Ex-Minnesota governor says TV career halted by sniper's claims

originally posted by: sheepslayer247
It is my understanding that both kyle and Ventura served honorably for their country. It is beyond me to question that or judge either way.

But I do know many vets, including my father, step-father and brother (served in Iraq) and they DO NOT brag about their actions or conquests on the battlefield whatsoever.

To kill one man, let alone several, is not a mark of honor...but an emotional and psychological burden they must carry for the rest of their lives. I cannot begin to tell you what consequences come from taking a man's life.....but I'm sure a few of you know.

So, in my opinion, there is something wrong with Kyle altogether and I would not trust that man as far as I could throw him...and I could give him quite a toss.

It's possible that both sides of this issue are lying, but I have to question a man and his motives when he is willing to publish a book about being the "most lethal sniper in American history", and flaunt that all over the neo-con media machine.

You should probably read the book before passing such harsh judgement on the man.

The book is much more about the lives he saved, the friends he lost, the hardships he dealt with, the toll war takes on marriages, the struggle with balancing being a husband and father but feeling a duty to serve your country, the heroes he met, the needless death he witnessed.

He says in the prologue that he was contacted about making his story into a book and he decided to write it himself instead of letting someone embellish his story.

Chris Kyle was not a heartless killer. He was an exceptionally brave, selfless man doing the most difficult job in the world in the worst possible environment. He suffered greatly and, in his heart, he felt that it was his duty as an American to make sacrifices so others wouldn't have to.

a reply to: Answer

That doesn't mean he wasn't above faking an incident with the former governor. Every facet of Kyle's claim about punching Ventura reeks of BS. Kyle put it into a book making it libel. Publishing such libel is directly attacking Ventura's livelihood. He is a TV personality, former UDT member, and former governor, his reputation is everything. I think Ventura has no choice but to file this lawsuit to prove not only did the assault never happen but to refute Kyle's bogus claims that he would go to a soldiers wake and insult them, especially in front of the deceased's family, calling the soldiers "murderers" and "deserved to lose a few men." What a crock.

originally posted by: Blackmarketeer
a reply to: Answer

That doesn't mean he wasn't above faking an incident with the former governor. Every facet of Kyle's claim about punching Ventura reeks of BS. Kyle put it into a book making it libel. Publishing such libel is directly attacking Ventura's livelihood. He is a TV personality, former UDT member, and former governor, his reputation is everything. I think Ventura has no choice but to file this lawsuit to prove not only did the assault never happen but to refute Kyle's bogus claims that he would go to a soldiers wake and insult them, especially in front of the deceased's family, calling the soldiers "murderers" and "deserved to lose a few men." What a crock.

Except that several people who were at the bar that night have backed Chris Kyle's story and the only people backing Ventura are his friends who WERE NOT THERE and fanboys on Internet forums that like him just because he's a conspiracy nut.

I hope Taya Kyle countersues Ventura for defamation and emotional distress after his idiotic case is thrown out.

a reply to: Answer

And there are witnesses who also say no such fight took place (a Robert Leonard, Wayne Robertson) Kyle's witnesses came forward only after seven years and could only claim to have seen him punched but are vague on every other aspect of the story.

PS: the owner of the bar also says it never happened. (Jesse Ventura Gets Backing Of Former SEALs In Lawsuit Over “Punch” Hoax)

originally posted by: Blackmarketeer
a reply to: Answer

And there are witnesses who also say no such fight took place (a Robert Leonard, Wayne Robertson) Kyle's witnesses came forward only after seven years and could only claim to have seen him punched but are vague on every other aspect of the story.

PS: the owner of the bar also says it never happened. (Jesse Ventura Gets Backing Of Former SEALs In Lawsuit Over “Punch” Hoax)

Read the rest of the thread. The "owner of the bar" story is a sham.

a reply to: Answer

And Kyle's witnesses are also cronies of Kyle's. Debbie Lee, one of the witnesses, admits she took 26,000 from Kyle's estate. All the witness affidavits Kyle produced only came forward (seven years after the fact) after settlement talks failed between Ventura and Kyle. The fact that Kyle would meet with Ventura's attorney to discuss settling the matter privately looks odd. Now with Kyle gone and the publisher running the story full tilt to goose book sales, I don't see where Ventura has any choice but to file a defamation suit.

