True Patriots Are Christians

reply to post by suigeneris


A star for you my friend--I think you have your "Christianity philosophy" on straight---I think far too many Christians for some reason buy into an idea that one sin is greater than the other---let's say lying is a "better" sin than murder---when no sin is by it's nature any better than another sin. If we all had the same beliefs in that matter, I think the religion, and for that matter, the world, would be a much better place to live in.

reply to post by randomname


Ahhh, but a patriot may not stand for the same things as his government. That, in reality, would not make him a patriot.

A patriot for most of the US (I suspect) is someone who supports what is right. Not what his government dictates.

Originally posted by randomname
a patriot can't be a Christian, because you can't serve God and the united states both. they're in conflict.

Render unto Caesar's what is Caesar's, and render unto God what is God's...

reply to post by hotbakedtater


I fail to see how religion has anything at all to do with patriotism.
There are plenty of atheists in the military putting their asses on the line every day out there, and to tell them they are not true patriots is downright disgusting.

reply to post by hotbakedtater


A true Patriot is anyone who accepts ALL religions and not just one mythological creation such as the Christian God.

Christians, such as Palin aren't Patriots. They opposed the Mosque "near" Ground Zero. I think that right there shows how intolerant they are.

reply to post by zroth

I like your comparison. You read Philip K. Dick? One of his quotes that re-occurs in many of his works is "The Empire Never Ended." He also had bizarro flashbacks to another life as a Gnostic Christian in the 2nd century AD.

reply to post by SeventhSeal


I agree with you wholeheartedly. Even the Constitution would never see such a thing done. Banning a religion of any kind is beyond me.

I feel for you and the Islamic community. We are not at odds with each other. The MSM and our idiotic leaders like to pretend there is a problem to prove there are "Christian" extremists. It is made up. Christians live like Christ and have love for everyone. If they are doing it right.

reply to post by suigeneris


You hit the mark there. The only "differences" between Christianity and Islam (or what drives the conflict) is the constant bantering from leaders on both sides about how bad one religion is compared to the other. If people stop buying into this, of course, the leaders wouldn't have a spectre of a stupid holy war to hang over our heads, and we'd stop funding the military industrial complex.

a patriot has nothing to do with religion, its a belief and love in ones country.
and when it really meant something, true patriots would shed their blood for it

now it is meaningless, because gubment cheese ruined it for everyone

If true patriots are Christians, that would make this a religious war.
But I thought it wasn't about religion..It was about extremists.
Or was it oil..Or yellow cakes.
Or was it revenge for Big Bush being targeted by Saddam..Little Bush going all Hatfield and McCoy on him.

reply to post by spacedoubt


"hits the nail on the head"

which one?

eeny, meeny, miney, moe

Has anyone bothered to read the thread from which this one sprung?
Here is a link. Link to thread that started this.

I personally think that all responders should read this.
Much of this has been taken out of context, imo.

From Hotbakertater O.P.

Here we go, yet another example of a religious group, UNsurprisingly the Christians, DEMANDING to be catered to. The city is under NO obligation to these people

Mamabeth response:

Since, I don't believe Jesus/Yeshua was born on december 25th., I don't have a problem with this.Unfortunately,a lot of christians do celebrate Jesus/Yeshua's birthday on that pagan date.

Hotbakedtater, a while later:

A true patriot would protest the display of ANY and ALL religious displays in their government buildings.

Mambeth full response:

I disagree with you ,I think that true patriots would be basically christians.

Hotbakedtater response:

Do patriots wipe their behinds with the constitution?
Because forcing your religion into government is the most ANTI patriotic thing I can think of!
MamaBeth you inspired a new thread with this stance. www.abovetopsecret.com...

My personal opinion?
Shame on you Tater.
All respect is lost.
Period.

Everything isn't so black and white, not all Christians are patriots, and not all patriots are Christians, not everyone agrees on what is a Christian or a Patriot either.

I am a Christian who considers myself patriotic, but happen to be at odds and disagree with many who consider themselves the same.

There are many Christians who believe supporting all our wars of aggression is Patriotism because it removes threats from Israel, they believe in what I consider a heresy and is unchristian theology, that our foreign policy must do everything possible to ensure Israel is able to expand unhindered in order to bring about end times and Jesus second coming. It won't happen anyway, and is ridiculous nonsense, but even if it were possible, this is a very selfish and unjust theology anyway, because they are the only ones who would be saved, everyone else including most Jews who don't convert would be wiped out in such a scenario. Christians are supposed to want to reach out and save people,not threaten them with apocalypse.

This version of Christianity just so happens to make misguided Christians vote in favor of globalist NWO politicians like Bush and other neocons, and seems to have been funded since the beginning by these forces. I think this is the apostate Church we were warned about in the Bible and what gives Christians a bad name.

This is a good description of how Christian Zionism was started basically as a scam to benefit Israel, and why I consider opposing it and neoconservatism true patriotism and true Christianity.

When Israel captured Jerusalem and the West Bank (not to mention Gaza, Sinai and the Golan Heights) in the June 1967 Arab-Israeli war, conservative Christians sensed that history had entered the latter days. L. Nelson Bell, the father-in-law of evangelist Billy Graham and editor of the influential journal Christianity Today, wrote in July 1967: “That for the first time in more than 2,000 years Jerusalem is now in the hands of the Jews gives the students of the Bible a thrill and a renewed faith in the accuracy and validity of the Bible.”

following the 1967 war, Israel gained an increased share of US foreign and military budgets, becoming the “western pillar” of the US strategic alliance against a Soviet incursion into the Middle East, particularly after the revolution in Iran took the country out of the US orbit. It is during this period that AIPAC and other pro-Israel organizations started shaping US foreign policy.

