Russian helicopters heading to Sevastopol, Ukraine

reply to post by aLLeKs

aLLeLs,

So do you then let them take the other areas that majority Russian inhabited?
What's the west going to do if they extend into more Ukrainian territory? Probably the same thing they're doing now.
Thats the problem, we are playing the same cards regardless of Putin's move.

Found 3 websites claiming that the US and NATO are making a move. I won't confirm this as true yet, still searching...


BREAKING: US Sixth Fleet moves toward Crimea, NATO troops land in Western Ukraine:
countdowntozerotime.com... -in-western-ukraine/

I think the story from the sources are fake.

But anyways, apparently it's only been 2000 troops that were sent into Crimea?

I wonder what the 150,000 in the exercise where for...

reply to post by Kuroodo


Oh them... their for Blackmail and protection.. in the
"I make you an offer you can't refuse" type of protection.

Kuroodo
I think the story from the sources are fake.

But anyways, apparently it's only been 2000 troops that were sent into Crimea?

I wonder what the 150,000 in the exercise where for...

I wouldn't be surprised if Special Forces of some kind are not already there. It would be the prudent thing to do, in this type of situation.

Been seeing this on the news headlines in the past couple minutes.

Russian troops take over Ukraine's Crimea region

KIEV, Ukraine (AP) — Russian troops took over Crimea as the parliament in Moscow gave President Vladimir Putin a green light Saturday to use the military to protect Russian interests in Ukraine. The newly installed government in Kiev was powerless to react to the action by Russian troops based in the strategic region and more flown in, aided by pro-Russian Ukrainian groups.

Ignoring President Barack Obama's warning Friday that "there will be costs" if Russia intervenes militarily, Putin sharply raised the stakes in the conflict over Ukraine's future evoking memories of Cold War brinkmanship.

reply to post by buni11687


The Russian Federation authorization for use of force states "the territory of Ukraine" and not just Crimea. In a recent conversation with Obama Putin states Russia reserves the right to essentially interfere when Russia's interests are involved.

I say make Ukraine a member of NATO and end Putin.

plain and simple.

reply to post by Xcathdra


I haven't seen it mentioned but have you completely forgot about Ukraines current internal problems?

Timing is everything, Russia does use crimea, they argue they are protecting their interests.

Now I have seen you say that why doesn't other countries do the same, timing is everything.

I heard someone say this wouldn't be Obama vs Putin in a cage but Russia VS Nato, if it came to the former, Ukraine would win hands down, and dominate Heavyweight Boxing for the last 12 years

reply to post by Taggart


Ukraine has officially asked for NATO intervention in securing its territorial integrity / sovereignty. NATO has an emergency session planned for Sunday to discuss the request and possible courses of action.

I pointed this out in another thread, and will do the same here. People can argue that Russia has military ties / historical tie / ethnic ties to the Crimea.

Nikita Khrushchev, who is from the Ukraine, gave the Crimea to Ukraine as a gift when he was running the USSR. From that moment, Russia gave up all claims to Crimea. When the Soviet union collapsed, and Ukraine became a sovereign nation, it only reinforced that fact.

www.youtube.com...

footage of russian helicopters over ukraine

The simple fact remains that if this was any other country (Argentina, Iraq to name just two actual examples) of a nation seizing land or "protecting it's interests", then we would have laid the smack down on them. To not stand up to Russia now after looking pretty weak in Georgia sends all the wrong signals and only (fatally in my opinion) weakens the West standing in the world.

This crisis also highlights the UNSC as the ineffective body it is, as the UN cannot act without the Big 5 agreeing, Russia being one of them.

EDIT: To clarify, I am actually quite "pro-war" in so far that a line must be drawn somewhere and we could quite easily, humiliate Russia if NATO acted.

stumason
The simple fact remains that if this was any other country (Argentina, Iraq to name just two actual examples) of a nation seizing land or "protecting it's interests", then we would have laid the smack down on them. To not stand up to Russia now after looking pretty weak in Georgia sends all the wrong signals and only (fatally in my opinion) weakens the West standing in the world.

