DARPA to Genetically Engineer Humans by Adding a 47th Chromosome

Thank you for a quality post with excellent links. If there was a problem here and any possibility of creating super muscle-bound zombie soldiers, I would be amongst the first people to react with my comments. from reading this link, Paper I have noted the following:

a) the cells used were stem cells - these cells can develop into many other cells of the body given the right chemical signals (this is called pluripotency);
b) the chromosomes were mini-chromosomes containing a limited amount of DNA that were STABLY inherited by cells for generations;
c) the authors mentioned a potential cure for muscular dystrophy by cloning the dystrophin gene (dystrophin is a protein that strengthens muscle fibre and, in people with MD, can weaken their muscles substantially because it is mutated).

But.... more importantly than any other point, if you wanted to change anyone older than a baby into a zombie, you would have to target every one of their trillions of cells otherwise it is likely to end in failure.

Once an egg is fertilised, the cells start to divide to make a ball of cells called an embryo. Parts of the embryo have certain genes switched on and off to make different tissues, for example: muscle tissue, bone tissue, skin tissue, glandular tissue...This is called differentiation. If any evil scientist wanted to influence the type of human he or she wanted it would have to be done at the eight or sixteen-cell stage and then the human has to be tracked until he/she is expressing the genes from the artificial chromosome in all his/her cells.

Currently, most scientists in the world would be appalled at the thought of such an experiment on a human embryo. As a former scientist, I am confident that 99.9% of scientists would refuse to inject HAC's into human embryos. The success of the human artificial chromosome in being maintained in cells stably scared the hell out of me initially but, given the contraints, I do not think that mainstream science would touch this stuff.

However, there is an evil which surrounds us all and is found in organisations which are meant to defend us, but which treat us like cattle - the CIA, MI5's of this world follow the orders of the Committee of 300, whose fingers are in every pie. These are the people who would love to experiment on us and it is these people who wouldl authorise this sort of secret research. Take a look at the names and you may be shocked if you are British.

Committee Members

Originally posted by Heronumber0


However, there is an evil which surrounds us all and is found in organisations which are meant to defend us, but which treat us like cattle - the CIA, MI5's of this world follow the orders of the Committee of 300, whose fingers are in every pie. These are the people who would love to experiment on us and it is these people who wouldl authorise this sort of secret research. Take a look at the names and you may be shocked if you are British.

Committee Members

Thank you for the link, much appreciated. I will indeed do dililgent research on this,
and will post back here with my thoughts.

reply to post by Heronumber0


Don't worry. It is not so easy.

The chances are greater they will fail.

We cannot stop people from trying what they want, specially people who are well connected and resourceful.

Obviously they are wasting public funds, money that can be used elsewhere more productively.

People are doing all kinds of crazy things in the name of science.

Alright since were on this interesting topic I am going to ask a monster key question not taken to thought yet. Would it be safe to say if we keep progressing on genetics that by the end of the next two centuries we could possibly have such a creature so far only presented in holly wood and films walk among us. For example the famous bipedal wolf, also known as part man part wolf, or the "werewolf." Could it be possible in the next two hundred years from where things stand that this alternate reality could be reality?



Another question I'm wondering say we did learn the whole body genetic codes and could "reshape a person" or "reverse aging" wouldn't the costs be great like what could happen because of this the world lives in chain reactions. What would come of this what than moving the mind and soul of a person to a engineered body? Seriously what would be the cause and effect I seen in the replies someone mentioned that the creation would have it's own free who's to say implanting which could become reality would have ups and downs it makes me wonder what can and would be the effects and consequences of as most say this "playing god?"

reply to post by strivexwolf


What great questions. Of course, as for your first, it would presumably possible to "create" a living anything. If you're a teenage boy and are into wherewolves (sp.) or want a vampire, why not? Of course, anything and anyone and any "achetype" could probably be created. Does that mean we want to? Hmmm. Should we know how they "breed" first, and what that might do to the totaly "genetic pool." I think we might want to consider that, first, and foremost. The responsibilities, of a "creator," after all, are greater, perhaps than current societal mankind has even considered. What are the long term goals, with such responsibilities, for the responsibilities of "creation" are quite great, are they not?

As for your second question, and likely the best one yet, as I remember it, (and too lazy to open another window and look at it again, I apologize, but IT DID STRIKE ME AS VASTLY IMPORTANT....ok, maybe I will take another look at it.....)

