The People will revolt, just not while "they" are looking.

Years of people from other countries saying things like, "why don't the American people do something", and "as long as they have TV Americans will never revolt."

Yeah, no.

Being baited, cajoled, prodded, and provoked, for generations; we have shown the patients of Gandhi. To the point that it seems as though nothing can provoke us to take action. And this is true. We will not be provoked. But that doesn't mean that judgment day isn't coming.

It will happen like this.
When things start working, when justice seems to be on the upswing, when trust and faith in Authority seems restored, and the owners of this country have the media start celebrating how much better things are, how we made it, and how the dark days are behind us. Then, the hammers will start to fall.



I understand that this may seem obtuse to some, and irrelevant to others. But the day after, people will look back and say "he was right."

Mike Grouchy

reply to post by mikegrouchy


As long as the "divide and conquer" tactic are working, as long as it's "you're either with us or against us" mentality that persists, Americans and the world will be victimized by TPTB.

Jesus was right, the only way out of this mess is to "love your enemy". True "righteousness" is only found hiding, buried under the most seemingly defeated. In reality, it's the disenfranchised masses, when working together that can effect change.

I would argue the people that say why doesnt America revolt. don't realize how big our nation really is.

Other countries call us stupid because because we do not speak several languages. Live in Europe how many languages are spoken within say a 500 mile radius? or 1000 mile radius? 3,4 7? in the US it is 1. well maybe 2 with spanish that we kinda hate.

They say revolt..over what? illegal aliens taking over Texas? or the over fishing of lobsters in Boston?

Our country is huge and diverse. Should we revolt over the treatment of wild horse in Nevada or the treatment of hogs on farms in Michigan, 3000 miles away?

tinner07
I would argue the people that say why doesnt America revolt. don't realize how big our nation really is.

Other countries call us stupid because because we do not speak several languages. Live in Europe how many languages are spoken within say a 500 mile radius? or 1000 mile radius? 3,4 7? in the US it is 1. well maybe 2 with spanish that we kinda hate.

They say revolt..over what? illegal aliens taking over Texas? or the over fishing of lobsters in Boston?

Our country is huge and diverse. Should we revolt over the treatment of wild horse in Nevada or the treatment of hogs on farms in Michigan, 3000 miles away?

Europe is not a country, it is a continent.
And edit: We speak 2 officially; English and Spanish.

reply to post by Davian

We speak 2 officially; English and Spanish.

Who's we? Are Italian, French, German NOT official languages?

In fact, as long as most people will keep repeating to themselves 'What could we do anyway' nothing will ever change.

This plus the fact a majority of people are self-centered, getting out of this mess might not be an easy task.

Davian

tinner07
I would argue the people that say why doesnt America revolt. don't realize how big our nation really is.

Other countries call us stupid because because we do not speak several languages. Live in Europe how many languages are spoken within say a 500 mile radius? or 1000 mile radius? 3,4 7? in the US it is 1. well maybe 2 with spanish that we kinda hate.

They say revolt..over what? illegal aliens taking over Texas? or the over fishing of lobsters in Boston?

Our country is huge and diverse. Should we revolt over the treatment of wild horse in Nevada or the treatment of hogs on farms in Michigan, 3000 miles away?

Europe is not a country, it is a continent.
And edit: We speak 2 officially; English and Spanish.

edit on 12-4-2014 by Davian because: (no reason given)

Um... The USA does NOT have an official language so either you're talking about something else or you're talking out of your arse... Either way you might want to check your facts and make clear, concise statements in the future. Thanks!

I disagree with you on one main point. Assuming that things will take an "upswing," or start to get better on their own, would be to ignore the history of the United States. It definitely seems to me that things have gotten progressively worse over time, with the capitalist elite gaining more and more of a foothold, or control, over the systems of government in one way or another. I see no action, aside from the people presenting a united front, that would spur change to any significant degree.

