Is THIS what Hamas gives to their Children for Entertainment?

a reply to: Swills

Thank you for the link. Reading the wiki page, the criticisms seem pretty nuanced and specific to a few incidents.

Moreover, the wiki entry also claims:

The accuracy of MEMRI's translations are considered "usually accurate" though occasionally disputed and highly selective in what it chooses to translate and in which context it puts things...

Are these Hamas videos one of those occasions?

a reply to: loam

Is it? I dunno. Lets see what The Guardian has to report.

Arabic under fire
A child on Hamas TV talked of annihilating the Jews ... or did she?

Brian Whitaker
theguardian.com, Tuesday 15 May 2007 16.30 EDT

Memri, the "research institute" which specialises in translating portions of the Arabic media into English, has issued a video clip from a children's programme on Hamas TV in which it claims that a Palestinian girl talked of becoming a suicide bomber and annihilating the Jews....

...The sound quality on the clip is not very good, but I have listened to it several times (as have a number of native Arabic speakers) and we can hear no word that might correspond to "annihilate".

What the girl seems to say is: "Bitokhoona al-yahood" - "The Jews will shoot us" or "The Jews are shooting us."

This is followed by further prompting - "We are going to defend al-Aqsa with our souls and blood, or are we not?"

Again, the girl's reply is not very clear, but it's either: "I'll become a martyr" or "We'll become martyrs."

In the context of the conversation, and in line with normal Arab-Islamic usage, martyrdom could simply mean being killed by the Israelis' shooting. However, Memri's translation of the sentence - "I will commit martyrdom" turns it into a deliberate act on the girl's part, and Colonel Carmon has since claimed that it refers to suicide bombers.

The overall effect of this is to change a conversation about resistance and sacrifice into a picture of unprovoked and seemingly motiveless aggression on the part of the Palestinians. But why hype the content in this way? Hamas's use of children's TV for propaganda purposes is clearly despicable, as the BBC, the Guardian and others have noted, without any need to exaggerate its content.

Among those misled by Memri's "translation" was Glenn Beck of CNN, who had planned to run it on his radio programme, until his producer told him to stop. Beck informed listeners this was because CNN's Arabic department had found "massive problems" with it.

Instead of broadcasting the tape, Beck then invited Carmon on to the programme and gave him a platform to denounce CNN's Arabic department, and in particular to accuse one of its staff, Octavia Nasr, of being ignorant about the language.

Carmon related a phone conversation he had had with Ms Nasr:

She said the sentence where it says [in Memri's translation] "We are going to ... we will annihilate the Jews", she said: "Well, our translators hear something else. They hear 'The Jews are shooting at us'."

I said to her: "You know, Octavia, the order of the words as you put it is upside down. You can't even get the order of the words right. Even someone who doesn't know Arabic would listen to the tape and would hear the word 'Jews' is at the end, and also it means it is something to be done to the Jews, not by the Jews."

And she insisted, no the word is in the beginning. I said: "Octavia, you just don't get it. It is at the end" ... She didn't know one from two, I mean.

Carmon's words succeeded in bamboozling Glenn "Israel shares my values" Beck, who told him: "This is amazing to me ... I appreciate all of your efforts. I appreciate what you do at Memri, it is important work."

It was indeed amazing, because in defending Memri's translation, Carmon took issue not only with CNN's Arabic department but also with all the Arabic grammar books. The word order in a typical Arabic sentence is not the same as in English: the verb comes first and so a sentence in Arabic which literally says "Are shooting at us the Jews" means "The Jews are shooting at us".

Good propaganda can't all be BS.

Gotta mix in some truth, some misdirection, some lies, and a dash of emotion.

a reply to: loam

I knew about the Hamas indoctrination to breed hatred among children, but I was shocked while watching it as well. I just didn't realized how deep the indoctrination goes.

Now I also understand why I saw the image below the other day, it makes even more sense now:

originally posted by: NthOther

originally posted by: loam

Don't see many Israeli children in that video...