The publishers had a motivation for pushing the story, as admitted during the trial:

The subject of Chris Kyle’s Ventura story during TV and radio appearances came up Thursday morning, when more of his videotaped deposition was shown. Emails from publicists noted how book sales skyrocketed right after the shows, and they encouraged him to keep talking about Ventura. But considering it’s such a tiny portion of the book, not the subject, he grew uncomfortable. (source)

When you hear of one witness receiving money (26K) as 'proceeds' from the book sales because Kyle's heir wanted to share them 'for veteran causes,' it really calls into question about the motivation for these witnesses.

Regarding Moy, that sounds like the media's fault (or rather, Alex Jones) for making the claim he was the owner of the bar. I never heard Ventura or Moy himself make that claim.

If you don't think Kyle can tell lies, then what about his unsubstantiated claims to have shot two men dead at a Texas gas station? Kyle made that claim too, yet no police record, no town name given, no dead bodies.

Slain Navy sniper said he decked Jesse Ventura, but a second tale is disputed, too

The co-author of Kyle's book, James DeFelice, said in his deposition that he found Kyle "consistently honest and straightforward." But as Ventura and others dispute the punch story, questions have arisen about another incident Kyle is said to have talked about.

It involves Kyle shooting two men at a Texas gas station. There's nothing about it in Kyle's book, but Marcus Luttrell, another former SEAL-turned-author, gives a detailed account in his 2012 book, "Service: A Navy SEAL at War."

Luttrell wrote that Kyle had stopped at a gas station near Dallas and was filling up his truck when two men -- each with a pistol -- approached him and demanded his vehicle. Kyle sized them up and told them he had to reach into his truck to get the keys, Luttrell wrote.

Mooney's piece in D Magazine describes what Kyle reportedly did next:

"He turned around and reached under his winter coat instead, into his waistband. With his right hand, he grabbed his Colt 1911. He fired two shots under his left armpit, hitting the first man twice in the chest. Then he turned slightly and fired two more times, hitting the second man twice in the chest. Both men fell dead.

"Kyle leaned on his truck and waited for the police."

Mooney has written that Kyle told him the incident was true. Kyle claimed that it was caught on the gas station's surveillance video, and that when police arrived, he gave them a phone number to call, although he wouldn't say who the number belonged to.

Mooney wrote that Kyle told him the officers called the number, "were very understanding" and let him go.

Luttrell wrote that the incident "never made the news, since the town involved didn't want the publicity."

But Mooney and other reporters have been unable to corroborate the story. Mooney pinpointed the approximate locale, at a gas station near Cleburne on U.S. 67 south of Dallas, but local officials up and down the highway told him they'd never heard of the incident.

Mooney said he's been unable to find any police reports or any other records indicating the incident or anything similar took place.

Really? Two dead bodies lying there, and the police just 'let him go.' Kyle made this claim, and it sounds like as big a whopper as punching Ventura.

a reply to: buster2010

The publisher was caught sending Kyle emails showing how books sales skyrocketed once Kyle hit the circuit boasting about slugging Jesse Ventura. From there the story took on a life of its own. Kyle talked himself into a corner with a fake story, and I think it's one of the reasons he became reluctant about it, he knew he'd get called out on it. He did meet to discuss a settlment over it, but that didn't work out. Now it's down to the trial.

a reply to: Blackmarketeer

Here is more to that story blackmark

Sniper shooting in Cleburne a hoax

According to a Feb. 7 story published on Star-Telegram.com, Kyle apparently shot two armed robbers on a “bitterly cold morning in early January 2009” at an unnamed Cleburne gas station. The website references the story as written in the book “Service: A Navy SEAL at War” by Marcus Luttrell.

According to Luttrell’s book, the two armed men accosted Kyle while he was gassing up and demanded his truck. Kyle allegedly “put his hands up and told them he was going to reach into the truck to get his keys” before reaching into his coat for a waistband holster and shooting both men.

