First Case Of New Bird Flu Found Outside China

reply to post by Danbones

That is really a mixed bag. isn't it? Whether quarantine enforced with lethal force is a good or bad thing really depends on which side of the perimeter you're on, doesn't it? I have a strong system personally but my wife's immune system is not what I would call robust. She'd be very vulnerable to a thing like this if it either mutates worse or just spread fast once it crosses the ocean...and they all eventually do.

Again tho? Is fearing for her about cheering or breaking quarantine? If we're INSIDE it and she isn't sick? Now then I want OUT while she's still alive and showing no symptoms. If we're outside the lines and watching it spread inside? I'd feel a good deal different about those busting out with viral loads to share with everyone else.

Of course...the idea that they could realistically quarantine the flu is probably absurd anyway. Ebola? Sure... It's SO bloody dangerous and the mortality rate is SO high, it burns itself out almost every time and quickly ...it's ONE gift in a bad bad scene. The flu tho? I'll bet any hope of containment is well past talking about by the time anyone realized it was needed.

Originally posted by Wrabbit2000
I'll bet any hope of containment is well past talking about by the time anyone realized it was needed.

I agree. This could become a World Wide problem, if those who are in control are unwilling to do the things they need to do. Namely, kill all the poultry near affected areas, and quarantine those near these birds for days. It just has to be done. Also, Stop flights from originating from infected areas. MHO.

reply to post by sonnny1

I think you hit on one of the worst fears the people at the CDC and others on this end of the health services lose sleep over at times. International travel as current aircraft are configured and set up. It's just a big petri dish with seats and engines. I've always wondered why they can't do something about that. Even small things. After all, it is a relatively closed environment and for hours at a time on intercontinental flights.

Spraying disinfectant wouldn't work because there is always a % allergic or just sensitive to almost anything. However, how about black lights? Hospitals and other locations seem to use them to solid effect at entry ways and other places to passively knock down the bug count in the open air, right? How hard would it be to run some in subtle places down the inner line of the cabin or simply bathe the ducts with it where the air is recirculated?

'tooooo much money' I know. yaddah yaddah. How much will it cost if a plane brings 'The Spanish Lady's' distant cousin for a visit with the rest of the passengers and anyone can EVER prove which plane and airline was the actual first vector? Oh I wouldn't want to imagine the lawsuits in time over that one ..unless I were among the attorneys collecting 30-40% off the top, of course.

Originally posted by Wrabbit2000


'tooooo much money' I know. yaddah yaddah. How much will it cost if a plane brings 'The Spanish Lady's' distant cousin for a visit with the rest of the passengers and anyone can EVER prove which plane and airline was the actual first vector? Oh I wouldn't want to imagine the lawsuits in time over that one ..unless I were among the attorneys collecting 30-40% off the top, of course.

I think the survivors of something like this would benefit the most. Sad to say.
I don't think something like the 1918 flue Pandemic has a good survival rate..........

reply to post by Wrabbit2000


...Scientists were predicting the "perfect microbial storm" before 2003. On ATS, Beyond Bird Flu: The Perfect Microbial Storm - from the National Academies Press...

Microbial Threats to Health: Emergence, Detection, and Response (2003)

Introduction

It was “the perfect storm”—a tempest that may happen only once in a century—a nor’easter created by so rare a combination of factors that it could not possibly have been worse. Creating waves ten stories high and winds of 120 miles an hour, the storm whipped the sea to inconceivable levels few people on Earth have ever witnessed.

The Perfect Storm: A True Story of Men Against the Sea

Sebastian Junger

A transcendent moment nears upon the world for a microbial perfect storm. Unlike the meteorological perfect storm—happening just once in a century—the microbial perfect storm will be a recurrent event. The two events share a common feature; a combination of factors is the driving force behind each.

reply to post by sonnny1

This could become a World Wide problem, if those who are in control are unwilling to do the things they need to do. Namely, kill all the poultry near affected areas, and quarantine those near these birds for days. It just has to be done. Also, Stop flights from originating from infected areas. MHO.

It started in the USA in 1988, it's already been spreading for 14 years, and it's definitely in the world - in the soil, water, other animals and gawdknows where. Probably carried by flies and maybe other ectoparasites. Point being - it's waayyy too late to quarantine. We made this world and created the conditions that create these pandemic diseases. If we want to stop the train, we have to put things back the way they were. And I don't think that's possible.

reply to post by soficrow


A Pandemic is bound to happen, regardless if we do all those things. I just think some precaution might forestall it from happening................................ like tomorrow.

