Climate change caused empire's fall, tree rings reveal

It happened when?

Those ancient Egyptians were *totally* known for their huge factories, automobiles, plastics and other things that cause pollution...they should have bought carbon credits. Would have *totally* saved them.

I've ALWAYS said it's a natural cycle, and what man is doing is of negligible effect, in comparison with what happens in nature on it's own.

I do think we pollute our environment and things need to be done to curb it. Carbon credits however, nor penalties are NOT the answer. The answer (simplified) is to offer INCENTIVES to have companies and people WANT to clean up and/or find solutions to reducing/stopping pollution. By offering companies (for example) incentives to help find solutions for reducing/stopping pollution for the products they make, would allow them to create jobs, which in turn would create more tax revenue for the Gov't and in turn, the economy would actually recover. The people who think mans impact on climate change is huge, they win because the pollution is reduced and/or stopped. Those who want the pollution cleaned up (who don't buy CC as it sits) get what they want. The future generations also win as pollution is reduced and/or stopped, innovations could continue in this arena, even quite possibly leading up to new uses for byproducts being turned into alternative energy.

The solution won't work if it's negative, it will only work if positive.

Carbon credits won't magically make pollution have less of an impact (whatever your views maybe). Those who think that funding from buying those credits would go to the actual stated causes, stop and think about how little, if any of it would go there. All the programs the Gov't has put itself in charge of, all become over regulated, inefficient, funding is usually stripped and given to other projects or misused in their entirety. The whole project becomes a giant financial liability and even simple yes or no answers require several forms to be filled out, an egregious amount of time and resources to be handled....all to hear back by mail, usually several pieces of the same answer arrive. Heaven forbid there's a typo or one form wasn't completed right...or the process starts all over.

Need to find solutions through incentives, not punishments.

originally posted by: JohnnyCanuck
Dendrochronology provides a solid date to the collapse of Egypt's Akkadian Empire...and presents further implications!

A handful of tree ring samples stored in an old cigar box have shed unexpected light on the ancient world, thanks to research by archaeologist Sturt Manning and collaborators at Cornell, Arizona, Chicago, Oxford and Vienna...

Link

You misread.

Egypt had no Akkadian Empire.

Sorry if this was already corrected, but I'm at work and don't have time to go through the whole thread.

The article states that climate was the cause of collapse for both the Egyptian civ. at the time and the Akkadian Empire (Mesopotamia.)

Harte

a reply to: MarlinGrace

And now tree rings show extreme climate change over a short period of time.

What sort of climate change was it? Was it a sudden warming?

It's interesting that the 4.2 kiloyear event seems to be part of a 1500 year cycle though, the last swing coinciding with the Little Ice Age. Doesn't seem that were due for another for a thousand years or so.

Is it just me or is all credibility gone at this point for "Man Made Climate Change"?

It's not just you. But just because climate changes for natural reasons, it does not mean that it can't happen for unnatural reasons. We don't see the natural causes at play in the current warming trend.

originally posted by: BlackboxInquiry
It happened when?

Those ancient Egyptians were *totally* known for their huge factories, automobiles, plastics and other things that cause pollution...they should have bought carbon credits. Would have *totally* saved them.

I've ALWAYS said it's a natural cycle, and what man is doing is of negligible effect, in comparison with what happens in nature on it's own.

I do think we pollute our environment and things need to be done to curb it. Carbon credits however, nor penalties are NOT the answer. The answer (simplified) is to offer INCENTIVES to have companies and people WANT to clean up and/or find solutions to reducing/stopping pollution. By offering companies (for example) incentives to help find solutions for reducing/stopping pollution for the products they make, would allow them to create jobs, which in turn would create more tax revenue for the Gov't and in turn, the economy would actually recover. The people who think mans impact on climate change is huge, they win because the pollution is reduced and/or stopped. Those who want the pollution cleaned up (who don't buy CC as it sits) get what they want. The future generations also win as pollution is reduced and/or stopped, innovations could continue in this arena, even quite possibly leading up to new uses for byproducts being turned into alternative energy.

The solution won't work if it's negative, it will only work if positive.

Carbon credits won't magically make pollution have less of an impact (whatever your views maybe). Those who think that funding from buying those credits would go to the actual stated causes, stop and think about how little, if any of it would go there. All the programs the Gov't has put itself in charge of, all become over regulated, inefficient, funding is usually stripped and given to other projects or misused in their entirety. The whole project becomes a giant financial liability and even simple yes or no answers require several forms to be filled out, an egregious amount of time and resources to be handled....all to hear back by mail, usually several pieces of the same answer arrive. Heaven forbid there's a typo or one form wasn't completed right...or the process starts all over.

Need to find solutions through incentives, not punishments.

Looks to me like they knew the answer the whole time:

Air Force Bombshell: Admits They Can Control Weather – HAARP

originally posted by: Harte

originally posted by: JohnnyCanuck
Dendrochronology provides a solid date to the collapse of Egypt's Akkadian Empire...and presents further implications!

A handful of tree ring samples stored in an old cigar box have shed unexpected light on the ancient world, thanks to research by archaeologist Sturt Manning and collaborators at Cornell, Arizona, Chicago, Oxford and Vienna...

