Israel's Illegal Nuclear Arsenal its open secret

Elathan


Israel is thought to have been the 6th country to develop nuclear weapons and they have had them for awhile...so why all the fuss now???

Because the west has a huge bee in it bonnet about country's developing WMD's and not obeying international law with them, to the point of starting a war with Iraq and being on the verge of going into Syria and Iran.

Yet Israel gets a free pass?

WHY!?!

crazyewok

Elathan


Israel is thought to have been the 6th country to develop nuclear weapons and they have had them for awhile...so why all the fuss now???

Because the west has a huge bee in it bonnet about country's developing WMD's and not obeying international law with them, to the point of starting a war with Iraq and being on the verge of going into Syria and Iran.

Yet Israel gets a free pass?

WHY!?!

The "bee in the bonnet" is that those countries with nuclear weapons were "grandfathered" in...but any new ones are being sanctioned to stop the proliferation of nuclear arms. Some countries will not only develop them, but sell them to rogue nations.

I think I am missing something key here, and I may well BE missing something, too.

How is it, Israel's nuclear weapons are "illegal"? They've not chosen to enter the voluntary treaties which would regulate their weapons or development. Thats rude and can bring retaliatory moves like sanctions or embargo if other nations feel strongly enough, but there is no law that says any nation on Earth MUST join any treaty currently in effect. Failing to join one, doesn't assume the terms of the treaty apply anyway. So...where is it written the State of Israel cannot "legally" have nuclear weapons?

If they go threatenening to nuke their neighbors like North Korea has repeatedly done, then there is a whole new kind of problem, tho..technically, still no law being broken that I am aware of or can find in international precedent.

For the record, I think Israel SHOULD sign the NPT and submit itself to the structure contained within it. Not until Syria's chemical weapons came into play for removal did my attitude change...but now that the main reason/balance to Israel's nuclear weapons has been removed for effective concerns? They do need to join the world community...they just aren't required to.

That sovereignty thing keeps getting in the way, I'd think. If we violate theirs...expect our own to be violated in turn, by others.

reply to post by Wrabbit2000


No you cant make them sign the treaties.

But the USA and EU should stop brown nosing them and giving them "aid" until they grow up and join the rest of us.

I dont know about you but I want my country's allies to be ones of good character and of similar goals...o and trustworthy!

reply to post by crazyewok


I don't disagree. When we look at aid spreadsheets which show clear unbroken lines from 1945 to 2013 by column and one nation per row? The aid numbers become ...staggering..to see in comparison. However, there is a problem and it's the same one as it always is.

We have deep, varied and meaningul ties to Israel in a large number of treaties. Those would need terminated, or many of them would. We have U.S. troops on rotation into the Sinai as part of the MFO and they've been there since before many here were born.

Last and..never ever least...we have a billion (roughly) going to Israel and a billion (roughly) going to Egypt. They both get paid for peace and have been since shortly after the Camp David accords. I'm HAPPY to see Israel cut off their support system. I just cannot stomach seeing them set up to die by cutting ONLY them off. We need to cut Egypt in equal measure so we can save something...anything...of the balance that held fairly well between 1979 and 2010 or so.

reply to post by crazyewok

Everything youre mentioning that should be...wont. There are numerous other outside influences not even related to the main issue that sets the stage.Thats why there are wars. And brown-nosing is what we all do as countries...to KEEP FROM going to war.

Right or wrong, good or bad, dangerous or helpful...its called "international politics"...or rhetoric if you choose. Or "keeping the status quo" with World War as the catalyst.

reply to post by crazyewok

I dont know about you but I want my country's allies to be ones of good character and of similar goals...o and trustworthy!

That doesn't leave you many options now does it?

GNOarmy

gardener

Why would such a very young, small country in a highly volatile area of the world be allowed to sit on so many nukes poised to use them someday.

I believe you answered your own question. If it were I that was surrounded by a band of lunatics hell bent on wiping out me very existence, I would do whatever I had to in order to discourage that. It may piss off a few people, but in the end, I'm alive......

edit on 4/2/2014 by GNOarmy because: (no reason given)

Sorry mate and I really don’t want to be rude but your statement is kind of(…..d) Well you know what I mean.

No matter whom going to shoot nuclear tipped missiles, dropping it whatever, should be reminded of their own stupidity. Nuclear fallout does not know borders, race, and nationalities etc. totally indiscriminate weapon worse than bio weapons. That little stain on the map you call Israel annihilate itself as well in case of your (flawed and …(…..d) logic).


