"Red Cry": A new and explosive documentary on the US genocide against the Lakota nations.

OpinionatedB
reply to post by FatherStacks

 

I would not change the sovereignty of the reservations. That is the LAST thing you would ever want to change given the state of the United States government.

I should revise my position for clarity. I wouldn't change the sovereignty of reservations. I think the reservation system is not perfect, but is probably the best of a long line of bad ideas. My thoughts were I would change that system, if and only if, there were indeed a better alternative for native peoples. I'm not smart enough to come up with a better way, although I wish I were.

But I feel as if I'm speaking on topics I probably shouldn't. While my grandmother was Oglala Lakota, that is her claim not mine. I wasn't enculturated, or raised in that environment. I know her story, and the stories she shared with us. It's a fine line between being proud of one aspect of my heritage, and making claims I should not.

For an on topic post:

I was discussing this topic with my fiancee. She met the children from this documentary at the National Congress of American Indians a few years back in Albuquerque, NM. She said they were really good kids, but felt that there was something "odd" about how the producers were presenting them. In her words, she said that "it felt like somehow they were being exploited."

Maybe it isn't so, and it was just her poor perception. Disclaimer: I am NOT saying this is the case, nor that the producers had some nefarious intent. But, if it is true, it's very sad to think that for those who've suffered so much already to go through another round of humiliation while sharing their story.

reply to post by FatherStacks


I am not native american, but what I saw when I went to pine ridge, there needs to be changes all the way around... All I would wish for, is perhaps to help.

Everyone speaks of wanting to help in other countries, help people fight for their freedom somewhere else on the planet, but we should be helping our own first, before we ever consider helping others. And the Native Americans ARE our own.

Helping them, is our responsibility. At least it should be, because what is happening is our responsibility to change. Others did the initial damage but what happens in our lifetime, under our watch, is ours to bear.

It is not our decisions to make, but maybe our ideas can help to spark the right idea for them.

reply to post by FatherStacks

Thanks for the insights, and I think your fiancee has a point.
I can also imagine that not everyone would be pleased with the representation and forceful polemics.
There are also phrases in the clip that make one wince a bit.
The viewer knows that the speakers are coming from a position of racial oppression and resistance to power after the historical introduction, but there's almost an elitist sense of being "full-blooded" that would be called "supremacist" if it was uttered by whites, or nowadays, possibly even blacks.
The "half-breeds" referred to as the "little brother" of the "selfish whites" remain a silent and unexplored other in the narrative, and most journalism would at least have gotten their opinion too for fairness.

Incidentally, I was reminded of the 1992 movie "Thunderheart", which fictionalized some of the historical issues referred to by the narrators, including the pro-government "goons" and their violence against the traditionalists.
www.imdb.com...
That movie was extremely popular in Germany at the time, and it's sad to see that there has been no satisfactory solution or progress towards equality since then.

reply to post by halfoldman


I have ancestors from both the blackfoot and mohawk peoples. if they showed up in south africa they would enslave you and take your land. if they thought for an instant they had a chance of taking the country back form the euro's they would have done it by now. of course, the fact that once again some foreigner singles out the "U.S." as being BAD isn't a real surprise to me. South Africans - yes, they are such a model of human rights. I understand you people used to make pretty good slave owners didn't you ? Euro's s are like that. they suck at history and have REALLY short memories. at least, that's what the people have learned. but don't ask me. ask the people of south and central america. ask the people of india. ask the people of africa. ask the aboriginals of australia. history. unlike ALL politicians, it never lies, no matter how many times you try and rewrite it, the people will tell you the truth.

Metallicus
Wait! You live in South Africa and are giving Americans advice on how to treat native peoples?

Oh the irony.

I welcome the scrutiny no matter where it comes from. Our native nations suffer in silence... None of the other minorities have any rights to complain when in comparison to native Americans. There is no u. S. They don't own the land, it was stolen. They gave treaties and never followed them. Over and over, it is theft outright, whole nations were slaughtered and tribe gone extinct.

Blacks have nothing to complain about. Let's go back to wounded knee and talk about it.

The Bot

reply to post by tencap77

I'm not sure what decade or century you are talking about, but South Africa has had a democratically elected black majority government since 1994.
And yes, it was held up as a standard of reconciliation and human rights at the time.
In fact, Mandela and De Klerk won the Nobel Peace Prize in 1993.
We do border on two independent black states: Lesotho and the tribal monarchy of Swaziland, which has no democratic rights whatsoever.

Slavery existed in the Cape colony under the Dutch, notably that of prisoners of wars from their colonies in Indonesia, which brought the very rich culture of the "Cape Malay" people to South Africa.

Slavery was abolished in South Africa under British colonialism in 1834.
I'm not really sure of the point, since it's well known that various Native American tribes also kept black slaves.

It's certainly true that there was a lot of capitalist exploitation in South Africa, especially from Anglo-American companies, which remains an issue today.

South Africa has many problems and views from different communities, but the Oglala and Mohawks would be welcome to visit a free and democratic South Africa any time.

I'm not sure why I should continually justify myself for being from South Africa, and I've posted many threads on my country, including on the HIV/AIDS crisis, the concerns of the Afrikaner people, land redistribution (much of the distributed land has unfortunately fallen into ruin and is often stripped and abandoned), police brutality under the ANC, xenophobia against black foreigners by local black communities and investigations into the Marikana massacre at the Lonmin mine.
Then there are many conspiracies, and questions over the power behind the old government and the current ANC.
I've never said that my view is the only view, and that other groups do not have good reasons for their own.

I don't see why I should be called "anti-American" simply for making a thread on a documentary that highlights a specific human rights issue in the US.
Suffice to say that the people in the clip don't sound like big fans of the US, but this is their own position.

It was certainly hoped that the ANC would speak out for other indigenous minorities, but such hopes were astoundingly dashed in 1990, when Mandela went on his first fund-raising tour for the ANC.
He completely ignored the aboriginal people in Australia, claiming that he wouldn't interfere in the affairs of other countries.
This was an ironic position for the ANC, who relied heavily on international pressure to advance their own struggle, but it was clear that he wouldn't upset his donors.

reply to post by halfoldman


I've been around a number of tribes in different parts of the states. One common theme is that the Elders and a certain group amongst the tribe will live like kings. Some will live mediocre lives, and the rest are oppressed. The Cherokee and Seminoles try as hard as any to help everyone in there population, but handing over $40-50K to an 18 year old and hoping they use it for college or to gain a stable living situation while learning a trade just doesn't work as well as they hope it will. I liken many of the tribes to the Budhist monks everyone thinks are so great. The ones in authority that play the part control everything and the rest are not much more than serfs.

I just came across this vid by Max Kaiser where at the 13 min. mark he starts talking to the chief of the reserve where they are talking about Bitcoin ...Not sure what to make of it of if the members of the reserve know about it but I am under the impression that Bitcoin is only a tool for tptb .. www.youtube.com...

Annunak1

halfoldman
reply to post by Annunak1

 

Whose big fat villas are you talking about?

Some of the richest people in SA have gotten villas in the past decades, and they didn't struggle to be poor.

Although the richer areas are not shown, but there is a sense that corruption is actually robbing both the US taxpayers and the people on Pine Ridge.

Im talking about the big fat villa's of the mostly white south africans. There will always be hatred in south africa if you have rich white guys whining about the poor black african criminals. I remember speaking to a guy from south africa talkin about how he and his friend shooting at black africans for fun. For the record my dad is white n my mum is black so i ain't no racist. But the white people messed up south africa with their apartheid and keep continuing spreading the hatred with their big ass houses.

Dude you need to shut your f*cking mouth or stay on topic