My Conclusion Of Ghosts.

reply to post by sled735


Perhaps what's tripping you up is when one person sees ghosts and the other doesn't. Like for example children seeing the ghost when nobody else does. Perhaps something psychic is going on right?

But that's not what we found. What do you do when the child can see the ghost, the camera can see the ghost, but the adult can't? Since cameras aren't psychic perhaps our explanation is wrong. So, what else can explain it?

What I can tell you from doing real ghost investigations is that paranormal investigators actually have evidence to explain these things where the third eye theory does not. First of all is children like to imagine things. Like imaginary friends for example. But beyond that.

The problem is most people see ghosts on the edge of wake/sleep. This means when everyone else is in bed. The reason the adult isn't seeing the ghost is because the adult isn't there. The adult is asleep. But the child will see a ghost after waking from a nightmare. Or maybe the ghost is really there, but they choose to visit children more than adults.

Another example is when the wife is seeing things, but the husband doesn't, or vice versa. From every case we ever did, this was caused by the ghost sighting happening when the other spouse was at work for example and simply not home. No third eye explanation needed.

Other cases where one person was experiencing things and nobody else was, or when every person was having different experiences was ALWAYS in EVERY case determined to be NOT ghosts. Things like very high EMF readings or carbon monoxide was found in the home except in two cases. The first being, where the child was running a high fever, and another where the teenager in the home was doing certain drugs that tends to cause hallucinations, but didn't want to tell mommy.

In other words they were hallucinating. After all, children are smaller. Things that may adults see things will be even worse for children. They'll be expected to hallucinate more.

In every single case where we determined there might be an actual haunting going on and not something else? Everyone experienced and saw pretty much the exact same things.

I believe that every person cycles between energy and solid. (simple explanation) During the periods of time when we are energy, we transcend our connection with linear time and we are able to communicate across the time barrier. We are not consciously aware of that communication so we continue to go about our business and that's why other things happen as well. When people "communicate" with those who are in the past I feel they are actually talking to someone that is still alive, just at a different point in time. This is why I call things that happen during an investigation a paranormal event. There are just too many other possibilities that exist to be able to come to a solid scientific conclusion that we are talking with an entity that has thought and form. As of yet, no real scientific equipment has been specifically built and designed to determine the real source of these events. Before someone mention's a ghost box, I'll just say that they are designed based on the idea that communication with dead people is possible but I feel that it doesn't truly advance the scientific investigation into these paranormal events.

They get their power from us. They can get their power from any living creature They can make us see, hear, and feal things that really don't exist. Ok, that's enough, I'm starting to scare myself

Originally posted by tinfoilman
reply to post by sled735

 

Do still cameras, video cameras, thermal cameras, and audio recorders also have their "third eye" open? If not, then how can we explain when ghosts show up on these devices?

Obviously it's not about your third eye. The ghost is just there. That's why they're picked up on electronic devices also.

I used to be into paranormal research ages ago. I've studied pretty much every class of haunting and heard just about every ghost story in multiple forms. So, here's what I'm bringing to the conversation.

There's many misconceptions that people make. One is that ghosts are a hallucination or a trick of the mind, or that only "special" people can see/hear them. This just isn't true.

I'm going to firmly agree with you that cameras are simply tools that measure light. What I bring to this conversation is that I have also delved into all sorts of paranormal topics myself, trying to make some sense of personal experience. I also used to teach photography for a couple of decades.

You asked how can we explain when they (ghosts) show up on these devices? They don't very often, if at all. I have looked at hundreds of paranormal still images. I'm a moderator on a paranormal site and we see tons. I have searched for examples of paranormal images that convince me, and have yet to find any that were convincing, with one exception. I did see a shot where there was a physical manifestation. The thing was able to physically manifest so it reflected light. This was a still image. It was not a human looking ghost, just a blob of dark, swirling energy. I challenge anyone to show me a photograph that isn't explainable by normal means that has a "ghost" in it. I'd love to see one. Never have.

As far as FLIR cameras go, they measure temperature and anomalous manifestations often are associated with physical, measurable temperature drops or raises in pockets with no explanation. A FLIR camera will record these temperature anomalies as shapes. It is a physical thing that this device is able to record.

There are light anomalies that can be recorded as moving, erratic balls of light. They glow. When you can't debunk them as bugs, they are pretty convincing...but they are NOT a human looking ghost. But they do show up on a video camera. They are also visible to the eye.

