I'm worried about ATS..

Sometimes I wonder if the people who come here just read what they want to be told, and everything else goes into their mental dust bin. They see what they expect to see, they read what they want to read, and they ignore what they aren't interested in knowing.

How many members here do that? I know I have a few times, but I like bashing my head against a wall just to see if it's gotten any softer. So more often than not, I'll participate in threads that absolutely infuriate me, if only to provide a challenge for my faculties. I like to test myself, and ATS does that for me every time I visit.

reply to post by AdamOver


Dude, well put. I can't even add more. Hahaha just well put, bro.

reply to post by EnochWasRight


I'm with you on the messianic expectation or what might be called a participatory eschatology as the only reasonable position to take (however ultra-reasonable or supra-rational it may be), but I guess based on what you're saying that it will mean absolutely no porn of any kind, so it scares me a bit "the end of perversity" as much as it fills me with bright hope and eternal optimism.

Edit to add: Too much information eh? (it was "clean" nothing weird or anything like that).

And you get to dig silly holes for yourself and get your ego dented, what an opportunity that surely can't be missed.

reply to post by AdamOver

Where once sensible, logical dialogue could be expected. Now there are too many personal inferences being used in debate.

Now that I think about it, I see this also.
The most frustrating thing for a member like myself who reads many threads, old and new, is when two members turn the topic into a personal battle. I'm sure many readers would prefer raw data over cut-down contest.

The older threads are streamline. People who chime in were more likely to add info rather than attack someone. This makes for much better reading.

Originally posted by AdamOver
I have been coming here for years. But I think what the op is describing (or trying to) is that the site and it's members seem to have become more 'mainstream' (I know that's not the correct example, but probably the closest)

You hit the nail on the head, and the mainstream whether pro or against whatever, are rapid with ignorance, and it's overflowing the banks no matter how many sand bags you throw up to try to maintain a healthy and eventually a happy course.

They're "mainstream", whether from the MSM on the one side or Alex Jones on the other. That's where they're coming from, and it's changing the whole tone and tenor of the place.

People are losing the critical rational faculty in favor of a tit for tat I'm right you're wrong "debate", and the quality of the information just goes to crap in the process. It's thoughtless, gut level preprogrammed reaction/response mechanisms based in ego, born out of the need to dominate or to avoid domination nothing more. And it's totally uninspiring - ha! they're not even winning ANYONE over to their way of thinking in the process either, which makes the whole exercise an absurd and ridiculous waste of time and energy.

reply to post by Garkiniss


I feel like wandering off into seclusion land. Not just here, but many sites I enjoy seem to be increasingly malevolent, and leave me less and less in terms of utility. Sometimes I see an old name and realize it's been a while...where is this person, only to find they never came back. You can trace their last interaction to a snide response from another person, and then they got off, removed themselves from the scene. I have done it myself as well, just said 'enough', and walked off. I begin to notice that certain groups are simply shallow, and will ignore your most ardent writings, while snatching up a less than good post and then trying to 'embarrass' you, by including it in their next, completely pointless farting sound they call a thought, often seconds after you spoke. That is a key sign you are being used, basically. I won't stick around for this any longer. Better to be silent than get tossed off the site by taking appropriate verbal measures.

One thing I have learned from solitude (isolation really) is that you will not only find 'God', you will find a literal vibration, a new 'heartbeat', of which anything less becomes a step backwards. I wish, at times, I could strike everything I have said from the world. Just remove it. I'd rather the earth quake during a love letter sent, than have everyone telling me what a great top poster I am. A real gold contributor who knows how to be first to post on any subject, thereby garnering greater accolades as per the rules of popularity. (it is statistically to one's advantage to be a dribble head who races to be first to speak, since prizes tend to wane as pages grow in number). I have learned to dislike such persons. I am far from being a good person, but I do mean what I say. The second I say something that tickles someone's 'I can make a fool of you now' bone, these type arise to the fore, and their lack of comprehension of the universe leaves me hollow. May their glass be forever 'half full'. For me, half full is simply empty. I find greater vibes being utterly alone, as though the earth, and I, are one. I can keep a secret, because the secret keeps me where I belong. It is not for everybody to know.

Originally posted by tanda7
reply to post by AdamOver

 

Where once sensible, logical dialogue could be expected. Now there are too many personal inferences being used in debate.

Now that I think about it, I see this also.
The most frustrating thing for a member like myself who reads many threads, old and new, is when two members turn the topic into a personal battle. I'm sure many readers would prefer raw data over cut-down contest.

The older threads are streamline. People who chime in were more likely to add info rather than attack someone. This makes for much better reading.

Not surprising - the "Reality Show" generation is growing up and going online. Attack, be afraid of your friends, get her before she gets me, throw momma off the island. That generation has no memory of media or communication before reality TV, and they think that "us against them" is normal social interaction between allied groups of people who must then turn on their allies as well. To me Reality Shows have caused people to jump the shark into waters not as calm as they could be if they got rid of that attitude.

reply to post by NewAgeMan


The biggest change I noticed is that I enjoyed the site much more when I was a lurker...once I started posting and really having an opinion on stuff it made me not enjoy it as much. I really don't know why.