Link

You misread. Egypt had no Akkadian Empire. Sorry if this was already corrected, but I'm at work and don't have time to go through the whole thread. The article states that climate was the cause of collapse for both the Egyptian civ. at the time and the Akkadian Empire (Mesopotamia.) Harte

My bad. The irony is that I went back and inserted Egypt to give it context. Wrong context. Thanks for the correction.

originally posted by: Phage
a reply to: MarlinGrace

And now tree rings show extreme climate change over a short period of time.

What sort of climate change was it? Was it a sudden warming?

It's interesting that the 4.2 kiloyear event seems to be part of a 1500 year cycle though, the last swing coinciding with the Little Ice Age. Doesn't seem that were due for another for a thousand years or so.

Is it just me or is all credibility gone at this point for "Man Made Climate Change"?

It's not just you. But just because climate changes for natural reasons, it does not mean that it can't happen for unnatural reasons. We don't see the natural causes at play in the current warming trend.

Okay, Phage, I've finally got you!

Man is as "natural" as anything else in nature. Why consider what man has done "unnatural?"

LOL!

Harte

originally posted by: JohnnyCanuck

originally posted by: Harte

You misread. Egypt had no Akkadian Empire. Sorry if this was already corrected, but I'm at work and don't have time to go through the whole thread. The article states that climate was the cause of collapse for both the Egyptian civ. at the time and the Akkadian Empire (Mesopotamia.) Harte

My bad. The irony is that I went back and inserted Egypt to give it context. Wrong context. Thanks for the correction.

Not a problem, really. Just the result of my compulsion for utter correctness.

Harte

a reply to: JohnnyCanuck

It seems that the mere mention of the words 'climate change' in connexion with anything is all it takes to get the denialists up in arms. I found the information you posted interesting in its own right and did not connect it with any political issue. Thank you for posting it.

Will this climate change non-sense never end? It's too old, let go, nobody listens to techno... lol

It's like it is some kind of revelation to some people! Omgz... The climate changes and is coming to get us!!! It must be something I did to incur such wrath of the gods!...

No, no not really, just natural cycles and we're just gonna have to get used to it! What the hell you crying about? Humanity hae never been in a better position to deal with it! We have technology coming out our ears!

But no, we humans think we can control the earth! Lmao... Oh jeez...

We don't know fully how everything works, but yeah, we know how to control it... Really easy actuallt, Steal off everyone! Problem solved...

Hey Guys..

This is quite interesting..It coincides with the findings of the Potsdam Institute (Martin Claussen) and what they discovered through their techniques,that is, Egypt underwent dramatic climate change (because it was very lush and not desertified before this period) they determined it was due to a shift in the Earths axis.

Now, i've looked a wee bit into this and bringing up the subject of tree rings,there was an ancient forest discovered off the coast of Wales (UK) uncovered by storms late last year,carbon dated to a period of 3500-4000 years ago,interestingly the same can be found off the coast,on the East Coast of the US dated to the same period.If you are familiar with the Bimini Road Carribean? this also was dated to a similar period,well 3600 years ago...(indicating a shift in the tectonic plates,Mid Atlantic ridge) plus there are many eyamples worldwide.Simply put after 'digging around' it is clear there was a global event in this time period!! I highly recommend the works of Immanuel Velikovsky,He has made some outstanding documentation about this global event.

There are scientists who support the idea that a single volcano can out produce,a years worth of manmade Co2 (likely more) in a single day!! Of coarse we are having a detrimental effect on this planet by our 'footprint' but to suggest it is all manmade is part of the cover up and utter BS.We have all the planets in the Solar System heating up incidentally and much,much more evidence pointing to the cause of this phenomena coming from space.

So in summary,THE most plausible cause of this is the Planet X/Brown Dwarf hypothesis.I am open to new ideas always but the weight of evidence suggests there is a Brown Dwarf with an approximate orbit of 3600 years causing this cyclical destruction....Look around we are nearing a climax..The tectonic plates are shifting in a big way and of coarse so is the weather.

Just my 2 quid.

Keep your ears to the ground!

a reply to: Buddyman

There are scientists who support the idea that a single volcano can out produce,a years worth of manmade Co2 (likely more) in a single day!!

What scientists would that be?

I am open to new ideas always but the weight of evidence suggests there is a Brown Dwarf with an approximate orbit of 3600 years causing this cyclical destruction

There is no evidence which supports this. A brown dwarf with an orbit of 3,600 years would have been detected by the WISE mission, among other things.

Luhman's study found 762 new objects among the data, but no signs of a Saturn-sized object out to 10,000 times the Earth-sun distance (an astronomical unit, or AU; 1 AU is about 93 million miles, or 150 million kilometers). Nor did Luhman spot any Jupiter-size or larger objects out to 26,000 AUs.

www.space.com...

One thing I was surprised to learn recently is that Norway's glaciers in Roman times were nearly non existent, so I presume it was quite warm in Roman times, seeing as southern Britain in those days had vineyards.
Now the 'collapse' of the Roman empire was due to the internecine warfare of one legion fighting another to put their own general on the emperors throne, thereby weakening the whole army, and allowing the 'barbarian's' to flood in from the north east.
Rome itself imported corn (now known as wheat) from all over the empire, especially Egypt, so droughts were not the whole cause of the collapse.