Another question I'm wondering say we did learn the whole body genetic codes and could "reshape a person" or "reverse aging" wouldn't the costs be great like what could happen because of this the world lives in chain reactions. What would come of this what than moving the mind and soul of a person to a engineered body? Seriously what would be the cause and effect I seen in the replies someone mentioned that the creation would have it's own free who's to say implanting which could become reality would have ups and downs it makes me wonder what can and would be the effects and consequences of as most say this "playing god?"

This, I found so important, I had to go back, grab it, and quote you.......

Absolutely. That someone gets that we could engineer someone to either go backwards, or live forever, and what would that mean, historically and politically? Especially if they were a person attributed with significant importance, historically......would we not then have the ability to possess a time machine, even without true possession of it, but just faking it, and then causing all kinds of mayhem through this? Of course we would. And what an exceptional question, at least in my humble, simple, estimation...... Like Jesus, what if we could retell his life in a slightly different way: give him a wife, have him live through the crucifiction, etc.....how would that change everything now that Christians believe?

The cause and effect wondering on your part are truly exceptional and applicable, totally to this thread in a whole different way...

Sincerely,
Tetra50

(Another question I'm wondering say we did learn the whole body genetic codes and could "reshape a person" or "reverse aging" wouldn't the costs be great like what could happen because of this the world lives in chain reactions. What would come of this what than moving the mind and soul of a person to a engineered body? Seriously what would be the cause and effect I seen in the replies someone mentioned that the creation would have it's own free who's to say implanting which could become reality would have ups and downs it makes me wonder what can and would be the effects and consequences of as most say this "playing god?")

"The cause and effect wondering on your part are truly exceptional and applicable, totally to this thread in a whole different way..."

Thank you Tetra50 I know my thinking is a lot different than most but we should definitely look at things of this matter this way. We should as humans should think this over deeply before taking three steps forward into this without the thoughts of our actions but more what can happen with all this so we don't fall many steps back.
I really want to know what would be the outcomes before seeing the impacts of what people are excited to see happen if it can and honestly we should understand this crucial questioning first before creating the strongest living monsters ever seen that could bring our own destruction.

What were doing right now needs crucial thinking before taking this into action this is really important isn't it?

So what would be the outcomes might anyone know because I cannot comprehend them could anyone of you possibly explain and help give light to any or all outcomes?

As it is with most any newer technology it will be tested & eventually used as a weapon in combat. [Duh! - it's frickin' DARPA!] It would be years farther most likely generations into the future before any serious genetic modification was approved for public use, think how long it takes the FDA to approve of a new medication. Unless other country's really take=off with there genetic research, ultimately pressuring the US to hasten there research. I bet our government will keep this one on the 'down low' for a while yet, not a cover up, just a refusal to comment. Look at the different stances on Stem Cell Therapy here Vs over sea's.

reply to post by galadofwarthethird



ok hulk you say ... let me say something that will blow your mind ready...


Muscle Structure ... Bulk ... and being cut... Only has a Little to do with Strength !!

Ok Hear it Goes !! ITs the FIBERS in the Muscle Fiber Tissue !! the more Dense the more Nerves ! is the KEY !!


Heres the Proof !! Stongman Dennis Rodgers ! is Real
He has Extra Fibers Then most people on the Planet

STAN LEE SUPERHUMANS - SUPER STRENGTH

reply to post by Wolfenz


Oh I did not say anything in particular to bulk, I was using it as an example. If you look at the other link, the one about protein triggers and how they function on a nano scale that is for every muscle fiber there are millions and millions if not billions of these nano proteins which work in unison. Muscles work by simple functions which are magnified on a larger scale, they contract and they release. And basically these little protein motors contract and attach to another and pull, then they release and return to normal all during a chemical reaction, even if you were to make that function a bit faster or a bit more efficient or able to pull more or a bit farther, that in itself would literally make you super strong without no adding muscles.

Our measurements suggest that the average displacement from a single myosin molecule is about 10 nanometres (a millionth of a centime-tre), with typical forces of only a few piconewtons(10-12newtons). These values are important parameters inany theoretical model that tries to explain the physiology of muscles from the bottom upwards.

So technically if you could even improve on that process, you would be much more stronger. Say a little skinny person would be much more stronger if at those levels there protein nano motors would work more faster and more efficient and would be able to pull more release faster and repeat the whole process with a much higher frequency with exapanding the minimum amout of energy and chemical reaction, or you can even help it along by way of synthetic nano bots, and skeletal structure, nerve and everything else being much more efficient and stronger. The effect would be kind of like spider man lifting a car, having spider sense like reflexes, or since were in a conspiracy aliens site to put it this way. If the little gray aliens were any kind of advanced species and on a nano scale would be able to mess around with DNA and the micro world from the bottom on up, a little 4 foot skinny gray with a big head would be able to rip 290 pound football player limb from limb and with ease. But body type and skeletal function also have a huge part to do with strengths after all muscles are just attached to bones, and ultimately can only lift what the bone structure and density can withstand.