As far as the sighting of human looking ghosts, more often than not, some people will see them and others present cannot. This is more the norm. Mass sightings are pretty rare. From what I have come to understand it IS a third eye thing. In other words, some people are more sensitive and open to certain things, and are able to sense them where others cannot. They aren't "special." But they have different and more sensitive senses.

I live with a person like this. My husband is a pretty psychically open person. He sees and hears and senses things I can't. His theory is that this is kind of like a chink in his armor that allows these things in. Most people are sort of protected from interaction.

The physical manifestations (like doors slamming, objects moving by themselves, spontaneous fires, electronic devices turning off and on by themselves with no one touching them) are visible to all present. I have personally been witness to most of these things. I have never seen a ghost.

I like to say that experience is the greatest teacher. To the OP, if all your experience has been stories a babysitter told you to frighten you, then I'd invite you to delve a bit deeper. Just because one hasn't personally experienced something it doesn't mean that it isn't real.

I know quite a few people now (maybe 6 or 7) who see them on a regular basis. I know some who are mobbed by them because they are like beacons, apparently. These are not the fake mediums or psychics from the psychic hotlines. They are just regular people.

Often, this is a lifelong thing. But interestingly, in many cases it seems to have started after a near death experience with brain trauma. Sometimes this has been linked to right frontal lobe abnormalities on an EEG. These people see spirits often, if not every day. Others around them do not. One woman even moves objects (a psi wheel) with intent (telekinesis). She has been studied in 2 research labs, and has been able to replicate this in a controlled laboratory setting. She sees ghosts wherever she goes. She says they often seem surprised when they notice that she can see them. Mostly, she pretends she can't. It gets old. People with her do not see them, and it becomes just too much to keep having to point them out to those who simply do not see.

ghosts are not real or imagined...

they are just fleeting energies from another dimension... whisps of other realities



these energies (souls) might be other Universes counterparts to this physical Universes individuals,
after all...our 'soul' energy threads itself like a silver-cord to all of each persons other 'selves' in the multi-verse or at least the 10 dimensions that exist side-by-side but seperated by a 'veil'



We... might be anomalies, ghosts to those in these other dimensions... perhaps rarely seen just as their phantom presences are in this 'natural world' or maybe our projections are a real problem to their lives

Originally posted by JustSlowlyBackAway

As far as FLIR cameras go, they measure temperature and anomalous manifestations often are associated with physical, measurable temperature drops or raises in pockets with no explanation. A FLIR camera will record these temperature anomalies as shapes. It is a physical thing that this device is able to record.

I wanted to simply point out that FLIR (Foward Looking Infra-Red) cameras actually measure surface temperature and not ambient temperature and will see afterimages of people who have been in an area several hours earlier. The processing of the image is also adjusted manually at a factory, or calibrated so sometimes it can produce incorrect readings or small anomalies. This is not to say there is not some value as more expensive and sensitive FLIR cameras will pick up heat that is scattered by water vapor.

I also feel that people that are more "sensitive" are more likely to have a paranormal experience but I don't think anyone has figured out a way to design a piece of equipment that can act as a "third eye".

reply to post by JustSlowlyBackAway


Well first of all, I'm not saying psychics don't exist. We had one on the team. What I'm saying is that cameras actually do see ghosts by just picking up light and that's all that's needed. It's odd you haven't see that much video that convinces you.

When we recorded we get all kinds of things on video. Rarely but if you record enough you still get a lot of weird footage.

Another thing is like I said in my other posts. Yes mass sightings are rare. But we found out why they're rare. It's because 99% of hauntings happen when the person is alone. Or someone is looking the wrong way. What we actually found is that when you do actually have multiple witnesses they all see it.

But ghosts themselves show up rarely. Humans don't see them that often either. So don't make the bias mistake of thinking humans see ghosts more so they must see them differently. That's actually based on a false premise. Neither the camera nor humans sees ghosts that often.

What I found is that most people typically have on average 1 experience in their entire lifetime. You shouldn't compare normal people to the stuff we all know us ATSers have seen lol.

So, yes, while it's true that cameras rarely pick up ghosts, that's simply because it's just rare to see a ghost. Not because there's something special about the camera.

And I understand there are people that think they see ghosts all the time. But in our investigations those situations were always explained by other things like high EMF, infrasound, small carbon monoxide leaks, toxic chemicals not stored properly in the house, drug addiction, someone in the family is sick, and things like that. 99% of the time when the problem is removed those people stop seeing ghosts.