I think the claim about Americans and television is partly correct, at least in what it implies. Americans, on average, seem to be caught up in their own personal lives, not really wishing to make an effort to do anything to change the government. Some are more involved than others, but I would guess that the majority simply complain, if they care at all. Some might write letters to their representatives, or even go to or stage protests, but such actions are useless. Rarely do they actually get anything accomplished.

I suppose that I believe protests and complaints worked better in the past than they do now. It seems that those in power have gotten more comfortable with committing crimes such as denying US citizens all their rights. Just look at what members of both the Bush and Obama administrations have done. IF there are honest members in Congress things could still get done, and there are some, but here is the problem...Those Congressmen are only concerned about the crimes committed by the opposite party. Does one really think that a republican will go after another republican Congressmen, or someone else in such a position of power, and vice versa? Nope. It might happen once in a great while, since anything is possible, but it is not something that should be expected.

Going back to what I already mentioned, the reason that there are so many people who are only concerned with their own well-being and personal lives is because this is what capitalism breeds. Its entire doctrine, whether one realizes it or not, subtly teaches people to lie, cheat, and steal to get ahead of everyone else. If you look at billionaire businesspeople, I'm sure all of them have only gotten to where they are by taking advantage of others in some capacity. Even businesses who outsource production overseas and pay their workers, sometimes child-laborers, a little of nothing, are taking advantage of people. Their main motivation is profit, and they will attempt to increase their revenues by utilizing any means they can, even less savory methods if they think they can get away with it.

It is important to remember that there is no one thing wrong with America. There are multiple things, all interconnected, that add up to the current state of affairs. But despite this fact, cleaning up the country must start somewhere, and I personally believe that if the right strategy is chosen, the people can actually eliminate multiple problems in one concerted effort.

I believe in the right of the citizenry to bear arms against their government, when their government has proven that they will trample on the rights of these citizens. And I think there is sufficient evidence for that very thing. Here are some selections from the Declaration of Independence to illustrate my point:

"That whenever any Form of Government becomes destructive of these ends, it is the Right of the People to alter or to abolish it, and to institute new Government... Prudence, indeed, will dictate that Governments long established should not be changed for light and transient causes; and accordingly all experience hath shewn that mankind are more disposed to suffer, while evils are sufferable than to right themselves by abolishing the forms to which they are accustomed. But when a long train of abuses and usurpations...evinces a design to reduce them under absolute Despotism, it is their right, it is their duty, to throw off such Government, and to provide new Guards for their future security."

The brilliance of these men was enough to know that people will suffer abuses for a long time before they are willing to do something about it, and that is what is occurring in America. But I do not think the Founders of this country could have envisioned, despite their brilliance and foresight, generations of people who cared so little about the ultimate fate of their country. Despite the fact that so many Americans couldn't care less, there are still enough people who do care to get something done.

After reading the Declaration of Independence, focusing solely on when the people have the right to rise up against their government, it becomes apparent that there is one major constraint, or one point that is highly opinionated, and that is that a government should not be altered for "light and transient causes." So some could argue that things are not so bad that action is needed in the form of instituting a new government. Personally I do not feel that a revolution to abolish and institute a new government is necessary, rather a revolution to alter the current government is what is needed. We need to force the government to respect our rights.

Because something that is clearly evidenced by the Declaration is that governments are instituted among men for the preservation of their rights, and it is the job of the government to insure that the citizenry have those rights. So when the government is stepping on the rights of any citizen, it is a huge deal, and it is a BREACH OF CONTRACT. Yet such breaches occur every single day. The government spying on the people alone is such a breach, yet there are countless other abuses that have taken place in the latter 20th into the 21st century.

So I believe the people are justified, BY LAW, in rising up against the government. There should not be any talk of altering or abolishing the second amendment, because that is the one tool provided to the people for keeping the government in line. In my opinion, and in the opinion of the Founding Fathers, anyone who wishes to do away with the second amendment is ignorant of its purpose, or doesn't truly understand the government's capacity for despotism.