Argentina and Iraq didnt have enough WMD to turn the EU and USA into a giant crater

stumason
EDIT: To clarify, I am actually quite "pro-war" in so far that a line must be drawn somewhere and we could quite easily, humiliate Russia if NATO acted.

edit on 2/3/14 by stumason because: (no reason given)

Ok you have a right to be Pro war. We are allowed your diffrent opinions. But in my oponion those in the pro war camp should be the first to sign up and go into battle.

crazyewok
Argentina and Iraq didnt have enough WMD to turn the EU and USA into a giant crater

But Tony Blair said they did (about Iraq).... Are you telling me he lied?

But seriously, nukes or no nukes, if we won't stand up to this now, what signal does that send? Personally, I can see this slowly escalating until someone blinks..

Maybe a small NATO/EU rapid reaction force to be deployed to Poland, to show we're "up for ti" might make Russia see sense, at which point they'll agree to talks and somehow they can back out of it and save face. Unless of course they think they can push it, then it all get's dangerous...

stumason
Ok you have a right to be Pro war. We are allowed your diffrent opinions. But in my oponion those in the pro war camp should be the first to sign up and go into battle.

If they ask and will have me, I'll go. But I am a 31 year old smoker with dodgy knees, so they'd be scraping the barrel!

reply to post by MrMaybeNot


Anything could happen.

Yahoo News - Ukraine in crisis | U.S. to Russia: 'It is an act of aggression; it must stop'

Poland just invoked Article IV under the NATO charter -

Update, 3:15 p.m. EST: NATO's secretary general said that the North Atlantic Council will meet Tuesday following a request by Poland under article 4 of NATO's founding Washington Treaty:

Under article 4 of the Treaty, any Ally can request consultations whenever, in the opinion of any of them, their territorial integrity, political independence or security is threatened. The developments in and around Ukraine are seen to constitute a threat to neighboring Allied countries and having direct and serious implications for the security and stability of the Euro-Atlantic area.

The Russian Ambassador to the UN apparently was taken to task by the US Ambassador over his remarks -

Update, 3:52 p.m. ET: U.S. and Russian ambassadors exchanged sharp words at the United Nations in New York on Monday. Vitaly Churkin, Russia's ambassador to the U.N., said ethnic Russians are under attack in the Ukraine from "anti-national radicals" and defended the possible use of force in Crimea.

"We're talking about defending our citizens and our compatriots, on defending the most important human right, the right to life," Churkin said.

"There is no evidence that ethnic Russians are in danger," U.S. ambassador Samantha Power responded. "Russia is trying to convince the world community that up is down, and black is white.

Ukraine letter to United Nations outlines nation's situation

A draft law on annexation of the Crimea was registered today in the Russian Parliament.

Yesterday, 2 March, trying to capture the armory of Ukrainian Air Tactical brigade (near
Sevastopol) Russian Armed Forces used stun grenades against Ukrainian soldiers. As a result
Ukrainian officer sustained brain-contusion and shock and was brought to medical facility.

Tonight, Russian Air Forces aircrafts twice illegally entered Ukrainian airspace
threatening air security. These incidents received proper reaction from Ukrainian Air Forces, as
Ukrainian aircraft immediately took off towards violators and was in the alert zone ready to act
against violators of State airspace border, which allowed avoiding serious consequences.

Today Ukrainian military base in Kerch was surrounded by Russian soldiers.

Russian Military blocked Ukrainian military units in Novoozernoe, Perevalnoye and
Feodosia, demanding to surrender and seal arms and ammunition, while promising to ensure
security with submachine gunners of Russia. Ukrainian navy troops refused to comply with the
Russians orders.

Ukrainian Navy ships have been blocked in Sevastopol Bay by Russian Navy vessel KIL-158, seagoing tugs and patrol boats of the RF Navy. The representatives of the Russian Navy delieverd an ultimatum to the personnel of
corvette "Ternopil" and command ship "Slavutich" to lay down their arms until 18.00 March 3
and leave the ships otherwise they will open tile fire. Ukrainian sailors clearly stated the oath of
allegiance to Ukrainian people.

Today the first attempt has been made to capture the Ukrainian Navy Headquarters by
armed men, and the other attempt is expected.
Russian Special Forces continue to capture the military and border facilities in the
Crimea, offering Ukrainian army to voluntary surrender until 18.00 today.
In Feodosia City the Russian Kozaks groups have been capturing all administrative
buildings and started to distribute the arms to civil volunteers to form the self-protection
groups.