Hmm.

reading "older threads" and comparing them to the current ones, my only conlclusion is that the glut of simple rants, have overtaken the intrigueing threads.

It seems to have gone from "Anyone any clue as to what we are seeing here?" to "I'll prove that I am smarter"

A main reason the Staff has been scrutinizing several threads that devolved into peeing-contests. It started at the UFO-threads, and got really bad, and after the 2008 elections, it infected the "freedom" and "guns" threads, that devolved in no-time to threatening rants.

The tone has become.. "grim", aggressive even, here&there.

*shrugs* but hey, that's how it is. Life's Grim. There's no reason to think that fora and such will be exempt from the current trend into negativity.


Aaand.. the trolls have found this odd-ball corner of The Web too. Where in the beginning, it was all sorts of great stuff about UFO's, Old Civilizations, Odd archeology, strange stuff in general, it now is - apparently- mainly a ranting- platform for disenchanted libertarians, and people like that.

There still ís great stuff. It takes a bit more energy to find it. Not too bad, if one knows where to look.

One problem could be the rise of the internet availability on smartphones. People don't take the time to research anything and throw out a 'theory' about anything while on the train or something, and then get annoyed when more knowlegable (sp?) people who do research things shoot their pet theory down. The Sandy Hook threads are an example, where wild ideas based on joining dots that are have no relation in reality cause all sorts of peeing contests. I stay out of those!

I first came on ATS to find out if the moon-landings were real or if it was just the pics that were faked btw. My opinion, after time on ATS, is that they did go there but the pics were faked afterwards because the film got wiped!!

I have taken a hiatus from ATS for a few months, and have been trying to slowly reenter, and a few months ago I would have been the first person to say "You should or can contribute better threads" that should help.

WRONG!!

This is actually a double edged sword. If you write a thread that is interesting, and get a good convo going, thats great, but if you dont, and you worked your butt off, by thinking this would be better, than you are worse off then when you started.

The problem with certain members being frustrated with the newer topics (myself included) is that we are no longer learning. Many of us, want to learn, discuss, and excite. Now we are bombarded with the same mainstream news that we try so hard to avoid.

I personally dont know if I can be a full time member anymore, and honestly I think that ATS will not return to the way it used to be, and that might not be a bad thing, its just not for me.

So good luck to you, and btw, newer members, if you enter threads like this, and are wondering what the hell were talking about, use the search engine, and go back only a few years, and you will see what we mean.

Good luck NAM, and any one else that feels this way.

Peace, NRE.

reply to post by davidmann


Starred.

I know exactly what you mean, and I believe you may of hit the nail on the head for me. That's exactly what has happened to ATS. There have always been sheep on this site, sheep are everywhere, but the sheep-to-shepherd ratio use to tilt hard on the side of the shepherds on this site. I think the scales have finally fallen the other way. Too many people subscribing to the MSM, too many people pulling conspiracies out of thin air for the sake of sparking debate without a shred of viable evidence to back up their claims, too many uninspired OPs that are little more than a sentence or two and a link. More often than not the nonsense has me abandoning the thread , and moving on.

The worst are those that are shown evidence to disprove their theories, and they continue on with their mindless pursuit to find a conspiracy in everything, welcoming ignorance. I understand that this is a conspiracy website, but what many fail to realize is that not everything is a conspiracy.

The saddest thing is, I often times find myself stooping to their level. Something I need to remedy. Not all is lost however; amidst the morons, quips, and personal attacks, there are still many who are looking for truth; a handful still seeking to deny ignorance.

Originally posted by NoRegretsEver

Many of us, want to learn, discuss, and excite. Now we are bombarded with the same mainstream news that we try so hard to avoid.

I personally dont know if I can be a full time member anymore, and honestly I think that ATS will not return to the way it used to be, and that might not be a bad thing, its just not for me.

^^ This.

I have been prowling the confines of this site for quite sometime, rarely commenting because of a fear of being virtually accosted by the ''intellectuals''.

I have always been baffled by the intense amount of effort that some members evidently put into a well constructed OP to only be shot down by fellow members without actually using any valid information to back their opinions.

Then I come across members who all seem to have one thing in common, this inherit sense of wisdom and unbiased intentions in there behavior, all seekers of truth trying to unravel the lunacy that surrounds us on this journey of existence.

Strangely and ironically the truth seems to spark more conflict than resolution, maybe because the world has been based on lies or inaccuracies since recorded history. Lying is basically a psychological condition and because some find it easier to do than others does not disregard the fact that it is a common trait of our species. Being conditioned into a belief system and having that belief challenged will obviously cause a defensive retaliation seeing as all humans are sensitive creatures, reactions just vary due to personal and intellectual make up.

Although I am still young and have not been privileged to experience a formal education beyond your standard 15 years I find allot of '' role models'' on this site. When taking the time to sift through the average jargon being spilled I do come across individuals who seem to use their intellect for the sole purpose of educating and sharing constructive information for the further development of a collective consciousness or ''knowing''.

