Whatever you believe is true!

reply to post by Deetermined


Are you proposing that we do not need to "think" about our own beliefs and actions in accord to God's equation, expectation, and word?


We all have different 'relationships' with mankind, with the world, with existence, with life, and with that which many call 'God'.

"Relationship" is regarding awareness, perception, thought, emotion, experience, time, space, place, and cause-effect.

In unity and love we are One, but as physical humanbeings,.... we are relative-subjective perceivers of truth.

Originally posted by jhill76
That statement rings true. For example: From your viewpoint, you believe that angels are not real. Unto self, this is true, because you have not had any experiences or proof of their existence.

Now, since you believe that this is true, when a message is needed to be said to you from above, Father will not send one that appears as an angel. This reason is because you have made up in your mind, that they do not exist. For if he did, and said person said they are an angel, you will be so hung up on the angel aspect, you will discard the message that is given to you. The message is more important than the giver. Nor, does the giver, require any belief on your part, the giver is more worried about the message, that they are conveying.

Or, for example, you believe that man charts his own path. You are not faulted for this by above, because above understands why you think this way, unlike here, where you are faulted for believing a certain way. Many are best utilized because of the way their thought processes work.

Hitler for example, believed in total control of the world, to him he believed that was his purpose. When an event needs to occur, or a path needs to be followed, Father needs said person to believe in it wholeheartedly, not partially. Each one here has a purpose, rather good or bad, which is all perspective anyway, depending upon which viewpoint your are looking at it from.

Does Father require belief? No, because he will still continue to do what is needed, and he knows your thought processes, and he understands more than anyone here or above, why you do the things you do. Man is not here to understand why he does the things he does, but man is here to understand why man does the things he does. It is all a learning process for all. If one believes one way, let him, if another, another way, let him. Man is only allowed to see the outside, not the inside of a persons thought processes, that is too intrusive.

You never know, Father could have said person believe the way he does, for a purpose you are not privy to, nor have the understanding to understand.

You are beginning to see the picture of reality creating and the freedom of what man chooses. People create their own reality every single day. You may or may not know it. But your mind creates every aspect of your daily life in the physical plane (and other planes too). But if you could somehow master this reality creating using the mind of God, then you can bring Heaven on Earth. The reason why you see so many bad things happening in the world, such as wars, famine, death, poisonous plants and animals, disease, and so forth, is because the mind of man have created it all. If one person can master this ability, then he or she can bring Heaven on Earth in his local house or community. But if a 100 people in an area (such as a country) realize and master this ability, then you can see Paradise in the given area. Do you somewhat understand now why people shouldn't blame God for anything? Don't even blame yourself. When you understand this concept, stop blaming and start creating true life.

The master of reality creating can perform "miracles" like Jesus did. Although miracles to most people on Earth may seem incredible, to the one who already mastered it is just a "normal" everyday occurrence to her or him.

reply to post by Sahabi

Are you proposing that we do not need to "think" about our own beliefs and actions in accord to God's equation, expectation, and word?

We absolutely need to be thinking about our own beliefs and actions and how they fit in with God's expectations.

Unfortunately, I see more people trying to mold God into who/what they want him to be instead of truly considering who he is, accept him, and do his will over their own.

I think more people should start praying for truth, patience, a higher level of understanding and the ability to accept the truth, just in case it doesn't immediately sink in with their human emotions, instincts and minds.

reply to post by jhill76


I believe i can fly, that my body is immortal, that i am exempt from paying taxes and that I am a billionaire.

reply to post by votan


I believe that you belong in the psych ward.

reply to post by Deetermined

I'm not someone who believes in anything "random", even if our minds have a tendency to perceive it that way.

I believe everything has a perfectly designed order (like nature).

I also believe we (as humans) have a tendency to throw wrenches into that wheel spoke of order, but we'll never be able to throw it completely off track.

Everything has a way of regenerating itself, even when we think we've damaged it.

That still doesn't necessitate the presence of a ruling divine entity. It simply means that this universe was a happy accident that happened to last a little longer than we would have anticipated. We don't even know that this universe will not eventually fail. There's plenty of evidence suggesting that this universe is not the first, and will not be the last.

Your appreciation for the beauty of this universe is a good thing. But it doesn't mean you should jump to conclusions without due processing of all of the facts.