True. But it's apparent that the indoctrination runs deep on both sides (I doubt this is the first time they've sung anti-Palestinian songs). It's not exactly fair (or intellectually honest) to criticize one side for callous brutality and not the other.

As an Israeli I can tell you this very clear and straight from the horse mouth.

Our indoctrination is not about hatred, it is about fear. We are raised to believe that our neighbors hate us and wants us dead, and we are raised in fear of Islam, countries and radical movements. From this fear hatred may derived, especially in times of war, but the preaching and the indoctrination is definitely not to hate and become a martyr (a shahid, die a holy death for the sake of jihad). You will never get this kind of poison here on TV, this is insanity.

a reply to: Shuye

That makes sense to me.

Thank you for posting your view.

a reply to: loam

I am so sick and tired of the human race. Greed, hate, violence, self importance, religion, bigotry, and a whole plethora of reasons are holding us back from what we could potentially accomplish. I wish the sole devotion of humanity was the acquisition of knowledge. If humanity took all the effort that's it has put into war and inventing new ways of killing each other, and put it into space exploration. I could be typing this message from alpha centari and not earth.


It's an absolute shame that I will never see the full potential of humanity because of such hate in the world.

a reply to: EternalSolace

I believe there is a lot of good in the world too. Not all of humanity is bad. I think it's important to remember that. Otherwise, all of these people killing each other shouldn't matter.

a reply to: loam

Granted, not all is evil in the world. But it doesn't take much to poison a water hole either.

a reply to: EternalSolace

No it doesn't...which is why vigilance should be the number one responsibility of the peaceful majority.

a reply to: loam

Crazy......I wonder how you would have to fight an enemy willing to do this. Is this only going to end with the extermination? Will one side have to totally exterminate the other?


I have pretty big issues with Israel and the arrogant inclusive attitude they have even towards friendly non Jews but after watching these videos I still relate more with them. At least they are not pushing hate filled propaganda cartoons..........What is wrong with these religious nut jobs?


Moderate Muslims really need to start distancing themselves from these.....the only word that fits is radical religious nut jobs.

Sorry but I am just too skeptical about the translations, and I am questioning the validity of the translations. Unless an Arabic speaker on ATS can confirm the translation I am going to reserve some doubt.

originally posted by: loam
a reply to: buster2010

....chances are they are not accurate.

Which is it? Are these specific videos mistranslated or not? I don't speak arabic.

And with regard to some of the images showing children dancing with weapons and bombs, I don't need to speak arabic to get what's going on there.

Israel does the same things with their kids.
When Israelis Teach Their Kids To Hate



So where is your the Palestinians have every right to afraid comment?

originally posted by: Shuye

originally posted by: NthOther

originally posted by: loam

Don't see many Israeli children in that video...

True. But it's apparent that the indoctrination runs deep on both sides (I doubt this is the first time they've sung anti-Palestinian songs). It's not exactly fair (or intellectually honest) to criticize one side for callous brutality and not the other.

As an Israeli I can tell you this very clear and straight from the horse mouth.

Our indoctrination is not about hatred, it is about fear. We are raised to believe that our neighbors hate us and wants us dead, and we are raised in fear of Islam, countries and radical movements. From this fear hatred may derived, especially in times of war, but the preaching and the indoctrination is definitely not to hate and become a martyr (a shahid, die a holy death for the sake of jihad). You will never get this kind of poison here on TV, this is insanity.

Funny this shows it isn't from fear but rather a want to kill. Israeli kids are taught the same bloodlust as the Palestinians.

a reply to: DerekJR321

Wow.... you really are reaching here... aren't you?

a reply to: buster2010

originally posted by: buster2010
So where is your the Palestinians have every right to afraid comment?

Seeing children exposed in this manner is disgusting to me no matter what side of the fence they are on. But frankly, I could drum up similar stills from any part of the world, including the US.






But I still notice you haven't addressed these children's shows- whose content rise to an altogether different level- other than to generally dismiss them as suspect.

Are the ones I posted specifically frauds or not?

I suspect you won't answer that because it apparently cuts against your misguided belief Israelis have nothing to fear from the likes of Hamas.