Now I understand that there are psychic people out there. But guess what? Psychics don't call you out for an investigation. Psychics are already used to seeing ghosts. By the time you get sent to investigate someone's house it's because the stupid house is doing something stupid virtually every time. The reason they're calling you is because they're NOT psychic and they're scared.

Many times, it's not a ghost at all! Like I said, the whole point of me raining on everyone's parade is to save lives. The last thing we need is people that don't know what they're doing not doing tests and instead telling parents that their little girl has super powers. When it very well could be a carbon monoxide leak that you didn't test for and everyone wakes up dead tomorrow.

Now I understand that's rare. It's usually just EMF readings, but it just takes that ONE TIME. So, if you want to tell someone their little girl has three eyes, fine. But do ALL THE OTHER TESTS FIRST! Make sure they're safe first.

And when I have done that? I've never gotten to the end of my list before finding something. I've never once had to tell the parents their little girl has three eyes.

I dont believe in God nor am i a religious person in any way but i do believe that there is an afterlife, that my pat relatives will be waiting for me when the end comes. This is mainly a comfort for me so im not scared when the end is close..

Ghosts i believe are real, they are of past people, but they are nothing to be scared of. If you do see one, welcome it, your fear will soon go away.

reply to post by akushla99


And how do you know this for a fact? What data do you have? I am hoping to learn something from this.

Thank you!

I was always told ghosts don't exist by all my relatives and parents, but when I was 14 years old, and a real obnoxious brat to most everyone, I started experiencing the paranormal for real..

I think it might have been a passed on relative doing it, but I was never sure.. One night I was pulled all the way off the bed with covers and blankets all sailing off the bed and it threw me against the wall..

But being the too smart brat that I was, I laughed at whoever, whatever it was and told it to do that again, because it was fun.. After that, things calmed down, as if I rained on someone's parade with those comments I made.

There was another time when I was 9 in a very old building that had old broken pianos where one started playing by itself very close to me... It stopped with some silence as I was frozen to the spot, and then it slammed the piano keys real hard and loud, which made me run out of there like a greased owl..

I knew that whatever that was intended to scare me real bad, and it was successful..

I'll be damned to hell if they don't exist! Or whatever they are, extra deminsional, spirits or what have you. My whole life has been has been full of countless almost once a week experiences by ALL of my family and even others that make me lean towards what I believe. I am a logical person, but what has happened to us overall completely changed our opinions. I even have a photo on a thread I created of an unknown man on Christmas day.
They are real my friend whatever they may be.

Originally posted by tinfoilman
reply to post by JustSlowlyBackAway

 

Well first of all, I'm not saying psychics don't exist. We had one on the team. What I'm saying is that cameras actually do see ghosts by just picking up light and that's all that's needed. It's odd you haven't see that much video that convinces you.

When we recorded we get all kinds of things on video. Rarely but if you record enough you still get a lot of weird footage.

Another thing is like I said in my other posts. Yes mass sightings are rare. But we found out why they're rare. It's because 99% of hauntings happen when the person is alone. Or someone is looking the wrong way. What we actually found is that when you do actually have multiple witnesses they all see it.

But ghosts themselves show up rarely. Humans don't see them that often either. So don't make the bias mistake of thinking humans see ghosts more so they must see them differently. That's actually based on a false premise. Neither the camera nor humans sees ghosts that often.

What I found is that most people typically have on average 1 experience in their entire lifetime. You shouldn't compare normal people to the stuff we all know us ATSers have seen lol.

So, yes, while it's true that cameras rarely pick up ghosts, that's simply because it's just rare to see a ghost. Not because there's something special about the camera.

And I understand there are people that think they see ghosts all the time. But in our investigations those situations were always explained by other things like high EMF, infrasound, small carbon monoxide leaks, toxic chemicals not stored properly in the house, drug addiction, someone in the family is sick, and things like that. 99% of the time when the problem is removed those people stop seeing ghosts.

Now I understand that there are psychic people out there. But guess what? Psychics don't call you out for an investigation. Psychics are already used to seeing ghosts. By the time you get sent to investigate someone's house it's because the stupid house is doing something stupid virtually every time. The reason they're calling you is because they're NOT psychic and they're scared.

Many times, it's not a ghost at all! Like I said, the whole point of me raining on everyone's parade is to save lives. The last thing we need is people that don't know what they're doing not doing tests and instead telling parents that their little girl has super powers. When it very well could be a carbon monoxide leak that you didn't test for and everyone wakes up dead tomorrow.

