I'm right, you're wrong

Hello everyone,

I'm not typically one to go off on a rant, mainly because I don't expect it to achieve anything significant..but I feel this should be brought up for discussion.

What bothers me often times when I read comments (not just on here but many other sites) is when a person will claim to have absolute knowledge of a subject, but refuses to discuss it further or even be open to an intellectual debate on the matter..instead resorting to endless banter about how "They are 100% correct" & how your "dead wrong" for having an opposing opinion.

Honestly I get that (you) want to feel correct, maybe it boosts your ego or makes you feel more intelligent..but what I often wonder is wether (you) even know how incorrect you may be, and how refusing to have any type of discussion on the matter does nothing to resolve the issue. Has rhetoric lost it's meaning so much over time that a debate can be won simply by talking over someone else, and having the most popular opinion of the day ? (Hold that thought)

I'm not afraid to admit when I am wrong, and have been on many occasions. Admitting to this fact allows me to educate myself, and I view all points from two equal sides. regardless of what I may comment, or the opinions someone else may think I have, I do my best to remain neutral and kind of expect the same from what are supposed to be intellectual people.

Speaking not only for myself..yes (my) views/opinions may be unfavourable to you, but criticizing me, or anyone else for that matter, for having an opposing one without any form of complete rhetoric makes which one of us the "stupid one".

It is my opinion that intellectual discussion has gone by the wayside, and I am sincerely hoping for some type of reply to redeem my faith that there are still people who can analyze both sides of a theory rather than create a conclusion based on the "facts of the day."

PS. I get that this is a conspiracy website and all matters of opinion are valid, I'm not arguing that, but can we please form educated opinions ? I've thought highly of you (ATS) for many years now..I am trying hard to remain neutral about my feelings towards your level of intellectual stimulation

a reply to: threeeyesopen

yeah

best one I read recently was that the TR3B did not exist.

How would any of us know if it does or does not exist?

I know how you feel, I'm always right, I'm smarter than everyone else, why can't they see it?

It's hard to soar like an Eagle when you're surrounded by Turkey's.

no - all matters of opinion are not valid

example 2+2 = 5

QED

a reply to: threeeyesopen

I like to explore other peoples thoughts. I like to evolve concepts into deeper meaning. How can I do this if I already know the answer? Haha. I use most topics to examine recombine facts and play both sides. Often I may come off as a flipflopper, but that is a weak concept. A definition in one word to minimize paragraphs of interwoven thoughts.

Sometimes in one post I go for and against an idea many times. I'm not confused. I know what I really think. But why stop there. Gotta go further or whats the point. The real answers take critical thinking. Besides that saying both sides or more than 2 sides even 10 sides helps more people come into the discussion.

Simplifying the conversation is usually based on conclusions based on assumptions. I don't like to have an answer. I like to keep looking. I like to let people talk enough to where they have changed their mind not me change it by yelling or repetition.

I poke and watch. then I learn. I change, and then see where it is I am. I don't like to know where I am going. Wheres the fun in that?

a reply to: threeeyesopen

Is it possible to know you're right about something without
being able to relate it with words?

One thing that comes to mind for me is the ongoing debate
on this site about sexuality--whether a person consciously "chooses"
their sexuality. Personally, I've run out of words, examples, and
arguments for my POV....so, I'm right, and (if you oppose me,)
you're wrong.

Which sort of fits with the site's "Deny Ignorance" motto. Perhaps if our
mission statement was "Seek the Truth" we would have better debates.

I agree with you.
I'm open to learning how I may be wrong.

There are those who have such strong opinions they won't budge, refuse to be educated. The worst is when its a subject where you are just giving your personal opinion and say so. I feel like we're having husband and wife spats sometimes.

Often times in a conspiracy related topic, if you don't sgree with with the thread title you're called a Sheeple as if you are close minded on everything ,when you're not. They just assume.

Lately I'm finding I can't say what I really want because I have to be mindful I won't set myself up for attack.
After being on ATS for so long now, I don't really care what others think or throw at me. There's no point debating with a know it all.

a reply to: threeeyesopen

I'm with you here. To add my own: Infact they can say they are right all they want, then move along if they do not want to contribute. The issue is ad hominem attacks that are directed towards members. Here's what I'm talking about:

Abusive ad hominem usually involves attacking the traits of an opponent as a means to invalidate their arguments. Equating someone's character with the soundness of their argument is a logical fallacy.

Source



"Your opinion is asinine therefore your knowledge on the subject cannot suffice over anything I say. It is garbage."

"All of these replying members that subscribe to __insert political leaning/religion or other group association__ cannot understand this because they are selfish and ignorant. "

These kind of replies are not conducive to conversation, AT ALL. They create a distraction, adding emotional thinking into the subject instead of rational thought out replies. This which in turns brings more ad hominem replies instead of focusing on the issue. It affects the ones doing it too: It causes people to NOT REPLY TO YOU. It's shilling 101 if one wants break it down more.

a reply to: threeeyesopen

You don't KNOW how "right" You are... What if: There is a Quorum of 10. 7 of the 10 claim to be "right".. Does that make the "other 3" 'wrong' or ill informed?