And also muscles are nowhere near as useful in space were gravity is not as much as an issue, in space a doll like robot, who does not need to breath oxygen and has nowhere near as much bodily sensors such as a nervous system, would be much more useful and efficient especially in long term travel in a space ship among the stars, then the strongest person in the world would. The environment plays a big factor to everything as well, even if you were some ripped 300 pound full of muscles guy, in space like in a space ship if you were to go for a few years by the time you come back you would have lost all of your muscles, weight, and body mass/size fast it would deteriorate in a weightless or even less weight/gravity environment.

Muscle contraction is achieved by sliding two kinds of filaments past one another. One of these filaments is made of myosin (the motor), the other of a substance called actin (see figure). The two kinds of filaments overlap in the muscle cells to maximise their interactions. Just like a more familiar engine, myosin operates in a cyclical manner, as shown in the figure on the next page, to ensure energy is used efficiently. During each cycle, the myosin molecules first bind to the actin filament, bridging the gap between the two filaments. Then, they ‘burn’ fuel by reacting with one ATP molecule (the fuel of most biological processes). This reaction releases ener- gy and makes the myosin molecules undergo a transformation that causes them to swing their ‘lever arm’ struc- ture and pull on the actin filament. They then release the actin filament and swing the lever arm back to its original position, ready for the next cycle. During each cycle, the two fila- ments slide past each other by a short distance – this is the basis of muscle contraction. The forces and move- ments produced by a single cycle are minute, but the combination of mil- lions of myosin molecules acting simultaneously amplifies the effect by many orders of magnitude

But even if you could do that, that does not mean that if you were bulkier you would not be that much stronger, because you would also adding more mass and density to what already is. Also its a mental thing as well, take that guy in the vid, he could bend wrenches and hold a motorcycle and bend frying pans like pancakes, but I bet you if you put him to do some other strongman feat he would not be nowhere near as strong at it.

I go to the gym, been going for years, you see all kinds of people. And some are really strong at one exercise, or one muscle group, or one thing but kind of lack in others, there are some skinny kids were I go who could bench way more then me and I outweigh them, but you let them do something else and they are nowhere near as strong. Also muscles and strength mean nothing if you dont have the training and mental capacity to use them like the guy in the vid demonstrates. If you ever go to a martial arts place, or a wrestling place and wrestled with people who have been doing it for years, you will see that some of them have crazy strength in there areas, but would not be able to physically push around the kind of weight you would in a pure weightlifting competition. Most of that is practice, technique, and that fact that they have been focusing on that area for years and years, but its also like the guy in the vid said you have to know how to shut off the as the guy said "that governor in your head" So ya a lot of it is mental.

But that in no way means that the actually physical aspect of how muscles are built from the nano scale on up does not effect everything or what you are able to do.

The last two posts are not related to the topic.

We shall see when DARPA actually succeeds.

My thought is that it will fail as current scientists just do not have enough understanding of genes.

It is more like hit and trial which can go on burning free tax money.

reply to post by burntheships

This is of interest to me because I am thinking now,of people born with Down Syndrome.The syndrome is caused by a chromosomal abnormality,please correct me if I am wrong.I am thinking of how Down Syndrome-folks are usually the essence of innocence,purity,such loving friendly natures-and make no mistake-a keen awareness of the undercurrents flowing through existence-like children,I believe even when older,they stay connected to a very pure and incorruptible source.Life does not usually rob them of the ability to see and feel,as it does so many children as they grow into adulthood,replacing that connection with analytical thought and cynicism,thought patterns and attitudes learnt +adopted along the way.

The vast majority of Downs stays in a state of greater warmth,lovingness+purity than us who do not have this condition.
I don't really have a point to make,just this was what came into the forefront of my mind when reading the OP, for some reason.

And yes,this is not research I feel comfortable with,in the hands of any branch,institution,faction or department that has any ties to the American admin or defence force.Who will be the test subjects,I wonder?

reply to post by TheToastmanCometh


H.G. is solid, but Powdered Toast Man for an avatar? It brings tears to my eyes, a smile of joy to my face, and the absolute and certain conviction that there is no hope for the human race, however, I know powdered toast man will never let that happen, regardless of how much the human race has taken him for granted!

reply to post by burntheships


"The Sleep of Reason Breeds Monsters"

the wars of the 21st century are sure looking to be Manichean

Progress - and to think some still say it cant be done.