The story does not name the two men allegedly shot.

Michael J. Mooney of D Magazine said Kyle confirmed the story, according to Star-Telegram.com.

Johnson County Sheriff Bob Alford and District Attorney Dale Hanna both said on Friday that they never heard the alleged story until recently and have no knowledge of any fatal shootings at a gas station in Cleburne or Johnson County in January 2009.

“I never heard of it,” Alford said. “And if something like that happened here I would have heard of it, and I’m sure you all at the newspaper would have heard of it.”

Marcus Luttrell is also one of Kyle's "star witnesses" writing his own book about Kyle. He looks like he's following Kyle's lead and embellishing his book with fake tales of bad-assery.

I lost all respect for Kyle when he decided to put a gun in the hands of seriously disturbed ex-soldier suffering PTSD. Several lives were lost that day, not just Kyle's. Kyle's penchant for running with the fake tales of heroics sounds like he relished the attention.

originally posted by: buster2010
a reply to: macman

I know the people I have spoken to will/have backed Kyle and what he said happened.

Ask these people you know if they knew Kyle was a well known liar. He has been proven to have lied to boost his ego. Like the time he said he killed two guys who were trying to car jack him. The police said it never happened. He also said he shot 300 looters in New Orleans after Katrina but his commander said he wasn't even in the area.

But, here is what I don't get. How did Jesse's show get cancelled by a comment in a book, that didn't identify him?

Because Kyle went on tv and said it was him. You can say anything you want but when you bad mouth dead veterans you can count your tv career is pretty much over.

I missed your post the first time around Buster - here is another good link that goes over the Kyle claim that he mass-murdered American citizens in New Orleans during Katrina:

Did Blackwater Snipers REALLY Kill Thousands of Katrina "Victims"

In early 2012, I had an unexpected conversation with my friend Chris Kyle (author of American Sniper) about the Katrina debacle. I had heard rumblings about Special Operations (mainly SEALs) snipers being deployed to New Orleans to support the effort to restore order. He confirmed the rumors and shared his own intimate knowledge that close contacts of his, many who were apparently still serving on active duty, took leave to work for the controversial PMC (Private Military Company),Blackwater.

Chris went on to tell me that the bulk of the guys he knew directly had racked up over thirty kills between them near and around the Super Dome. I asked him about Rules of Engagement, and asked, “Who were they shooting at,” and he just gave me a big Texas shrug and smile. I figured out really quick that it was 180 grains of due process (usually to the head at 200M).

Steve Hynd is understandably upset.

Coming from such a source, these accusations have to be taken seriously – accusations that US military snipers killed US citizens inside the US with no due process of law whatsoever, acting as judge jury and executioner. The Bush administration would have to have signed off on the whole thing.

I'd love to hear some of the Kyle defenders justify this. If it's true they should be screaming for Bush's head and Kyle should be labeled a mass murderer. If it's not true, then we can settle the matter that Chris Kyle is a liar and fraud.

Heck, the military can't even confirm the guy had any kills as a sniper, let alone was the "most lethal". For all we know, Kyle is just a SEAL sniper who lied his ass off in a book on his way to glory fame and riches.

We have two stories now from Kyle, that are proven to be false. Why should we believe his Ventura story?

a reply to: oxykerfluffle

I thought the story was more a Marcus Luttrell invention, but the story did indeed come straight from the mouth of Kyle, as he reiterated it in interviews:

Here’s What American Sniper Chris Kyle Said About His Killing Two Men at a Gas Station in 2009

He said: “You mean the time I shot two guys trying to steal my truck?”

I sat there stunned for a few seconds. The incredible story I’d heard, I figured there was no way it was true.

“It’s true,” he said.

Apparently not true, as the police have publicly admitted. What is bizarre is that Kyle upped his bluff by stating that police up and down Texas have all confirmed the story, watched, as he claims, the (non-existent) video, sent him congratulatory missives on "cleaning up the streets..." etc. But when it came down to it, the only police to make any public comments on it have stated the story is false. Not just false but mega-false. No dead bodies, no police report.