Disarm this little bastard of failed nation NOW and let the world BREATHE for a while.

Seems like a hot air topic to me. I firmly believe that in a surprise first strike conventional coordinated attack Israel could take out most of Iran's fighter planes. They probability out number them 50-1 in gunships. It is my understanding that Iran is heavy with all types of field guns and ordnance however they would be useless in this kind of war. Surface to air batteries and other anti aircraft placements could be plotted by American spy satellites and probability tell they the shoe size of the solders operating them.

Why risk world condemnation when a well planned tactical strike could do the job.

tsurfer2000h


That doesn't leave you many options now does it?

Of course no Allies are perfect, no marriage is perfect either. But there are good fits.

Take the USA and UK ok we have had our disagreements like Vietnam and Northern Ireland but on most things we go hand in hand and share very similar goals and values. Same with UK-France or USA-Canada ect At the end of the day we are all pretty such the same.

But country like Israel? Pakistan? Saudi Arabia? ect We should be viewing them with extreme suspicion and shouldn't be selling them military tec!

reply to post by Wrabbit2000


Nope I 100% agree. Egypt should be cut off too. So should all the middle eastern country's of dubious character.

reply to post by sosobad


Wow, all those sanctions and shunning are really intimidating NK. They're so scared they're still threatening nuke tests. Do you think Israel would be any less scared of the same treatment?

"The North Korean military and people will never tolerate the "US policy of hostility" and will "crush it thoroughly", Kim added.
The exchange of fire came the day after North Korea sounded an ominous warning that it might carry out a "new" type of nuclear test -- a possible reference to testing a uranium-based device or a miniaturised warhead small enough to fit on a ballistic missile".

news.yahoo.com...

amkia

GNOarmy

gardener

Why would such a very young, small country in a highly volatile area of the world be allowed to sit on so many nukes poised to use them someday.

I believe you answered your own question. If it were I that was surrounded by a band of lunatics hell bent on wiping out me very existence, I would do whatever I had to in order to discourage that. It may piss off a few people, but in the end, I'm alive......

edit on 4/2/2014 by GNOarmy because: (no reason given)

Sorry mate and I really don’t want to be rude but your statement is kind of(…..d) Well you know what I mean.

No matter whom going to shoot nuclear tipped missiles, dropping it whatever, should be reminded of their own stupidity. Nuclear fallout does not know borders, race, and nationalities etc. totally indiscriminate weapon worse than bio weapons. That little stain on the map you call Israel annihilate itself as well in case of your (flawed and …(…..d) logic).


Disarm this little bastard of failed nation NOW and let the world BREATHE for a while.

One minor problem there. Israel supposedly has enough nukes to theoretically cause a nuclear autumn or winter in the rest of the world. Also they pretty much would destroy most of the oil ports and pipelines in the Persian Gulf area and a number of wells too. Essentially they got the world by the you know whats now. Don't make them squeeze. Because they remember WW2.

I find this type of discussion difficult, mainly because some posters are so anti-Israel they cannot see the facts of the matter.

It is an open secret that Israel has nuclear weapons. They are not illegal. Like India and Pakistan, Israel has never signed the Treaty on the Non-Proliferation of Nuclear Weapons, aka the NPT.

Iran has signed the NPT and is therefore not allowed to develop nukes. If Iran left the NPT then that would be a signal of intent and would therefore suffer the consequences. Interestingly, people concentrate on what Israel would do, but the fact that the rest of the Middle East dislikes Iran may indicate the real players in this game. Anyway, we can hope this is not going to happen and Iran just sticks to the none nuclear option. After all, two wrongs do not make a right.

Someone has already mentioned that Israel is somewhat surrounded by hostile nations who have tried on several occasions to "remove" them, whilst bizarrely helping Israel expand by kicking out their own richly historic Jewish populations.

Regards

gardener

Israel was created 66 years ago.

Israel has housed hundreds (or more) nukes for decades now soon after your very modern conception.

Why would such a very young, small country in a highly volatile area of the world be allowed to sit on so many nukes poised to use them someday.

The Jews kind of invented the bomb, so I think it would have been hard to keep them from it. Also things were a little different 50 plus years ago as to who could have it and who didn't have the capability to have it.