To reiterate my opening point, the government will not "fix" or "right" itself. This was proven by the fact that the American Revolution was fought in the first place. Well not proven, but it was a great example of the fact that the government doesn't just suddenly stop all the usurpations for no reason. While power is being doled out amongst government agencies, none of those should be given the power of ignoring or abolishing the rights of any US citizen. That is the long and short of it. So considering that it occurs on a daily basis in one form or another, and has been occurring for a long time, the people are justified in using force to institute a form of government that is in keeping with what our Founding Fathers initially prescribed.

Being baited, cajoled, prodded, and provoked, for generations; we have shown the patients of Gandhi

What the hell are you talking about? Provoked for generations?? Maybe by big business, not the government, at least not until 9-11, and even that is mild in comparison to countries that really have oppressive governments.

Or do you consider unbearable provoking to be not allowing ignorant dirtbags ro run everything based on faith and barbarism?

reply to post by CB328


The conditions in other countries has no bearing on whether US citizens are suffering under despotism. Because as evidenced by the documents of the Founding Fathers, the government is basically under a contract with the people. And as such the government is required to respect the rights that were given to us citizens. So when the government ignores or abolishes any of those rights, that is despotism. Just because the government isn't going around shooting citizens willy-nilly, even though the police are, doesn't mean that what they are doing is not despotic when it comes to this particular form of government.

The government is supposed to behave within certain guidelines, and it has stepped outside of its boundaries on too many occasions, and not just since 9/11. One can find such things going all the way back to the early 1800's. Even during the Civil War Lincoln suspended the writ of Habeas Corpus, which is not something that anyone should be able to do. In that particular instance, just like in any other instance, the government would have to be trusted to only apply this suspension to those involved in the rebellion...But that is not how things worked out. One should not have to trust the government to stay within its bounds. Rather, the citizenry should FORCE the government to stay within its bounds whenever it breaches the contract it has made with the people, a contract that every American is under when they are born or become a citizen.

originally posted by: JiggyPotamus
Going back to what I already mentioned, the reason that there are so many people who are only concerned with their own well-being and personal lives is because this is what capitalism breeds. Its entire doctrine, whether one realizes it or not, subtly teaches people to lie, cheat, and steal to get ahead of everyone else. If you look at billionaire businesspeople, I'm sure all of them have only gotten to where they are by taking advantage of others in some capacity. Even businesses who outsource production overseas and pay their workers, sometimes child-laborers, a little of nothing, are taking advantage of people. Their main motivation is profit, and they will attempt to increase their revenues by utilizing any means they can, even less savory methods if they think they can get away with it.

You do not lie. Now how can I come aboard and contribute to this effort. Aye. Profit is the main motive. But the reason it comes to all this in the first place is due to a public misconception. One that even appears in the quote above.

originally posted by: JiggyPotamus
Going back to what I already mentioned, the reason that there are so many people who are only concerned with their own well-being and personal lives is because this is what capitalism breeds. Its entire doctrine, whether one realizes it or not, subtly teaches people to lie, cheat, and steal to get ahead of everyone else. If you look at billionaire businesspeople, I'm sure all of them have only gotten to where they are by taking advantage of others in some capacity. Even businesses who outsource production overseas and pay their workers, sometimes child-laborers, a little of nothing, are taking advantage of people. Their main motivation is profit, and they will attempt to increase their revenues by utilizing any means they can, even less savory methods if they think they can get away with it.

I have encountered this hear-say conspiracy before.

People bitterly cling to the feeling that "There is a pervasive belief among working Americans that no one, an nobody ever became wealthy what they didn't commit a crime somewhere. A person that has sacrificed weekly for years. Who has no time for a life. I'll give you a perfect example of what I mean.

Does anyone remember the celebrity CEO wife who threw a million dollar birthday party for her husband.




Dennis Koslowski at his 2 million dollar birthday.

If his wife _had not_ spent the money. If she had been frugal, made a cake, and kept the money in the bank just accruing interest. It wouldn't be spent. Reinjected back into circulation. It wouldn't have helped the economy, or even been a part of it. And besides that. How is this party in anyway wrong? Who's business is it to check the bill of every party.

