateway theory have an agenda, and they are willing to ignore logic to push it.

I agree with you about the last part, some addictions are more a matter of mind power than an actual addiction.

That study makes sense. Alcohol would be the most common gateway drug. Especially with teenagers. Go to a party, drink some alcohol, "hey you wanna smoke this?" And they do. I didn't mean to sound like I had an agenda, because I don't. I think that marijuana should be legal everywhere, because I see no harm in it. I was just stating what I had noticed while I was in school. Which could be much more different than now. Especially because it seems in a lot of areas marijuana is no longer the 'cool thing.'

The pro pot brigade will say anything to downplay the negative effects of smoking weed. It doesn't fit they're agenda for legalization. I know I use to be one of them.

The government is mistaken if they think they can legalize it and tax it. What your seeing in the states where it is legal is nothing more then tourism. Most pot smokers aren't going to be able to afford the price of legal dispensary weed for a long period of time. They'll either grow it or get it from the black market that already exists. Legal pot is going to have to compete with cheap Mexican weed. We all know how that works just ask Walmart.

Can't there be a rule that Daily Mail articles aren't allowed on ATS and Sorcha fail too?

This is a top ten moronic article....

'Cannabis as addictive as heroin...'

You could, just about, replace the first word with several other related or non-related activities. Protein, sugar...

To be clear, the effects of cannabis on the developing brain, is kind of a no-brainer...and we've all had friends/acquaintances that 'recreated' from a very early age - that do become dumb, unmotivated and require the services of psych wards, as a result of early, and continued use...but that's another story...

...and once admitted into said wards - are administered 'much mo betta drugs' - legal ones, that they can be addicted to for the rest of their life and guaranteed repeat visits to psych specialists, provided with free samples of 'newar, mush mo betterer' dwugs - by the companies who fund the research into articles like this one.

Gateway drugs? Presumably then, not a gateway to legally prescribed anti-psychotics?...and their associated, well-publicised, lifelong side-effects...but, that 'link' is a moot one...since, illegal drugs, by their title, cannot be obtained through a regular visit to your assigned psych - that addiction needs to be financed some other way...

I know of no-one (over 40 years) of my friends and acquaintences who would EVER get so desperate for a reef, that they would make burglary one of their regular pastimes - or prostitution, or robbery, or...

Not ONE of the aforementioned friends or acquantances hocked every single item of theirs to pay for their disgusting reef habit...before moving onto burglary, robbery or prostitution.

...and although I have had friends and acquantances over the years who were 'addicted' to heroin who managed to hold full time employment in a variety of fields - the same can be said for those 'addicted' to reef - while at the same time being 'addicted' to alcool, while being 'addicted' to gambling, while being 'addicted' to sex, while being
'addicted' to sugary 'energy' drinks, while being 'addicted' to Nick Otine, while being addicted to...

Bah...as addictive?

Pure and unadulterated rubbish.

Å99

The biggest fear of major drug companies is something that people will perceive as beneficial to their health and something they can grow on their own without having to purchase it from said drug companies.

The evil demon weed marijuana must be stopped at all costs before it impacts our profit margins....uh I mean it's as addictive as heroin dammit!!!!