Fourth, the Roman Catholic Church and mainstream Protestant denominations began to develop a more balanced approach to the Middle East, bringing them closer to the international consensus on the Palestine question. Pro-Israel organizations interpreted this shift as being anti-Israeli and, in turn, began to court conservative Christians. Marc Tannenbaum of the American Jewish Committee captured this sentiment well when he told the Washington Post: “The evangelical community is the largest and fastest-growing bloc of pro-Jewish sentiment in this country.”

A surprising development, and arguably the lynchpin in forging the fundamentalist Christian-Zionist alliance, occurred in March 1977, when Carter inserted the clause “Palestinians deserve a right to their homeland” into a policy address. Immediately, the pro-Israel lobby and the Christian right responded with full-page ads in major US newspapers. Their text stated: “The time has come for evangelical Christians to affirm their belief in biblical prophecy and Israel’s divine right to the land.” The text concluded with a line that took direct aim at Carter’s statement: “We affirm as evangelicals our belief in the promised land to the Jewish people … We would view with grave concern any effort to carve out of the Jewish homeland another nation or political entity.”

www.informationclearinghouse.info...

reply to post by hotbakedtater


A true patriot is a person that stands to fight for the freedom of all mankind regardless of religion, opinions, way of life etc. A true patriot would protect the freedom of men and woman to be anything they want as long as no harm is done to others. Believing in a certain god doesn't hurt anyone.

reply to post by hotbakedtater


I'm a Christian and I'm gonna have to agree with you. People like Penn Jillette (athiest in case you don't know who he is) are out there fighting for our freedoms every day. God bless him
A patriot stands up for his/her country and the ideals it was founded on. Sure, the U.S. was founded mostly by Christians, but it was also founded by a sizeable number of Deists who were arguably proto-athiests in a time before Darwin. The meaning of the statement "endowed by their creator with certain unalienable rights" is not that you must believe in the Christian God to have rights (they don't specify what god) but that your rights come from a force greater than man. You can believe that your rights are established by YHWH, Allah, the Force, or simply nature, the importance is that it does not come from man, so man has no right to take these rights away.

Can athiests be patriots? Yes. Can Christians? Yup. Muslims? indubidably.
Can liberals be patriots? No

reply to post by spacedoubt

Gee, I wonder where your political affiliations lie?
Bush is the past, get over it.

Obama, however, is the present and the future.

Obama then:

"Let me say this as plainly as I can: by Aug. 31, 2010, our combat mission in Iraq will end."

and Obama present:

a "senior administration official" acknowledged that the 50,000 U.S. troops remaining in Iraq beyond the deadline will have the same combat capabilities as the combat brigades that have been withdrawn.

My predicted Obama future, late October, early November 2012:

We are currently drawing up plans to withdraw the remaining 50,000 troops soon, very soon, if you'll only elect me for another term.
My opponent has no plans drawn up to reduce that number anytime soon, and he........

Edit to add: In early 2009, we had roughly 3000 private, armed security forces in Iraq. By Mid 2010, we had between 25000-30,000 armed, private security forces in Iraq.
Quit living in the past, we've all been duped, right, left, or other.

reply to post by Oaktree


You have my permission to wonder out loud about where my affiliations lie.

BTW the past of which you speak, is the reason we are in this present and future "thing that wouldn't die"

As a practitioner of ancient religion of Asatru and former Infantry Marine (as well as a fellow Kentuckian, OP) I feel I can firmly call shenanigans on this proposition. My whole life has been engineered to be used as a weapon against usurpers of personal and individual freedom. As far as fighting a corrupt governments corrupt wars, well, we wouldn't know that they were all corrupt if it weren't for the tell tale signs from our men and women in uniform, who would honestly have loved to be able to say they were fighting for freedom, patriotism, all that, but instead have a ridiculous rate of offing themselves post deployment? As for me, I honor the One-Eyed God, Allfather Odin, very much a warrior deity. Which in turn developed me into a warrior. There was a war going on, so.... I went. Did as much good as I could and NEVER raised my weapon in anger against an innocent. I even stopped other marines from waxing innocent people on more than one occasion, so yes, i'll admit it occasionally happened that innocents were lost, but Odin willing not on my watch. It was something that always bothered me. Oh, and I took the time to learn Arabic so i could actually communicate and try to understand and help the local nationals the best that i could. Was up for all kinds of medals and everything for all my hard work in Iraq. Until the chain of command learned my dirty secret.... "Ohhhhh, so that's why they call him Pagan Fury... we thought it had something to do with the biker gang.... well I guess we'd better drop the hammer on this heathen as soon as we get the chance eh?"

But I'm still a patriot. I just wear a different uniform now. Hail Odin.

reply to post by hotbakedtater


Religion, Patriotism and Ignorance and Trifecta of qualities essential to control the masses .. Powerful people do not care for flags, the do not worship gods and yet they have all the marbles. Worthwhile contemplating that.

reply to post by hotbakedtater


would be nice to provide some circumstances or situations.
Which country are we talking about?
When are we talking about?
From who's perspective are we talking about?