For those members and you know who you are, thank you and keep fighting for what you think is right. Before I continue my quest for knowledge I would like to leave you with a quote from a rebellious alternative band us youngsters, well at least my generation listen too. '' Stupid people do stupid things, smart people outsmart each other, then themselves .

In all honesty, I don't even remember what brought me to this site. It may have been John Titor, but I can't say for sure. I was reading before I joined, but I remember my reason for joining was that I wanted to see member avatars.

I remember that back in those days you could post as an anonymous coward. I liked that.

I remember I was also really into that movie They Live. I had a Roddy Piper avatar and it pretty much rocked.

As I've said, I can't really remember much about the old days but I do remember that it was different. Then again, I was also different.

I was both gullible and curious. And semi-ignorant.....eh.....maybe just plain ignorant. But it wasn't this site that erased that ignorance--it was time.

Now that I think about it, maybe I'm still ignorant. Maybe I've just flipped over to the other side, trying to balance that binary.

And maybe I only thought I was ignorant because I thought that I had learned something between then and now.

Maybe this site has changed.

Or maybe we have all changed.

Or maybe it is a little of both.

Now what was my point again?

Originally posted by Rising Against
We see these kinds of threads all the time. Instead of going into this in some detail myself, partly because it's very late here and partly because I feel as though couldn't possibly put it better myself, I think It's best to simply quote our site owner and what he has previously said on this kind of thing. I really do think it's something we all ought to read when we begin to feel a little bit helpless or tired of thing's here. It'll bring some enlightenment your way, that's for sure. It did for me anyway.

The progression of an ATS'er..

Originally posted by SkepticOverlord
I've responded to topics like this previously, and know I wrote something meaningful and eloquent, but can't find it now.

BACKGROUND: I've been running "bulletin boards" since there were such things, and the phenomenon of "forum fatigue" is real and happens everywhere... even in real life with clubs and groups. Before ATS I was part of the management team of the most-popular and most-successful forum group on CompuServe, the Computer Arts Forums (17 different forums at its peak). And before that, I helped run two successful dial-up BBS systems. I've seen what you're describing in all cases.

The chronology works something like this:

DISCOVERY: OMG! You (the rhetorical "you") discover this new venue full of people who think like you, and share many of your desires. In the case of ATS, the content is so deep and broad, there seems to be no way you can take it all in.

JOIN: YES! You join ATS and tentatively jump into the discussions, somewhat apprehensive because everyone seems so much more well-informed than you. Hopefully, your comments will be accepted.

ACTIVE: OMFG! After a brief period of getting used to the newness of ATS and getting to know a few members, you have confidence that you can contribute threads that will get some attention, and look forward to the responses you'll receive. You may even be thinking of your threads, or thinking of the replies you'll make, when you're offline doing other things.

HERO: YES! You've author a few threads that made it to the site home, and have reached a stage where you feel you have the respect of many members. Your comments now carry some gravitas.

SATURATED: LOL. Over time, you begin to see what you think are the same topics over and over, or, perhaps mildly rehashed versions of what "feels" like one of the same topics over and over. At first you're not aware of the saturated feeling, but you find yourself visiting fewer of the "aggregation" pages of ATS, looking for new and active threads -- you're just scanning the recent posts page thinking things like: 1) seen it, 2) know it, 3) hoax, 4) stupid, 5) WTF? -- and so on.

FATIGUE: FUUUUUUUUUUUU... The saturation has given way to fatigue as you no longer seem to find anything that holds your interest, or too many topics that feel like rehashes of rehashes of rehashed issue that have been done to death.

COMPLAIN: It seems a fair number of members who reach the fatigue point would rather complain about the perceived problem than do something meaningful about it: spend the effort to author new threads that exemplify their interests and push new ideas into the conversation mix. Not everyone is capable of that, and this is the primary reason you see "active long-term members" become inactive.


In reality, nothing has changed. I'm serious about this.

YOU have changed. You've absorbed everything you have the desire to absorb from ATS, and the inevitable happens, very little seems new or fresh any more. But to those just joining (like you in the discovery phase), EVERYTHING seems new and fresh.

www.abovetopsecret.com...

So, I feel as though, rather ironically, all I have to say here is something I never said at all because quite frankly, IT says and explains it all, at least in my opinion.

edit on 31-1-2013 by Rising Against because: (no reason given)

Thanks RA, that's the only time ever really appreciated anything SO had to say

reply to post by NewAgeMan

Yes NewAgeMan,

I hear you.

I read your OP and I agree with you, because I have noticed the same things.

But my way of dealing with the problem was different. I just decided to post a thought provoking thread.

Please tell me what you think of my thread. Am I part of the problem? Am I part of the solution? Please let me know, because I would like to hear your opinion. Here is my thread that I am talking about:

Why our World is a Prison Planet

Cheers
QMask

reply to post by NewAgeMan


That is the old phrases, a kind of, how to say that...

reply to post by NewAgeMan


Rants like these tend be from members that came excited by what they
might find, and have come to realize that there is no smoking gun. It's just a forum
and you get what you give!

reply to post by yadda333


This is what I'm talking about, a man who knows where it is at.