The guy was indicted. Like, for real. With life altering consequences.

So what is the message here. What do the mob say to the wealthy. If the poor find out about it they will rage with jealousy.
































Or is that just what they want us to believe.

Has anyone ever noticed how quickly someone who starts to make money has to insulate themselves from contact with normal people. In the same way, the middle class is entrenched. Under a siege mentality clinging to things like Castle Doctrine, and stand your ground. In one last steely attempt; to say, this is my country.

But do we seriously intend to achieve anything if we insist that wealthy people go into hiding. That the subconscious rage of the underpriviledged and the outsider against them cautions one to never let it show in public. Drive an old beat up pick up truck. Dress like a regular joe. You know, off the rack. Or the poor will getchya.

When did it become a crime to be wealthy in this country.

Don't we all want to be wealthy one day.



What is wealthy?


Seriously,
what is a "wealthy people"?



I submit to you that we should all be wealthy.






Prison

[atsimg]http://files.abovetopsecret.com/images/member/b9a3408e2239.png[/atsimg]





Single family home

[atsimg]http://files.abovetopsecret.com/images/member/61a3b8de78c4.png[/atsimg]





Middle Class home
[image removed at the request of the copyright holder]





Upper Class home

[atsimg]http://files.abovetopsecret.com/images/member/af21e0c5a7d3.png[/atsimg]






But until more than the few begin to see this,
doom is still on.


Mike Grouchy

originally posted by: JiggyPotamus
I disagree with you on one main point. Assuming that things will take an "upswing," or start to get better on their own, would be to ignore the history of the United States. It definitely seems to me that things have gotten progressively worse over time, with the capitalist elite gaining more and more of a foothold, or control, over the systems of government in one way or another. I see no action, aside from the people presenting a united front, that would spur change to any significant degree.

I don't think the OP was talking about things getting better, I think he was talking about the MSM reporting that things are getting better.

I have the opposite view regarding American history, and history in general, it repeats itself. Today's conditions remind me quite a bit of what I've read of the late 19th Century and early 20th Century. There were some pretty wicked scandals back then and "the rich" were seen as having undeserved influence on how the country was run. Things didn't continue down that path, Teddy Roosevelt happened. Trust busting, financial reform, employee rights and unionism...some huge issues for Roosevelt. Things then started cycling again and now we're right back at the same place. It's not a given that things will continue on in a linear fashion.

a reply to: SilverStarGazer
You are only half-correct.



Arrogance is your downfall in this situation.

originally posted by: windword[/url]
As long as the "divide and conquer" tactic are working, as long as it's "you're either with us or against us" mentality that persists, Americans and the world will be victimized by TPTB.

 

Agreed, the world is victimized by the buy in of people, whether low economic Americans following Fox blow-hards or CNN affiliates or wealthy individuals or scared on-the-border economic individuals and families that don't want the boat rocked. "Divide and conquer" exists because the option of standing up to bull# is more easily portrayed by TPTB as benign and accepted by economically challenged affiliates that have not been offered any other option. Subversion isn't some big "let's get 'em" plan. Subversion is simple; saying no to what is offered by corporation or company, being subjective to private entity rather than public entity, speaking for oneself rather than just agreeing with local standard. It seems that individualism in the U.S. has been lost to commercial interest rather than INDIVIDUALS!

Jesus was right, the only way out of this mess is to "love your enemy". True "righteousness" is only found hiding, buried under the most seemingly defeated. In reality, it's the disenfranchised masses, when working together that can effect change.

Most do not need the heeding or heading of Jesus or Allah or Sinopec, Toyota, Chrysler or Bayer to believe in humanity and its true symbiotic life with the rest of Earth. I would advocate humanity for all, amidst crisis, whatever the extent. Learn, teach, advocate these rules:
1. Gather what is whole to build and nourish without depleting resources.
2. Replenish with renewable and harvestable resources.
3. Discover and develop what exists under the second rule as continuing resources without compromising new economies.