I'm starting to view both Kyle and Luttrell as self-serving fibbers, working on a post-seal career of Hollywood aggrandizement.

It is funny that he wants to blame something else now for his failed show. When it was on he ranted about how there was a conspiracy to not have truetv air his show. he went on and on about this on alex jones show way before the event with cris kyle. I remember them talking before his seasons would air about how they would not reair his shows much either. It just takes him to a whole other level to now try to blame a book for all the people out there that do not believe in conspiracies. If anyone is to blame it is the people on sites like ats that go out of their way to try to debunk any conspiracy. Then you also have to give credit to the ones like me that see events in a whole different light and appear to be crazy and labeled fringe. Grow up jesse.

originally posted by: Blackmarketeer


I'm starting to view both Kyle and Luttrell as self-serving fibbers, working on a post-seal career of Hollywood aggrandizement.

Seeing as the actions of the SEAL community as a whole is to ostracize those that lie, and that neither have been.
It lends to the fact that these things did happen.

Are you aware of protocol used for when certain members of the military are stopped and detained by LE?
Those members are usually given a free pass for many many things.
And, if not a free pass, things are reviewed for legality and if there is no wrong doing, they are dealt with.

a reply to: macman

Are you aware of protocol used for when certain members of the military are stopped and detained by LE?
Those members are usually given a free pass for many many things.
And, if not a free pass, things are reviewed for legality and if there is no wrong doing, they are dealt with.

You are honestly suggesting that Kyle shot dead two people in Taxas and that Texas LE just let him walk, no arrest, no detention, all because he was a "certain member of the military." It's almost laughable how ludicrous this statement is. I suppose the Texas PD dragged the bodies off into a ditch and sent Kyle on his way...?

We know Kyle's story was full of BS, and the police chief in the town Kyle claimed this happened said straight up it was bull.

Jesse Ventura wins defamation lawsuit against Chris Kyle

ST. PAUL, Minn. (AP) _ Jury awards ex-Minnesota Gov. Jesse Ventura $1.8 million in defamation suit over sniper memoir.

Ventura total damages in defamation lawsuit: $500k for defamation, $1.3m for unjust enrichment.

Source - NYtimes.com
Source - Startribune.com
Source - inforwars.com
Source - Minnesota.cbslocal.com

Defamation cases are notoriously difficult to win.

I'm glad to see this. Now the people spewing all this hate rhetoric about JV over this incident can go crawl back into their hole. I'll be even more interested to read the actual court transcripts if they're ever released.

I believe certain people around the 2012 election were scared to death that he may actually run on the same ticket as Ron Paul. Especially with the background of being the only independent ever to win a governorship.

Regardless if you like the guy or not, he is one of the few, if not the only one alive, who could challenge the system if elected POTUS. When I say "challenge" I mean making common sense decisions that benefit all the people, not just the banking and corporate elite.

It is still not too late for him too donate the money back too the wounded vetrans. Afterall he did say it was not about the money. His claim of someone else other than himself defaming his character is and always will be absurd. There is a reason conspiracies are not mainstream and that reason has nothing to do with cris kyle or his actions in the past. Not to mention the fact that he is hiding from some very good shots.

a reply to: Blackmarketeer

*Sigh* and again, it is very much the norm in the SF and SEAL world that if they were lying about these things, they would not have a community to rely on.
Please show me where this has happened................


Also, I never said that the cops dragged people anywhere.
If no law was broken, it is swept under the rug.

For example, military members that are part of Nuke Teams, there are indicators that will come up when LE interacts with them, much like with Ambassadors and when Congress is in session.

SO, you know the story is untrue because??????????????? The DailyKos said so??

Back in the 80's i watched a vietnam vet drag his girlfriend out of his truck. He then made her lie down in front of the truck and ran her over then got out and shot her. police came and left and he was back to drinking beer by the end of the day. he lived a free man intil around 2010 when he was found dead in the woods from a shot gun blast to the head. It was ruled sucide. It may not be as prevelant now days but i could tell more stories of vets being left alone for crimes due to the mental state they were put in for the benefit of the u.s.a.