I'd 'opine' that You'll find that 'opinions' are like butts, everybody has One, and everybody else's 'stinks'...

How do "We" get 'them' to pull their head out? 'They' just won't listen to reason.. Do Us of We tell 'them'? Do We just give up?...

Here is "the rub" ... Once You get 'them' to 'see the light' what it was that You were trying to convince them of, that importance is gone, that ship has set sail, and then when the next dilemma arises 'they' are 'stuck' in that too...

Worry about YourSelf and the rest will "catch up". Are You trying to convince "them" or You? I had a recent occasion on ATS™ to have a debate about another's religion™. They were defending their religion™ to Me, some anonymous turd on the intraweb Why? Do they have little 'Faith'? the very thing they profess to have? If they did, then it wouldn't matter what I thought, as I AM an anonymous turd floating in a sea where many surf...

I'll tell(type) You this... YOU are RIGHT!! RIGHT as rain..

a reply to: threeeyesopen


One of the things I've learned throughout my life is that I don't know it all. My folks used to get so upset that when I didn't have the answers, I'd ask them for advice, then I'd ask everyone else I knew, and then I'd consider all the viewpoints and make my decision or take my stand. (The folks would get upset because I didn't always follow their advice.)

But see, that's what critical thinking means: let's check out viewpoints different from our own AND consider them. Critical thinking is becoming more rare.

originally posted by: JimNasium
a reply to: threeeyesopen

To answer your question regarding whom I am trying to convince of the truth, it certainly is not myself as I don't take anything as a whole truth to begin with. That being said however, it frustrates me that critical thinking is often frowned upon, and explaining such to most is even more frustrating. Thank you for your view point, the three out of ten are certainly not wrong no matter how they are viewed, but the most popular opinion will always be the one that takes centre stage unfortunately.

originally posted by: kelbtalfenek
a reply to: threeeyesopen


Critical thinking is becoming more rare.

Yes it certainly is, it worries me that we will undoubtly reach a point where critical thinking is non-existent in a world that demands an absolute truth in 15 minutes or less.

originally posted by: ignorant_ape
no - all matters of opinion are not valid

example 2+2 = 5

QED

You forgot the observer!

2+2+(1 observer)= 5

There...next.

Peace

originally posted by: violet
Lately I'm finding I can't say what I really want because I have to be mindful I won't set myself up for attack.
After being on ATS for so long now, I don't really care what others think or throw at me. There's no point debating with a know it all.

You're right that there is no point debating a know it all but what you said prior to that is what concerns me. The fact that you've been on here for so long, and still feel the need to be mindful of what you say because you may be setting yourself up for attack..it's like a censorship all it's own. I'm not expecting the world to be free of opposing opinions or people trolling, but why should someone feel they can't freely share their own opinion..

a reply to: threeeyesopen

I'd like to agree with you but not everything is debatable and sometimes people are full of crap; and never wanting to admit they're full of crap, they will argue their crap until the only thing you are left to say to them is just that: that they are full of crap.

Do you think everything is debatable?

originally posted by: threeeyesopen

originally posted by: violet
Lately I'm finding I can't say what I really want because I have to be mindful I won't set myself up for attack.
After being on ATS for so long now, I don't really care what others think or throw at me. There's no point debating with a know it all.

You're right that there is no point debating a know it all but what you said prior to that is what concerns me. The fact that you've been on here for so long, and still feel the need to be mindful of what you say because you may be setting yourself up for attack..it's like a censorship all it's own. I'm not expecting the world to be free of opposing opinions or people trolling, but why should someone feel they can't freely share their own opinion..

It depends on my mood. Sometimes I know what I say will cause a sir and don't care. Other times I'm being mindful

I am so with you on that second paragraph

I am fully aware that a significant portion of the population probably knows WAY more than I do and 100% of the population knows way more than I do on at least one subject (though the reality is more like 5000 subjects)

I am aces with that...I get really irked though when the "expert" arrives and drops the line "if you knew what I knew your mind would be forever changed"

THEN TELL US!!! If you are so confident, and have such incredible concrete evidence then post your info and let us see your amazing world!

No...my opinion is most of these people don't know a damn thing or know a bit but are so shaky and un-confident in their stances or 'facts' that they have this ever present need to tell everyone that they have all the answers when the reality is they probably know bunk

I've said it before and I'll say it again..flaunt your IQ all you want...real geniuses are first aware that they don't know # except what is in the moment...and they sure as hell don't feel the need to advertise their intelligence or 'amazing information'...they just do

((The preceding message was not not created, authored, written or edited by a genius...in fact he's kind of an idiot))