Maxwell's Demon - Nanostyle
A perpetual warm cup of tea, or self replicating monsters?

www.abovetopsecret.com...

reply to post by burntheships


Amongst the swill, the jewll. wow. can't believe it. of course i believe it these guys are such fools. i already knew that. where will it lead?

reply to post by soficrow


Very true, who knows where it stops?
This last year there have been so many leaps it is really hard to keep
up with all of it, check out the link I posted above yours.

Nice of you to stop by Sofi, thanks!

a reply to: tetra50

Not stepping up for 'enhancement' would be a GOOD sign, one of the first in many years.

'Hac'-ing Humans the 47th Chromosome gambit.
Essencially making humans plug and play compliant for genetic 'therapy'.
Like a genetic USB port. Just step up and wal-la your 'enhanced'.

where the f-*** is my whiffel bat.

Except none , not one of you transhuman flag waviers live in the real world., apparently.
A world where 'intellectual property' supercedes civil rights.
A world where corporations have the same rights as people.
A world where to big to jail, is not seen as a serious national security threat.
A world where workers are replace by younger cheaper ( less corporate aware ) workers.
A world where whistle blowers are villians.

But hey lets explore this new transhuman aguemented eutopia.
You get upgraded, go to kull-age and graduate.
You get a job as a skilled database programer.
You become a 'contract hire' and get a sweet job working on company Zee's engineering database.
You get a job offer with company Zee and continue to work there for the next five years.
You are making top wages, but now HR is eyeballing new recruits, You get 'reduced in force', ...
but before you exit, the company enforces your hiring contract and 'intellectual property rights,
insisting that your augemented memory be augemented again, and wiped of its memories for the last five years.

Now your a contract hire AGAIN, who is five years out of kull-age, and with no experience, or worse.
Just how much of your memories have been wiped.?
Your augemented career suxks because you'll never gain work experience, EVER.
oops you forgot you moved, you forgot you have children, when did you get a dog.?
Your memories are not brain cell specific, they are shared over a vast number of memories and cells.
In protecting their Intellectual property rights, your life just became a nightmare.
Begining to get the picture.?

Making humans plug and play compliant for genetic 'therapy', open whole new vistas for human farming.
Remeber the movie Divergent, in real life there would be no resistance.
Its probably already too late. I see very little evidence of awareness.

And the treatment of the embola infected on a continent that was uncontaminated, well thats just window dressing,
a dress rehershal for future biogenetic warfare. Containment and isolation are primary protocals.
If it was about fighting embola, it would have been smarter to keep it in Africa for as long as possible.
Bringing the embola infected here is practice for responding to weaponized HAC gene therapies, like 'Enhancement'.
It is clear as a bell that the medical communities and the CDC are absolutely clueless, esspecially to the forth comming
scale of a bio-genetic war. A war that breeds plug and play compliant humans.

You have already been hooked into begging for a genetic USB port.
Technology is a fine thing, but just because you can do a thing, does not mean its a good idea to do it.
Perhaps its time to take the french revolutionary ideals to the next level, and end human farming all together.

Technology is a fine thing, but just because you can do a thing, does not mean its a good idea to do it.

Welcome. You nailed it right there. As far as French Revolutions, I don't think that would truly fix anything, either.
You can already be made sick, made to appear sick when you're not and marginalized socially that way…..
You can already be wiped without your consent. Read the first article of the UN Bill of Rights and their definition of being human. All someone has to do is zone you out in a court of law, to interdict your rights, and shortly thereafter, you are legally not human enough to qualify….then anything can be done to you. You are essentially a lab rat…..
Which spells tarballs, backwards, and every so often, we have spills, and then exactly that on the beaches, fouling the sea.

I won't go any further. But you state it's probably already too late. This may be a totally controlled simulation overlay. If there is an earth, under it, no telling what shape it's in, cause no one can see it…to fix it.

a reply to: GargIndia

NO can do Garg,that's slavery again.
We should not mitigate war horror by throwing "inferior" people at it. Only stopping it will work.
IT just AMAZES me how people think soldiering with ANY skill is for stupid people. They don't win wars,IMAGINATION does. A superior faith that allows a guy to STAND there and fight,that can't be programed or genetically ENHANCED.
FAITH.

originally posted by: AfterInfinity
reply to post by burntheships

 

Here's my question: why haven't they perfected their techniques on other, smaller, more expendable mammals first?

Because if you actually read the bid request, you'll see that they're not talking about putting them in live people, which would be monumentally difficult.

It's for inserting large blocks of DNA into cells in human cell cultures. In a petri dish. To use them for producing antibodies, or for use as a toxin sensor or the like.