Harvard allows Satanic black mass

originally posted by: Krazysh0t
a reply to: Stormdancer777

How very classy of you, play the race/bigot card.

For your information, no one has talked bad about Christianity in this thread. I don't know why you are adopting the martyr complex here. We have been talking about Satanism, or is a bunch of people observing a mock black mass somehow bigoted towards Christianity?

Yet you posted. . .

It's funny how if something makes Christians uncomfortable, they start making up scare stories and claims about it. I'm not even a Satanist and I've learned more about it from debating misinformed and obnoxious Christians than I ever knew about it before.

On behalf of all us "obnoxious" Christians, I'd like to humbly apologise for any misinformation that may have been sent your way.

a reply to: namehere

I agree with you about religious freedom, it wasn't ever meant to be used in an aggressive manner but it has been since the beginning hasn't it? I can't really blame people for fighting back and there's an important lesson to be learned here and hypocrisy to be exposed. There definitely are antagonistic atheists but why shouldn't there be? Isn't it aggressive Christians who keep on insisting government be interwoven with their religion? Prayer in public schools, opening Congress with prayer, Ten Commandments in court houses, laws over the human body (sodomy, abortion) based on Christian (though these particular issues are not strictly Christian) ethics.

It is against the 1st Amendment for government to represent a religion, but that's exactly what's happening. It either has to be all or none. All means this building of resentment that you mention and I agree. All also represents a logistical nightmare, courthouse walls covered in religious symbols and text from all religions, hours of prayer before Congress can open or the school day begin.

Most non-Christians have no problem at all with Christians, I don't... what I have a problem with is anything being shoved down my throat in flaunted in my face. I wouldn't want a Christian to be made uncomfortable by sitting through a Satanic prayer, why do they want anyone offended or uncomfortable by making anyone else sit through theirs. Moments of silence serve much better but some lessons can only be learned the hard way it seems and I fully support teaching those lessons. All or none.

a reply to: Kali74

I'm not responding to you specifically, but does anyone know what May 12th is on the satanic calendar? Any special astrological importance on this date. These people don't do things without a reason - just wondering if anyone knows.

a reply to: Happy1

Doesn't seem to be anything...

Satanic Calendar

MAY

24 Ascension day: Rituals to mock the ascension of Jesus Christ into heaven.

They are not Satanists, anyway. They're also doing a Shinto tea ceremony, a Shaker exhibition and a Buddhist presentation on meditation for their Cultural Studies.

a reply to: Happy1

I don't nor do I care. But you do remind me of a point I wanted to make in my last post but forgot to. This is a private school and here we have people getting all upset and outraged over a religious (mock at that) ceremony taking place behind private doors, yet non-Christians are subjected everyday to Christianity in our laws and government but the atheists are the bad guys? Do you think Christianity offends no one?

a reply to: Benevolent Heretic

exactly my point, these kind of atheists are only repeating the mistakes of christians that they learned instead of moving past it and trying to change things for the better. just as christians and muslims did towards pagans in the beginning but the problem is that unlike in those times the major religions being challenged by the "new" belief are still growing and atheism/non-religion is shrinking as a whole so that behavior is dangerous for them.

i'm just saying all this because i fear they have forgotten how extreme people can be and keep running their mouth without thinking about what might happen if they push things too far, "free speech" won't protect them forever especially when the more conservative sects are gaining popularity and followers faster than the other sects of the abrahamic religions.

they need to stop this kind of stuff while things remain subdued and calm, otherwise i see a bad future for them if things keep going this way for too much longer.

originally posted by: beezzer

originally posted by: Krazysh0t
a reply to: Stormdancer777

How very classy of you, play the race/bigot card.

For your information, no one has talked bad about Christianity in this thread. I don't know why you are adopting the martyr complex here. We have been talking about Satanism, or is a bunch of people observing a mock black mass somehow bigoted towards Christianity?

Yet you posted. . .

It's funny how if something makes Christians uncomfortable, they start making up scare stories and claims about it. I'm not even a Satanist and I've learned more about it from debating misinformed and obnoxious Christians than I ever knew about it before.

On behalf of all us "obnoxious" Christians, I'd like to humbly apologise for any misinformation that may have been sent your way.

Explain to me how that is supposedly bigoted? It's something that is presently occurring in the thread. Heck I'm been talking to one who claimed that a blood mass involves the rape of a virgin, yet I've proved to him that it isn't true, yet he persists. He has also said he is a Christian. All the non-Christians are fine with this, because they know it doesn't affect them. What I said is a statement of fact, all the people upset with this are Christians and they are saying things that are misinformed and wrong. And of course, none of that even matters since this is a private institution. They, nor I get no say in what Harvard does or doesn't do. I'm getting tired of repeating that.

ETA: One more thing, if none of that applies to you, then I'm not talking about you.

a reply to: Kali74

I'm not upset and outraged. I'm saddened. Most religions are intended to raise and endorse positive entities and values. Satanism is selfishness.