Now I understand that's rare. It's usually just EMF readings, but it just takes that ONE TIME. So, if you want to tell someone their little girl has three eyes, fine. But do ALL THE OTHER TESTS FIRST! Make sure they're safe first.

And when I have done that? I've never gotten to the end of my list before finding something. I've never once had to tell the parents their little girl has three eyes.

edit on 26-8-2012 by tinfoilman because: (no reason given)

edit on 26-8-2012 by tinfoilman because: (no reason given)

I have seen video that convinces me, as I wrote in my post.

I have never seen still pics that do, because I know how cameras work, and ghosts that are not visible to the human eye will not be visible to a camera's CCD. It's approximately the same range of light that a camera is capable of measuring. No magic ghost abilities imprinting their images somehow. Sorry. I'll never believe that one.

Average people do not see ghosts, or get to see one once in a lifetime. Agreed. My psychic friends who I've become acquainted with online see them often - sometimes daily. I'm not kidding. Interestingly, none of them have still pictures. One of them has many videos of the light anomalies which swarm around him, pretty much all the time. He is so bothered by them ganging up on him all the time, he has become interested in investigating - mostly to figure out how to handle the constant activity. Daily? Yes. His experiences started after a near death experience.

Ghosts are all around. I think because most of us cannot sense them, we begin to believe they are not real? Or rare?

Of course, the sane and rational approach is to try to debunk in every possible manner before leaping to a paranormal explanation. But I have to tell you that I seriously know of people who, just because it's rare for most, it doesn't mean it's at all rare for them. It's constant. You might think it's delusional. Or that they are lying. Or that they are not all there.

But I have seen peer reviewed papers written by researchers from accredited research facilities which collaborate some of the events associated with one of these folks. And they are legit.

I'd say ghosts are not rare at all. Strong psychics or mediums are.

reply to post by JustSlowlyBackAway


Well so far the science shows most psychics aren't psychic at all. They're just lying. I don't think they're all lying. But however much we'd like to believe that ghosts are all over, we may have to accept that's just not the case.

Paranormal people even admit this implicitly without realizing it. They do it by selecting an old abandon building or old cemetery to ghost hunt in. Because that's where the "ghosts" are right? But then they extrapolate from that, that ghosts are all over? That's not very fair.

If they're all over then why don't they just stay home and investigate? It shows deep down even they think that ghosts are not in fact all over. If they have to chill in a cemetery to catch the ghost, then what basis are they telling me that they believe ghosts are all over?

But like I said, in my experience, ghosts that are only seen by one person have always turned out to be something that wasn't a ghost. Psychics may be real, but it's foolish to think that every 3 year old that had a bad dream is psychic. That has never turned out to be the case in my experience.

Like I said, most psychics that see ghosts all the time, don't call for paranormal investigators. They're used to seeing ghosts all the time. They already know ghosts are there. Why would they need us?

You have to understand there's a sample bias. From an investigators point of view, you're dealing with people that aren't psychic and have never seen ghosts before. They're scared, and that's why they're calling you in the first place.

So due to that sample bias, somebody being psychic in the house is the least likely explanation. I know people would like to believe ghosts are all over, but from my experience, what it actually turns out to be is that hallucinations caused by chemicals, drug addiction, or whatever actually is what's common.

In most cases you're just chasing someone's hallucination. When you remove that thing that's causing the hallucination from the home the "ghost" has gone away in our experience.

When the ghost is actually real and manifesting, we found that everyone pretty much experiences the same thing, and at this point the camera also picks them up just fine. But see, like I said, by the time we get called it's gone beyond your normal ghost story.

But that's why paranormal investigation is pointless and I got out of it. Nobody gives a crap about evidence. You'd think they would, but they don't. They only care about backing up their own point of view and their psychic new age stuff. Just two examples I encountered.

Oh they had toxic chemicals stored under their bed with the lid off? Oh no, that couldn't be it! Our house must be haunted! Have you seen any ghosts since you moved the cleaning chemicals to the garage? No, but it must be haunted!

Oh your teenager is on meth and hasn't slept in seven days! That's why he's hallucinating!

Oh no no no, my boy must be psychic! That's why he's seeing ghosts! I know my son!. Okay, well, how many ghosts does he see after a good night sleep? Oh they only seem to appear after he hasn't slept for a week for some reason! But we know he's psychic!

It's like okay, fine, believe whatever you want people ya know.