Fact # 1: You have lived less than 200 years on a single planet. You possess the most infinitesimal fraction of what this universe has to offer in terms of knowledge and experience.

So what gives you the experience to definitively say this entire universe is the product of a ruling divine entity?

reply to post by AfterInfinity

So what gives you the experience to definitively say this entire universe is the product of a ruling divine entity?

The same experience as anyone else who lives, breathes, and is less than 200 years old and alive to talk about it.

Life experience is the best experience. Other than that, I can't prove anything.

I know you're not very old, but surely something of significance has happened in your life that made you think that someone higher than yourself might have intervened or protected you or provided for you when you didn't expect it? No? Nothing at all?

No doubt we were given free will. By the actions of mankind, the evidence would suggest God maintains a "hand off" policy of non interference. But if this is not true then our free will is only partially free.

I believe the OP is correct to some extent.

A persons belief system can in fact create for them a world of many things that most people never experience, only they will. This is why so many religions are around, because people believe them and experience them.

This is partly why a psychic experiences more and a skeptic experiences less and a cynic experiences nothing with psychic abilities. There is truth in what you believe is what you experience.

Sometimes what you experience creates what you believe, it works both ways depending on what it is you are here on this earth to learn.
Whether you believe or not.

reply to post by Deetermined

I know you're not very old, but surely something of significance has happened in your life that made you think that someone higher than yourself might have intervened or protected you or provided for you when you didn't expect it? No? Nothing at all?

Nope. Because I prefer a more honest, "I don't know what happened, but I'm glad it did."

reply to post by jhill76


I believe that human males and females were not designed to engage in long lasting relationships. I believe that men are ruled by their genitals and women are ruled by materialism. I believe that men and women should never marry or even live together.

Is this true?

reply to post by NOTurTypical

Truth is not relative. In fact, there is a specific fallacy dealing with that very notion called the "Relativist Fallacy". Truth is independent of people knowing it or believing it. Case in point, the world was still round even when everyone believed it to be flat.

OK, there is a Wikipedia article on Relativist Fallacy.

The fallacy applies only to objective facts, or what are alleged to be objective facts, rather than to facts about personal tastes or subjective experiences, and only to facts regarded in the same sense and at the same time.

So, according to this description, the "fallacy" only applies within narrowly defined circumstances.
What does not fit those parameters is all "subjective" truth, things like God, which is not a specimen to be scientifically examined and quantified.

reply to post by jmdewey60


Lol, yes I know.

The question of something existing or not existing would be an objective fact.

ob·jec·tive  (b-jktv)
adj.
1. Of or having to do with a material object.
2. Having actual existence or reality.
3.
a. Uninfluenced by emotions or personal prejudices: an objective critic. See Synonyms at fair1.
b. Based on observable phenomena; presented factually: an objective appraisal.
4. Medicine Indicating a symptom or condition perceived as a sign of disease by someone other than the person affected.

"objective"

reply to post by jhill76

When an event needs to occur, or a path needs to be followed, Father needs said person to believe in it wholeheartedly, not partially.

No, he doesn't. His will shall be accomplished wether you tow the line or go your own way. It has nothing to do with him needing you to believe in anything. One who has everything has no needs.

I don't know who your "Father" is but he is not the biblical one. He punished Israel several times for trusting and believing in lies from false prophets and soothsayers. This was spoken of in Jeremiah 7, and various other scriptures. Believing in something does not make it right or true. Millions of people in the U.S. alone believe it is right to kill unborn babies, that does not make it right. One man may believe it is right for him to steal money from another. Truth and righteousness are not subjective.

Originally posted by lonewolf19792000
reply to post by jhill76

 

When an event needs to occur, or a path needs to be followed, Father needs said person to believe in it wholeheartedly, not partially.

No, he doesn't. His will shall be accomplished wether you tow the line or go your own way. It has nothing to do with him needing you to believe in anything. One who has everything has no needs.

I don't know who your "Father" is but he is not the biblical one. He punished Israel several times for trusting and believing in lies from false prophets and soothsayers. This was spoken of in Jeremiah 7, and various other scriptures. Believing in something does not make it right or true. Millions of people in the U.S. alone believe it is right to kill unborn babies, that does not make it right. One man may believe it is right for him to steal money from another. Truth and righteousness are not subjective.

edit on 31-7-2013 by lonewolf19792000 because: (no reason given)

That first little paragraph/reply is uber confused...you probably should reread what you wrote there...a few times!