1.Satan represents indulgence instead of abstinence.
2.Satan represents vital existence instead of spiritual pipe dreams.
3.Satan represents undefiled wisdom instead of hypocritical self-deceit.
4.Satan represents kindness to those who deserve it instead of love wasted on ingrates.
5.Satan represents vengeance instead of turning the other cheek.
6.Satan represents responsibility to the responsible instead of concern for psychic vampires.
7.Satan represents man as just another animal, sometimes better, more often worse than those that walk on all-fours, who, because of his "divine spiritual and intellectual development", has become the most vicious animal of all.
8.Satan represents all of the so-called sins, as they all lead to physical, mental, or emotional gratification.
9.Satan has been the best friend the Church has ever had, as He has kept it in business all these years

And you can talk all you want about how this isn't evil, but live this philosophy out to its logical conclusion and the world becomes a cold, selfish and ultimately evil place.

There is no Golden Rule here.

a reply to: ketsuko

That may be, but that is a personal choice that the person alone should make.

a reply to: beezzer

One of the very things that turned me away from fundamental Christianity is the tendency on blaming others, situations or supernatural forces with no evidence or basis in reality; Strictly on faith.

The martyrdom and victim meme seems to be so ingrained in contemporary Christianity and it is such a convenient way to avoid taking responsibility for individual actions as well as Christianity as a whole.

There is an irony there....I'm sure you can see it.

The innocent Hero/Victim concept is such a cop out and lame exaggeration!


personalityspirituality.net...

I could pull up the Palin witchcraft you tube video to illustrate my point but I'll avoid the "temptation"

a reply to: olaru12

I do agree, and in any conventional thread on religion, I'd have my own choice opinions.

But apparently having faith on ATS is the new taboo and I find myself defending more than I feel comfortable with, on occasion.

As for Satanists or satanic rituals, I can only go back to what I've said before.

Since I AM a person who believes in things often scoffed at (and insulted) here, I can say that there are things that are best not approached.

Of course, this is just my primitive, ignorant opinion.

originally posted by: beezzer




Of course, this is just my primitive, ignorant opinion.

Of course we get the sarcasm....we also get that you are still playing the victim.

Do you need a hug?

originally posted by: namehere
exactly my point, these kind of atheists are only repeating the mistakes of christians that they learned instead of moving past it and trying to change things for the better.

These people are not forcing their views on people. They're simply exploring a culture. Even real Satanists aren't forcing others to live by their beliefs. They're just expressing their own.

the major religions being challenged by the "new" belief are still growing and atheism/non-religion is shrinking as a whole so that behavior is dangerous for them.

I don't think this is true.

Or, actually on topic since we are discussing a program by the Satanic Temple and not the Church of Satan ... we could try to be a wee bit more honest ...

The mission of The Satanic Temple is to encourage benevolence and empathy among all people. In addition, we embrace practical common sense and justice. As Satanists we all should be guided by our conscience to undertake noble pursuits guided by our individual wills. We believe that this is the hope of all mankind and the highest aspiration of humanity.

As an organized religion, we feel it is our function to actively provide outreach, to lead by example, and to participate public affairs wheresoever the issues might benefit from rational, Satanic insights.

There are seven fundamental tenets.

1 One should strive to act with compassion and empathy towards all creatures in accordance with reason.

2 The struggle for justice is an ongoing and necessary pursuit that should prevail over laws and institutions.

3 One’s body is inviolable, subject to one’s own will alone.

4 The freedoms of others should be respected, including the freedom to offend. To willfully and unjustly encroach upon the freedoms of another is to forego your own.

5 Beliefs should conform to our best scientific understanding of the world. We should take care never to distort scientific facts to fit our beliefs.

6 People are fallible. If we make a mistake, we should do our best to rectify it and resolve any harm that may have been caused.

7 Every tenet is a guiding principle designed to inspire nobility in action and thought. The spirit of compassion, wisdom, and justice should always prevail over the written or spoken word.

a reply to: ketsuko

It doesn't matter what you think a religion is, if you think it's good or bad. If one religion is going to be allowed in government, it has to be all of them even ones you don't like. Otherwise the argument for keeping Church and State separate is by default, correct (which it absolutely is correct). If you say yes to prayer in schools and the rest of it but then say Satanism shouldn't be allowed, you are essentially NOT arguing for liberty of anything but your own.

Yes prayers in school! Liberty!
Wait... not that one!

originally posted by: olaru12

originally posted by: beezzer




Of course, this is just my primitive, ignorant opinion.

Of course we get the sarcasm....we also get that you are still playing the victim.

Do you need a hug?

Just a cookie.

And no, no victim me.

Just saving the more "enlightened, erudite" among us some time.

a reply to: swanne

It's been around for ages.

And it's just about run it's course.

Some people (such as LaVey) even think that mere secularism means you have to go on and call yourself a satanist.

Can I back up for a minute and inquire as to why anyone who is not going to be at Harvard tied to a chair and forced to observe this "performance" really gives a hoot?

I mean, is it just the idea that such a thing might happen somewhere?

originally posted by: Gryphon66
Can I back up for a minute and inquire as to why anyone who is not going to be at Harvard tied to a chair and forced to observe this "performance" really gives a hoot?

I mean, is it just the idea that such a thing might happen somewhere?

As I stated earlier, they are legally free to do so.

I just think they are stupid.

I am still allowed to think they are stupid, aren't I?

Just a comment.

Does anyone else think this is a kind of strange:

DREW Faust
President of Harvard University
Lincoln Professor of History

As in Faustian?

Just a weird co-winky-dink