College degree needed to get even low paying jobs today.

Its an employers market right now. They can post ridiculous qualifications for a job knowing somewhere there is somebody with it. I read one wanting a masters of mechanical engineering, with 6 or 7 different certifications for a $15/hr maintenance job. The days of walking in, applying and starting are way over. Last HR person I talked to said on average they get over 100 qualified applicants per job, plus countless others that are not qualified. Talking engineering field here. A lot of the jobs that a BS was good enough for 10 years ago when I got mine, are requiring friggen PhD's.

The job market is so messed up right now. My roomie applied for a job at one of the larger chain book stores here, they denied him because he didn't have a minimum of a bachelors. The next job he applied for was an IT position which he is well overqualified for. 12+ years experience, he has no degree etc.

The reason he was declined the job... He didn't have a smartphone. He had a cellphone that was a step under a smartphone. Same capabilities etc just without the stupid extras but it wasn't good enough.

We learned that later, our friend was trying to get him the job, that my roomie had all the experience, just no smartphone. Yeah. Pretty damn pathetic reason to withhold a job.

Yup, a lot of place will pass up someone with 20+ years of experience in the field for someone with a college degree.

I would suggest that the reason for this trend towards college degrees is very much attached to the complete collapse of manufacturing in the United States. There simply are not enough "blue collar" jobs left and those that remain are heavily dependent on robotics and computers to do the work.

reply to post by Thalestris


I love Raven... Anyway, moving right back along onto topic now.

Yep, the job market is on its head. I've never seen so much insanity granted this is only my 20th year and 11th month alive I've seen many crazy things but nothing quite so messed up as this. It brings a tear to my eye really because I know that my life is going to be tough like the lives of our ancestors who had to migrate (well, at least MY ancestors) from Germany and find a place to settle in probably working low wage jobs for chump change all the time just to make a life for their families.... Right, I have to go to class now as I think about how I'm being mistreated by the system yada yada.

reply to post by Myomistress


Oh dear, you are trying to bail for Canada? Have fun with that because the only way I'm heading to the Great White North is by getting just the card and travelling to a border state and taking a bus. Unfortunately, I'll probably never cross due to debt and having a hard time finding a job in my condition.

But we can always hope, right?

reply to post by nomnom


So by this logic, if I study every movie known to man and practice shots with my 10 megapixel Kodachrome camera...which only lasts about 3 mins of footage before crapping out on me...I can waltz into a movie studio and say "Hire me! I didn't go to no fancy film school, but I do know my film and cameras!"

I am tempted and fearful of trying this logic myself, or this means I need to find a 'real' job and not put fresh blood into an already shallow and dumbed down industry.

I didn't "need" a college education. I can do electronic repairs, hell, I can repair most anything really. BUT nobody around here would give me a chance and relocating was completely out of the question because of money. So after 5 or so years of finding nothing I decided school was my only option. Now I am a computer science major at the local university and I will be somewhere around $80K in debt by the time I finish. And to think... All of this was just to hope that I can have a chance to make a little more than minimum wage for the remainder of my life.

reply to post by TheToastmanCometh


Depends.

If that three minutes of film is magic, you will have an in.

It's a confidence game out there, more than anything. I didn't write the rules, just know how to follow them to the extent that I have the freedoms to be as I am on my own time.

I just hope that once the economy finally witnesses the bottoming of the dollar, student loan debt will be cleared.

There are tons of jobs out there for trade skills. If you were to go straight from high school into trade school and obtain a skill you would be employed. Apparently getting your hands dirty equates to being stupid today. You can make 100k a year in a trade. The key to success is excellence. Get a trade skill, there are plenty of good paying jobs out there for skilled workers.

Originally posted by jimmiec
There are tons of jobs out there for trade skills. If you were to go straight from high school into trade school and obtain a skill you would be employed. Apparently getting your hands dirty equates to being stupid today. You can make 100k a year in a trade. The key to success is excellence. Get a trade skill, there are plenty of good paying jobs out there for skilled workers.

Some people don't get a choice though...

Like in my situation. I live in a university town so everything costs more. The nearest trade school is in another city and you need a car to get there but if you can't find a job that pays more than minimum wage and don't have anyone to help you out then you pretty much can't afford a vehicle if you plan on paying rent.

Trust me, if I could have had a way to get there I would have much rather became an electrician.

Originally posted by jimmiec
There are tons of jobs out there for trade skills. If you were to go straight from high school into trade school and obtain a skill you would be employed. Apparently getting your hands dirty equates to being stupid today. You can make 100k a year in a trade. The key to success is excellence. Get a trade skill, there are plenty of good paying jobs out there for skilled workers.

Trade is looked down upon, by the educated class, including my family, so i was "forced" to get my degree. Its a norm in my family for couple of generation now, higher education is priority.

The thing about trade is that, it would start you off high(55k), you can slightly improve(65-80k) but you will reach a cap(120k). Unlike Degrees, which starts you off in the middle(50k) you can keep climbing, and it will go for very high level..could reach 200k+ in 5-10yrs.

And the biggest off all, degree jobs are usually easy job... desk job or very minute physical job, unlike trades, which are very high demanding of a healthy body.

Another reason why i like degree is that, you learn things, i know i know, everyone is actually after the final paper of authentication, but i enjoyed my microbiology classes.