Originally posted by ztruthseeker
So you die. You find out first hand that you exist now on some ethereal or spirit level. You have contact with the earth and the living. Instead of using this discovery and going to some scientists and saying "hey scientists, im a ghost. Do some studies and tests on me. Try to understand what this is all about". No, that doesnt happen. Instead Im going to go to some creepy old house, and open and close doors, tap on windows, rattle some chains, and move chairs around; all for the goal of scaring the crap out of some crazy old lady, who no one will believe anyways.

If ghosts exist, they are the biggest trolls ever.

Why would ghost care about what you believe anyway? They are dead, what would they have to gain by going to scientists telling them everything they know. Besides I believe there are laws in the spirit world, things you can and can't do.

reply to post by tinfoilman


Just a quick comment about children seeing spirits ...
While I agree little kids come with BIG imaginations, & yes they do tend to have "invisible friends" they are also innocent. Meaning they haven't had it drilled into their minds for years (like adults do) to "be logical" & search for the rational reasoning behind what they just saw or heard. They don't understand some people would lable them "crazy" for saying they were playing with a ghost, and they wouldn't care since when your little you can't even grasp e what crazy means. I have met a few kids who have blown adults away with what their imaginary friend told them ... shocking enough

I have never seen a ghost. I wish I could believe in them but I just can't right now. I'd like to. I'd love to think that spirits are around me and some of the friends I have lost in life and especially family members, my father who has passed just a year ago almost to the day. I still talk to the people I miss and I know that even though it makes me feel better, it is just that. They can't hear me because they are dead and gone and my words just are for myself in this life.

It is also obvious that I don't really believe an afterlife either, or a god. I feel my "eternal life" is one that will live on in my children and the people I have affected in life and I really don't expect to see anyone after I pass.

Now I do like to watch ghost stories on TV. Shows like "My Ghost Stories" and the like. Ghost Hunters had two pieces of "proof" that have me stumped. The St. Augustine Lighthouse "shadow" and something that appeared on video in a prison. But it still doesn't penetrate my skepticism. I guess, honestly, I watch those kind of shows as a way to exercise my skepticism.

I do know by personal experience that weird stuff happens. The mind is very powerful and can fool anyone. As a kid (toddler age) I vividly remember the flared end of a rubber faucet shower extension snaking onto my bed and going over my two fingers for a moment before snaking back again. I'm 47 now and that vivid memory still reverberates through the years to raise goose bumps up my arms. If I ever seen an apparition, that would be it. But I know that it was just a dream, albeit a very weird (and unnerving to me) one.

As far as psychics go I believe they are so rare. I mean, I have had good feelings and bad that steer me sometimes but if I really took any stock in them I'd try investing to be a millionaire, but I still listen to those feelings even though the success rate isn't the greatest. All I do know for certain is the mind, especially the subconscious, is very powerful in a subjective way.

I would like to believe in spirits. I just really don't at this point in life.

reply to post by tinfoilman


I know a guy who got tired of lugging his equipment out, and decided to invite them inot his house to chat on EVPs. Not sure if this was a good idea. But he now claims to see shadow people flitting around, and has some anomalous activity there.

I don't think ghosts are stacked like cordwood in every inch of space everywhere. But I'm going on what my friends who do see them say. They pretty much see them all over. Pass them on the road; see them in restaurants; in movie theaters, and sometimes in graveyards. Although, graveyards aren't usually the most haunted places. One person I know says in her local cemetery, she had noticed two. One, toward the edge of the cemetery - very faint, walking; and a second stronger woman spirit who appears from time to time to different people. One time she and her daughter went to another cemetery to take pictures for a project, and she said as they drove in, the car' filled up' with spirit energies. They got mobbed. She said they seemed gentle and curious. But, they got out of there fast. Her daughter in this case, saw them too. But nothing from the camera showed anything paranormal.

I'd be the first to agree that eliminating all physical and normal explanations comes first - always. But I think that the sensitive person will see according to the degree of sensitivity as well as the degree of haunting.

Recently i thought of a good reason why ghosts must not be real or able to exist. Think of all the things people do in privacy that would no longer be private. Why would they be granted the right to do this? I am going to say that they would not be granted this right for the simple fact that to do so infringes on the rights of the living. Could be special circumstances but to walk around freely like that is just not likely.

I've always been scared and paranoid of seeing ghosts. I hate being alone in the house at night and can't sleep. I'm 23 and I'm a big baby! Lol, although I've never seen one I am afraid and believe in them. I think some people are more sensitive to it. I don't understand what's the purpose of ghosts though...