Civil War in Venezuela

This subject is personal to me. My wife is Venezuelan and she is in Venezuela at the moment. While taking the dogs to the vet there was machine gun fire outside. Someone had driven by on a motocycle and opened fire.
One person was killed. Just speaking to her now. Obviously she is shaken but luckily they didnt park the car where they normalyl do (where the shooting took place) and they are ok physically.

As you have probably seen in the news the election was very close polarizing the nation even more than it normally is. A recount was demanded by the opposition, this was first accepted by Muduro but then later declined.

They signed him into office 4 days earlier than the should of.

The ballot boxes and votes have/are being destroyed and although they also use an electronic system this can easily be manipulated.
.Caprilles (the opposition leaded) has asked for people to protest peacefully. Everyone went out on to the street (my wife included) and banged pans.Although this is not that effective the sound could be heard throughout Venezuela even in the once Chavista Barrios of Caracas.

pans

Caprilles even went as far to call off a March because he had information that the Government had infiltrated the group and was planning to cause trouble.

Most of the police,national guard and army are Chavistas and have all the firepower.There have been shootings (more than normal) all over the country and this time I dont think the people are going to lay down and take it.

Apparently Muduros government have called for the arrest of Caprilles which if it does happen will defiantly cause more bloodshed .

The night of Tuesday, the national leader of Popular Will, Leopoldo López reported through his Twitter account that there are "orders" prepared the court the 6th control against him and Henrique Capriles. "We hope that this persecution and run this political order "issued

globovision.com...

Protests generate 7 dead, 63 injured and 170 arrested

prensademiranda.com...

The head of Ceofanb, Wilmer Barrientos said Tuesday afternoon that the Bolivarian National Armed Forces remain in the streets to protect the peace of Venezuelans .

The head of Ceofanb, Wilmer Barrientos said Tuesday afternoon that the Bolivarian National Armed Forces remain in the streets to protect the peace of Venezuelans . He said that so far there are 170 detainees, 63 wounded and 7 killed by the protests that have been inspiring in several states. Barrientos said he will be facing any act of violence and said "we condemn the acts of vandalism that threaten peace."

Here are some of the irregularities

enrique Capriles listed in detail the list of some of the irregularities that were detected in the voting process on Sunday. Presented facts and some documents (such as minutes) that prove their allegations. - There were 535,000 damaged machines, which represent 189,982 votes. -
There were 1,176 centers where Maduro pulled more votes than Hugo Chavez, one of those he said drew nearly 1,000% more votes. "Who can believe that Maduro has pulled more votes than Chavez, if nearly 1 million voters voted for Capriles Chavez," he said. - He said that witnesses were removed by force in 286 centers, which means more than 722,983 voters. -
He reported that there were 564 assisted voting centers, which affects 1,479,774 voters. - He said that more than 600,000 people died in the ER, who voted many people over 100 years old. - The standard bearer of the opposition said that there were 397 centers where voters were intimidated, something that would affect 1,240,000 voters. -
He also explained that in 421 centers were proselytizing, which affected 1,180,000 voters. He said there are also cases of polling stations where there were more votes than voters who appear on the tally. "That must be an audit, because when reviewing everything can detect the problem. The law says that if there is an irregularity table is canceled at that table, "he said.

www.el-nacional.com...

There are many more reports of violence on twiiter and such (from both sides)

There needs to be a recount and then the result needs to be accepted.Such a huge divide has been created. I hope I am wrong but i fear a civil war may be on the horizon.

I know opinion is divided but when you have seen things with your own eyes and get a personal view on the situation then your mind can change.

Please see my other threads for my personal opinion on the situation.

All comments welcome.

Ps sorry for the bad translations it is from google chrome and although I can speak spanish my ability to write and translate is not so good. Also my wife is not in any mood to translate for me.


www.abovetopsecret.com...

www.abovetopsecret.com...

www.abovetopsecret.com...

Wow, I'm glad your wife is ok. Thanks for all the information, I had no idea.

Yet another little South American country who can't seem to govern themselves without violence.

Put a fence around the country, drop a ton of weapons in there, and see who comes out on top.

Originally posted by Hopechest
Yet another little South American country who can't seem to govern themselves without violence.

Put a fence around the country, drop a ton of weapons in there, and see who comes out on top.

That's all fine and good for the warring factions, but what about all the innocents that have nothing to do with this?

reply to post by Hopechest


Problem is the majority of the weapons are in the hands of the government and the supporters and the opposition are seen as privileged and fair game to violence.

reply to post by Covertblack


Yes she and the dogs are fine and it turns out that Mandy (one of the dogs ) doesnt have an infection.

Invade them then and make it the 51st state.

They have enough resources to justify inclusion into the union and they are strategically located.

and of course, none of the US 3-letter agencies have a clue about what's going on. when US corporations get thrown out of a country, especially oil companies, it's time for action....this has happened so many times before, it's a yawn-inducing SOP

reply to post by jimmyx


I agree that the country should own its own assets however the money need sto be spent on the infrastructure of the country not just lining the governments pockets. Chavez has totally failed in his so called revolution. Crime is through the roof, there is very little industry, everything has to be imported and corruption is rife.