Originally posted by Anundeniabletruth
I didn't "need" a college education. I can do electronic repairs, hell, I can repair most anything really. BUT nobody around here would give me a chance and relocating was completely out of the question because of money. So after 5 or so years of finding nothing I decided school was my only option. Now I am a computer science major at the local university and I will be somewhere around $80K in debt by the time I finish. And to think... All of this was just to hope that I can have a chance to make a little more than minimum wage for the remainder of my life.

And there's the point: for very exceptional people, the "no real schooling, bootstrap" method will bring success. For *most* people, it lands you in a minimum wage job forever. Neither of my kids has a college degree (though the son is now working on it, having learned that the military really IS NOT a substitute for a degree) and they're earning far below what I did at their age.

Over the long term (I'm over 50), and for most people, a college education means a better income.

Now... let me also add that the reason I didn't graduate with a ton of debt like the rest of my friends is because I didn't take out loans. I worked my way through school. It's a lot longer, but distance learning programs are making it a lot easier (and more affordable) to get the piece of paper.

reply to post by luciddream


Many trades are commission based. You can make as much as you want. Then when you get off work you can do side work for even more money. A lot of machine shops do piece work. Meaning they pay you, oh say 3 bucks per piece. You get good at it and can make $300 a day or more if you want. Trades are far less boring too. Every day is different.

reply to post by Anundeniabletruth


It sounds like you could make good money at a trade in your town. Talk to electricians and see if you can get hired to do grunt work, then work your way up. I was once a rod buster. I knew nothing about tying steel or reading blueprints. I got a job as a laborer and became friends with the job superintendent. He taught me how to read blueprints and tie rebar, etc. I got lucky and the head rod buster had to move out of state. I got the job! I went from grunt work to running the show pretty much. Karma can be a bitch, it can also be a savior. The super and i used to shoot pool at a local bar a couple nights a week. We always played for a beer. One night i said " A beer against a 50 cent raise?" He went along! Oh my. I got a lot of raises.

So stop getting stupid degrees. It's your choice. If you go to college and get a degree in chemical engineering or robotics, I guarantee you'll get a good job at the end of it. But if you insist on shuffling your way through four years to get a degree in anthropology, English, or sociology, then bitch about getting a job at Subway, you deserve it because you were stupid. Either you're not smart enough to hack the math or too lazy to assess the job market. Of course, if you want a liberal education "for the knowledge" that's great! But it doesn't teach you job skills. And, no, I don't want to pay off your debt. That's your responsibility.

In my job situation I had many people with bachelor's degrees working at a simple clerical level. And that's all they could do. They couldn't write a business letter not full of grammar and spelling mistakes. They did not seem to even want to advance within the organization even though there was opportunity to do so. They were pretty good clerks, but did not have the energy or desire to do anything else. So be it.

Scam~ Scam~ Scam~

I learned a trade during high school from my father. And Mastered several after (Machinist for 4 yrs including Tig welding) Anything Mechanical i'm apt and can learn on the fly anything I desired (That piece of paper show's your learnt aptitude and only show's you can learn something), I'm 30 now just collage basics. I ran a successful company for 4 years but stoped after the birth of my daughter in 2012 (You can be monetarily taken care of but then there is no time to be a father, hard decission for anyone to make)

Sold my company and found a job in the most unreliable economy I've ever seen. All the while I hear Obama's "Go to school Rhetoric" All the While Policeman/Fireman/Sherriffs/Teachers and Doctors alike are loosing there jobs and practices. Biggest waste of time and I almost fell into the entrapment as well, as I second guessed myself in the past. Now I have never thought twice about returning if not for specific certificates.

You can learn to push a pencil, but I can build a house, wire it, floor it, drywall it, and fix anything inside~ As well as all the business quirks that go along with doing these jobs. Never had a problem finding any job I wanted.

But that's me, and I will make sure I send my daughter goes to collage and is " Well Educated " but not for some degree that no degree is needed just job experiance.

I'm sorry to all who are in debt over schooling, it's unjust and that knowledge should be free for individuals to learn and grow in my honest opinion. I wish you the best and want every one of you to be financially stable and successful in whatever field of study or job you are working towards.

Best~

I'm currently a college student in my final semester. However, I am fortunate that I was also in the military and the G.I. Bill is paying for my college so I have wracked up 0 debt towards my degree. I am also majoring in computer science, so I know that there is some sort of demand for my major once I graduate. Unfortunately, every year that goes by there are more and more comp sci majors. This market is going to become oversaturated if it isn't already.

I've already started the job seeking process, Have a few prospects, but nothing concrete yet.

It all boils down to the fact we are in an "employers market" and the supply heavily outweighs the demand. So there will be many businesses that take this route but reading that article OP, the guy is pretty condescending and I think that is just how he views people.

The comment made about how those without degrees would feel out of place because of their comradeship shows that is the culture of this specific law firm and they view only people that plodded through college, regardless of what they did or how they did, to be better workers.

It will swing back into equilibrium if allowed to (heavy Governmental intrusion never works and will make it worse; ie, the push that everyone should go college). I can't see it going down to mom-and-pop shops or even Wal-Mart type places. It will hopefully stay within a sphere of already specialized professional business (even if the job itself is not).