Ukrainian Border Service headquarters in Crimea has been captured and blocked by
Russian troops. At noon, Russian soldiers with military trucks broke down the doors, destroyed
workstations and communications equipment.

There has been drastic increase of pressure from Russian military on Ukrainian border
guard officers. During seizures of border guard units there was brutal use of physical force,
threat of weapon and menace. Professionals of Russian Special Forces try to perform
psychological pressure on border guard officers and in categorical form demand to obey to the
new authorities of the Crimea Autonomous Republic. They actively make attempts to crimp
personnel, call for information on investigation-operational divisions and information on
operating personnel.

Russian military forces continue implementing their plan of complete blockade of
communications in Crimea, in order to cut communication of Ukrainian Armed Forces in
Crimea with General Staff.

Russian military nearly every half hour commit provocations in Crimea.
A series of provocations were carried out over the past few days, which would aim to
legalize the presence of Russian military contingent in Crimea.

In contrary, Ukrainian armed forces are protecting their staffs, military units and bases,
and are not responding to any provocations that occurred over the past days.
Due to blockade of all state institutions in Crimea by the Russian Armed Forces, these
institutions are almost unable to function properly, which creates social tensions in population.

Today, the State Border Guard Service of Ukraine officially informed about the rapid
increase in number of military machines and equipment on the Russian territory along the
Eastern border of Ukraine, namely Kharkiv, Lugansk and Donetsk regions. It includes, 9 trains
of military equipment (APC) unloaded from Voronezh side, 5 armoured vehicles (APC) and 2
mechanical transport vehicles from Bochkove- Leninskoye with field kitchen.

Governor of Rostov region of Russia ordered to deploy camps in Russian districts
bordering Ukraine.

Such activities of Russian Armed Forces indicate their preparation for a possible
invasion by Russia into Ukraine not only in Crimea, but also in to Eastern regions in Ukraine.


As of today, since 24 February, approximately 16,000 Russian troops have been
deployed in Crimea by the military ships, helicopters, cargo airplanes from the
neighboring territory of the Russian Federation. The Russian troops keep taking their
attempts to seize, block and control crucial governmental and military objects of Ukraine
in Crimea: the Parliament of Crimea, all civil and military airports, means of
communications, radio stations, customs service, military and coastguard bases,
Headquarters of the Ukraine's Navy in Crimea. All main roads are blocked.

Also a large number of Russian military troops is ready for being redeployed from Novorosiysk.
Access to the Black Sea is blocked by 10 Russian Navy vessels, including vessels of Baltic Fleet.


Permanent Mission of Ukraine will continue to inform all Permanent and Observer Missions to the
United Nations on the latest developments of the situation in Ukraine. Actions by the Government of Ukraine for normalization of the situation in Crimea The leadership of Ukraine takes appropriate measures aimed at political resolution of theconflict with the participation of the UN, OSCE and other international organizations.


The Law of Ukraine "On State Language Policy", adopted in 2012 (protecting languages
of national minorities) is still in effect. Acting President used his right no to sign draft adopted
by the Parliament. As of now, Russian language is as protected as it was before on all territory
of Ukraine, particularly and especially in Crimea.

Acting President Turchynov has mandated to establish a worldng group for "immediate
elaboration of a new Law of Ukraine "On Language", to consist of all ethnic groups and
national minorities.


Yesterday, highly respected persons have been appointed as Governors of Eastern and
Southern regions of Ukraine. All of them are locals of those regions, and not members of any
political party. It was an important step to calm down situation.


Members of new Ukrainian Government come from different regions of Ukraine,
including Eastern and Southern regions. These people will duly represent interests of those
regions. 4 (four) ministers of Ukrainian Government were born in Russia.


Despite existing economic problems, Government of Ukraine has provided necessary
financing to the population of Crimea in order to avoid social tensions.


Acting President Turchynov supported the establishment of the "Council of National
Trust." He stressed that the country will always protect rights of its people "no matter what
language they speak, no matter where they live, and no matter what church they go to."