Great Thread BTW.

reply to post by sonnny1


Thanks. And I agree. Sort of. Actually, I think we need to rethink how we see "disease" and start to recognize that it's adaptive, part of a necessary evolutionary process. [We changed the world into something different than what it was, now we have to adapt if we want to survive on this re-configured planet of ours.]

pretty scary if you ask me. it reminds me of the movie contagion where a woman visits an asian country and brings the virus back and infects other people leading in a worldwide outbreak of a supposed "bird flu". im in vietnam on a trip and this is just ramping up my paranoia haha

www.abovetopsecret.com...

I thought that this thread from 2009 which shows the historic relation between solar maximum and flu pandemics was worth a look.
There have been pandemic influenza spikes recorded with every single solar maximum.

Great find there Elliot......thats an interesting avenue......tho cant tell where it may lead.....
One wonders of there are pigs or rabbits, or any other small food mamals which could be carrying this.....?
They even eat rats over there i understand....some places....
I am personally not familar with Chinese food culture, but the H1N1 was found in pigs as secondary infections from the fowl....
Other food animals perhaps help spread?

reply to post by stardustlifeform


It should ramp up your paranoia - hope you're washing your hands a hundred times a day!

S&

reply to post by Elliot


I really think the idea of that association has merit - EXCEPT - this solar maximum seems to be more like a very low minimum.

S&

reply to post by stirling


Hey - Tests on pigs and dogs were negative - pigeons seem to be a carrier but not the source (and poultry is NOT the source, no matter what the spin). This clade got established in the markets' environments (soil, water) and then was picked up by a few birds. The pigeons and chickens did NOT bring the virus to the markets - they got infected in the markets. Now it's spreading in the wild. But where did it come from? Definitely not rats - it really is genetically linked to bird flu (the H7N9 that first appeared in Minnesota in 1988). But H7N9's new mutations cannot be explained by its spread in poultry and wild birds - and the limited rates of infection in poultry mean poultry is not responsible for H7N9's spread in humans.

As far as human-to-human transmission - Absence of evidence is not evidence of absence.

...At this point I'm beginning to suspect ectoparasites as a vector and of course, corporate GE for nefarious purpose.

reply to post by soficrow

Also, interesting is that this virus does not always test positive in carriers to start with. Some victims have been tested several times before they test positive for H7N9. Could it be hiding in their nervous system and replicating there,

Also, remember the cases of a mysterious flu illness in Germany which killed a policeman, and I'm not sure how many others were affected . Three were struggling to survive. Then read the next link of a case in the UK of a young girl, again cold / flu like illness and dies of organ failiure last saturday just as the policeman did...multiple organ failiure. Strange?

www.flutrackers.com...

www.dailymail.co.uk...

reply to post by soficrow

oh i am definitely washing all the time . its hard not to because of giant rats and such all over the place here everywhere you go. i just hope the bird flu doesnt make its way to southeast asia ill try to keep up to date on the vietnam outbreaks by trying to translate the news a bit more.

I really feel everyone should be aware of the following extremely easy and extremely effective, if done properly, treatment for flu. VITAMIN C

Massive doses of vitamin C will make sure you don't die. Read the info on that site. It's called bowel tolerance vitamin C. I've done it, and it works. And as you can clearly see, this doctor is pissed that no one seems to know this.

He even has a section on how to treat yourself with vitamin C if you have bird flu, although it was the last scare.

reply to post by thebtheb

Thanks for the "vitamin C" (ascorbic acid) link. Is this link on the Vitamin C threads here? If not, it's a good one and might be good to post it there. I'll post it on my thread on C, which came before finding out about the make-it-yourself threads.

reply to post by Wrabbit2000


thousands upon thousands die from the flu each year....it happens...hopefully not to any of us or our loved ones

reply to post by Elliot

Also, interesting is that this virus does not always test positive in carriers to start with. Some victims have been tested several times before they test positive for H7N9. Could it be hiding in their nervous system and replicating there,

Also, remember the cases of a mysterious flu illness in Germany which killed a policeman, and I'm not sure how many others were affected . Three were struggling to survive. Then read the next link of a case in the UK of a young girl, again cold / flu like illness and dies of organ failiure last saturday just as the policeman did...multiple organ failiure. Strange?

www.flutrackers.com...

www.dailymail.co.uk...

S& Well worth reposting!

Thanks