Where is all the Military gear coming from??

a reply to: Wrabbit2000

S&F!

With $700 Billion U$D spent on USA defense per year, the DoD could instead pay everybody on earth about $100 and as most of the world lives on $1 a day ... that would be purchasing about 1/4 to 1/3 of a years living wages for most of the planet!

And that ^^^ would go a long way to freeing people from poverty as they could save 1/4 to 1/3rd of a years wages and those kind of savings go a long way to dealing a death blow to poverty!

It doesn't matter what the money is spent on as long as the effect is to help ensure the USA's security!

a reply to: Wrabbit2000

I understand what you are saying.

I like your example of owning a minigun. You can own one so do I think the police should too. Well, no I don't think the police should own one. Now if we were coming across criminals who had miniguns and using them against citizens and us, then maybe it would be justified. We are not though.

We are however, seeing attacks against the public with AR 15's and AK 47's. So it is kind of a straw man arugement when you bring up air support, at 4's and minguns.

You must not understand the ballistics behind the .223/.556 much because I was not talking about expensive frangible ammo. 55 grain M193 and the numerous 75/77grain loads penetrate less then handgun rounds.

Look when they start ordering me to carry my AR 15 at the ready during standard patrol duties I will have a problem. When they start issuing armored vehicles as the standard patrol vehicle I will have a problem. When they want me to wear level IV armor and a tac vest everyday I will have a problem. When they start adding anti tank guns to those armored personal carriers I will have a problem.

I am sorry I just don't see the issue with an officer having access to a semi automatic rifle and an armored vehicle for response to emergencies. We disagree and that is okay. That is the beautiful thing about this country.

a reply to: Wrabbit2000

Okay I am glad you made your stance known. I respect your opinion, but disagree with it. No worries.

originally posted by: TorqueyThePig
a reply to: Wrabbit2000

I think what irritates me the most about people complaining about the gear that police officers are receiving or already have, is the fact that it can all be owned by any citizen (that legally can). Well except for maybe flashbangs. However, as a patrol officer I cannot have flashbangs either.

Anyone can purchase an AR15, suppressors, pre ban fully auto weapons or short barreled rifles (with tax stamp which I think is unconstitutional), night vision, IR lasers, certain forms of CS gas, smoke, body armor and armored vehicles.

Sad to hear.
And I thiNk we all know who to thank foR thAt.

a reply to: TorqueyThePig

Fair enough all around and the country is made stronger by constructive disagreement, not weaker. As I was saying to someone recently on something totally different. If you pursue your beliefs with energy and I pursue my beliefs with energy, the outcome, in theory, comes somewhere around the middle for reality. Probably about where it ought to be for any objective look, eh?

a reply to: Wrabbit2000

Just by the paint scheme on the source picture, I bet those are original M-1s with the older 105 mm gun and early armor package. Most of those were built in the late 70s/early 80s and were then replaced in the very late 80s/90s with the M1A1 and on up.

a reply to: SrWingCommander

It wouldn't surprise me if CNN didn't even send someone out there to photograph but used file photos. There is quite a bit more to that place and the whole "make tanks because it's more expensive to stop making them" B.S.. Oh...how many trillions have been wasted over the long term by that kind of stinkin' thinkin'?

The area north of Reno is M1 tanks tho, and was being added to into recent times as other material shows. Heck, they probably just called down to their image morgue and said 'hey...someone find a pic of a tank please!'. After all, you recall the Democratic National Convention don't you? Showing a line of Russian warships on parade, thinking they were American ships wasn't deliberate IMO. It was just this same kind of sloppy work because no one cares by tomorrow anyway.

originally posted by: macman
a reply to: Wrabbit2000

en.wikipedia.org...

It is a way for the Fed Govt to strike down the public, and skirt the laws.

Since the Military can't be used, stand the LE agencies up with the same equipment.

I tend to think this is true. Based on this 37 second clip, Obama says it himself.


It's not like he minced his words...loud and clear what he said.

Des

a reply to: Destinyone

That is where we are headed. Except it is not as sugary and nice as he stated it.

The military hardware just adds to the general bad attitude between modern policing and the public with the attitude being the main problem in my opinion.

When I see officers who are decked out in fatigues (I don't care if their practical or not) instead of normal uniforms, smartass sunglasses and a bad countenance in their general expressions and interactions with their employers I get very disturbed at where this country has arrived today.

For too long it seems there is an us against them attitude that has fostered many unfortunate instances of breach of duty by police across this land.

Us used to be law abiding citizens and police against them, them being criminals, now the citizenry seems to be treated just as the criminal element until proved otherwise, sometimes after the citizen is dead and no longer can speak for themselves.

I think the military hardware is just another symptom of a larger underlying problem, the problem is one of resorting to intimidation in look, action and attitude which is a cover for bad policing practice.

Sure I'm using a broad brush here as I know not all police officers fit this description - its my wish those who don't endeavor to rid their departments of the many officers who do - you know the ones that continually provide the news with atrocity after atrocity - yea them.

Until you "good" police, police your own then I shant believe your bleetings about how good you are! prove it! and stop having good citizens having to prove that's just what they are.