I am sure the 3 letter agencies have some involvement but dont think for one minute that Chavez ever refused to trade oil with the USA it was all for show.

reply to post by maythetruthbeknown


In the pre-election polls Maduro was supposed to win it by a landslide. Of course that was highly unacceptable to the US and foreign (to Venezuela) corporate interests. And its not like the US would EVER try to swing a foreign election in their favor, no of course not.

My wife is Venezuelan and she is in Venezuela at the moment.

Are we to take it that she doesn't actually live there, just visiting? Don't Americans have a hissy fit when foreigners try to sway American political elections? I guess its okay when the shoe is on the other foot, especially if that country has OIL.

reply to post by maythetruthbeknown


Dictatorships, even supposedly benign ones always start with peace and talk of peace.

It never lasts though.

Best wishes to your wife and everyone else.

Originally posted by Hopechest
Invade them then and make it the 51st state.

They have enough resources to justify inclusion into the union and they are strategically located.

I am pretty sure almost no one from Venezuela wants that. The USA just wants what is good for itself not the population of an invaded country and the whole world knows it.

These are troubling times. May God bless your wife and return her safely to you.

reply to post by Hopechest

Hardly a little country. It has one of the largest oil reserves in the world, but has been grossly miss-managed. Dropping bombs seems to be one of America's answer to most problems in foreign countries. I do think Venezuela needs some kind of change. Although Chavez was a good leader he had no idea how to run an economy.

The alternative are corrupt right wing businessmen.

Trouble there is no half way house.

reply to post by frazzle

In the pre-election polls Maduro was supposed to win it by a landslide.

I dont know where you are getting your information. Most of the poll were done by the government.There were a few independent which put Caprilles 7.1 and 12 points ahead.
dossier33.com...

cronicasvenezuela.com...

I have no love for corporations and having lived in Venezuela on and off for 7 years so I can truly see the divide this political situation has created. To answer your question she is living there at the moment we are in the process of sorting out a visa(easier said then done)

Thanks for your opinion

reply to post by onthedownlow


Yes they are, thankyou for your concern and your kind words

reply to post by beezzer

Dictatorships, even supposedly benign ones always start with peace and talk of peace. It never lasts though. Best wishes to your wife and everyone else.

The problem is I think it has gone past the point of a peaceful outcome. The country is so divided and it has always been onesided in terms of violence. I think the people feel they are getting nowhere being peaceful. I hope I am wrong.
Thanks for your kind words

This is why it is important not to surrender your freedom in the first place, because now they have to fight to get it back. The dictator of Venezuela will eventually be defeated as people tend to love freedom over slavery. It's going to take time for that to happen.

reply to post by maythetruthbeknown


This is one of my sources, there are others.

By Lee Brown, VSC Executive

With 10 days to go until Venezuelans elect their next President, polls show that Hugo Chávez’s favoured successor, Nicolas Maduro, is set to achieve another landslide victory for the progressive alliance that has governed Venezuela since 1998.

In the seven polls undertaken so far, Maduro has an average of 52.6%, a 16% lead over his right-wing rival Henrique Capriles Radonski who trails behind on 36.3% (see graph 1).

Just 11% responded by saying that they did not yet know who they would vote for, or that they would not vote. These figures mean that even if there was a 100% turnout and every one of the ‘undecideds’ backed Capriles, this would not be enough to overturn Maduro’s lead.

The polls also suggest another very high turnout following last October’s record 81% participation, when Hugo Chavez beat Henrique Capriles by 55% to 44%.

Nicolas Maduro’s lead widens further when looking at only those who have expressed a preference. Maduro has an average score of 59.2% compared to 40.8% for Capriles, a huge lead of 18.4% (see graph 2).

Even amongst Henrique Capriles’ supporters, there is a belief that Nicolas Maduro will win. For example according to the latest IVAD poll 64% think Maduro will be elected and only 23% think Capriles will be . Other pollsters show similar patterns. Datanalisis shows 62% believe Maduro will be president against just 20% for Capriles.

www.venezuelasolidarity.co.uk...

And another:

Merida, April 10th 2013 (Venezuelanalysis.com) – This morning United Socialist Party of Venezuela (PSUV) leader Diosdado Cabello presented evidence, including phone recordings, documents, and emails, allegedly proving that the opposition has plans to not recognise the 14 April presidential election results.

Cabello played an audio recording of a phone conversation to the public in which Joao Nunes, Capriles’ bodyguard and driver, said that Capriles won’t recognise Sunday’s results if he loses.

venezuelanalysis.com...

reply to post by frazzle


These sites are both biased towards the PSUV . A question for you.. If there was not any manipulation of the votes why was a recount not allowed and why were the ballots destroyed??