The OP isn't really an exposé of whether believing in something is wrong or right (which really is situationally dependent, and therefore subjective)...just like believing in 'Jeremiah 7, and various other scriptures'...you are of course welcome to this belief...and for you, it IS TRUE...'Whatever you believe, is true'...I believe that was the title of the OP?!...and lo and behold...it is your subjective opinion...otherwise everyone would agree with you...So, the title actually confirms your belief, and vice versa...wakey wakey...

Å99

reply to post by jhill76


No. Just no. And shame on all the ATSers indulging this nonsense. OP, I think your heart is in the right place, but ultimately, you're doing everyone here a disservice. The klu klux klan BELIEVES that they're a superior race. Is that true? NAMBLA BELIEVES that sex with little boys is natural and acceptable. Is that true? Remember when we all believed that we were sending troops to Iraq to protect the U.S. from terrorism? Still believe that to be true? Lay off this everybody's right-hippie-bull crap. Reality is indisputable. Fantasy is subjective. If someone tells me they think they saw an angel the other day then I'm going to call their bluff. Ever notice the pattern with religious claims?: There's NEVER any hard evidence. Give me one good reason to tolerate something so silly save for sparing someone's precious feelings.

Originally posted by the sloth
reply to post by jhill76

 

No. Just no. And shame on all the ATSers indulging this nonsense. OP, I think your heart is in the right place, but ultimately, you're doing everyone here a disservice. The klu klux klan BELIEVES that they're a superior race. Is that true? NAMBLA BELIEVES that sex with little boys is natural and acceptable. Is that true? Remember when we all believed that we were sending troops to Iraq to protect the U.S. from terrorism? Still believe that to be true? Lay off this everybody's right-hippie-bull crap. Reality is indisputable. Fantasy is subjective. If someone tells me they think they saw an angel the other day then I'm going to call their bluff. Ever notice the pattern with religious claims?: There's NEVER any hard evidence. Give me one good reason to tolerate something so silly save for sparing someone's precious feelings.

edit on 31-7-2013 by the sloth because: ?

All these things are TRUE for them...

Give me hard evidence you are not a bot.

Å99

reply to post by lonewolf19792000

I don't know who your "Father" is but he is not the biblical one.

I can't even read any of his posts because the way he says that makes me nauseous.

Originally posted by lonewolf19792000
reply to post by jhill76

 

When an event needs to occur, or a path needs to be followed, Father needs said person to believe in it wholeheartedly, not partially.

No, he doesn't. His will shall be accomplished wether you tow the line or go your own way. It has nothing to do with him needing you to believe in anything. One who has everything has no needs.

I don't know who your "Father" is but he is not the biblical one. He punished Israel several times for trusting and believing in lies from false prophets and soothsayers. This was spoken of in Jeremiah 7, and various other scriptures. Believing in something does not make it right or true. Millions of people in the U.S. alone believe it is right to kill unborn babies, that does not make it right. One man may believe it is right for him to steal money from another. Truth and righteousness are not subjective.

edit on 31-7-2013 by lonewolf19792000 because: (no reason given)

Let us use scripture to drive this point home.

What is required of believers when it comes to doubt and having total belief.

But he must ask in faith without any doubting, for the one who doubts is like the surf of the sea, driven and tossed by the wind. James 1:6

You limit Father to only requiring belief for believers. Yet, why does he not require belief in the ones whom he builds up for dishonor as you are given.

Has the potter no right over the clay, to make out of the same lump one vessel for honorable use and another for dishonorable use? Romans 9:21

Surely for his purpose of good and evil, he will need the non believers to believe in what they believe in, for how could they do their task properly here?

I create the light and make the darkness, I send good times and bad times, I the Lord am the one who does these things. Isiah 45:7

Satan is not to be blamed for all things bad. Father created some here to be evil as you would put it, all for a purpose.

reply to post by jhill76


I think... no... I'm positive that you're confusing you're "father" with random acts of nature. By the way, what good has all of your father's plotting, molding, and favoritism done so far? Oh wait that's right. You're sitting comfortably in your chair surfing the internet, munching on midnight snacks, while babies in Africa are dying miserably every 40 seconds (objective FACT). Praise God. May his message spread to the darkest corners of the earth. Amen.