N. Korea Crisis - Updated as News come to hand

reply to post by fooks


Nobody can just up and get North Korea. It would be a very long messy struggle.

If China and the USA and S. Korea all teamed up then it would be possible, but it would still be a very protracted battle.

I think China prefers to leave North Korea alone. After all, this is what North Korea wants more than anything else. By risking battle with N. Korea China would be opening a can of worms that I think they'd rather avoid.

They are still technically allies, but they aren't joined at the hip like they were in the 1940s and 1950s.

reply to post by HattoriHanzou


are you out of your mind?

china will have to kill nk themselves.

or we are all in the #shiuse.

they are crazy fkrs, killing tourists! wtf?

1/2 of them have family in sk!

Originally posted by Kojack
OH GOD, ITS STARTING!!!!

FINALLY!!!!

Nothing is starting and your attitude is worrying, it's like you actually want conflict.

reply to post by oozyism


Forces from Afghanistan and Iraq don't have to go anywhere. The ESGs and CSGs don't need to leave the Arabian Sea either. Besides if they can strike in Afghanistan from where they are, they can strike China if they need to from there as well. People forget China is right next to Afghanistan and even shares border.

There are 40,000 US troops in Japan and almost as many in South Korea. Thats almost 100,000 US troops ready to go. The South Koreans and Japan both have substantial militaries, especially Japan's navy which is comparable to Britain's or France in terms of power.

Don't forget the US Carrier Strike Groups and Expeditionary Strike Groups. We have 10 CSGs and 12 ESGs.

The Nimitz, Carl Vinson, George Washington, and Ronald Reagan are all available. They are all in the Pacific region.

reply to post by fooks


I don't really understand what you are trying to say here.

Wasn't the Korean War brother vs. brother? Wasn't it like that in the US Civil War?

North Korea is a buffer state as has been stated repeatedly. China will not attack them except in a pipe dream world.

You can write off North Korea as "crazy" but a nation filled with crazy people does not manage to keep America at bay for over half a century. Maybe you can read about Madeline Albright's experiences with Kim Jong Il if you want to write him off as crazy.

Short story: She was told by chickenhawks and people who had not studied the situation that he is crazy. She was told by people who had dealings with him that he is not crazy. Turns out he is not crazy, just different.

I suppose it's easier to just write off everybody that can not be easily understood as crazy, but it is not that simple in the real world.

Originally posted by HattoriHanzou
reply to post by fooks

 

Nobody can just up and get North Korea. It would be a very long messy struggle.

If China and the USA and S. Korea all teamed up then it would be possible, but it would still be a very protracted battle.

I think China prefers to leave North Korea alone. After all, this is what North Korea wants more than anything else. By risking battle with N. Korea China would be opening a can of worms that I think they'd rather avoid.

They are still technically allies, but they aren't joined at the hip like they were in the 1940s and 1950s.

wrong, china is the only ally nk has.

food, etc, comes from them. they would be hit hard and fast.

and china knows that. russia doesn't want a nuclear whackjob on the border, neither does sk!

japan, or tiewan!

bejing has to deal with this.

News:

SEOUL, Nov. 23 (Yonhap) -- President Lee Myung-bak ordered his military Tuesday to strike North Korea's missile base around its coastline artillery positions if it shows signs of additional provocation, his spokeswoman said.

In a video conference with Gen. Han Min-koo, chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff, the president ordered "multiple-fold retaliation" against the North for its artillery attack on a South Korean island, according to presidential spokeswoman Kim Hee-jung.

S. Korea may strike N. Korea's missile base: President

More news:

ALERT: South Korea admits it was conducting test-fires before North Korea artillery attack, but says it did not fire north - Reuters

twitter.com...

More more news (hell watch a screenshot):



ALERT:

Vladimir Putin seen storming North Korean mainland alone and unarmed, North Korean forces presumed completely destroyed, Kim Jong-Un prepares document of surrender.

maybe Bill went again in Pyongyang

but now secret visit

reply to post by Prince Of Darkness


lol, nice one~

reply to post by MikeboydUS


Nobody's striking China.

Carriers don't mean # anymore either, against an adversary that has submarines. In case you didn't hear, just a few weeks ago a Chinese sub popped up right in the middle of one of our carrier groups. It was the second time they managed to get inside past the escorts in the recent past.

You can bet your butt that any one of those relics of WWII that gets within 4000 miles of China is being shadowed and will be destroyed if hostilities commence.

Not to mention, if we invade China they will likely just pop us with some nukes from some of their ballistic missile subs.

China and the USA will not be engaging in any wars directly. If anything happens it will be in proxy areas, and there will be a strict "no nukes allowed" rule.

Update 13:03 GMT:

1258: Australia's Foreign Minister Kevin Rudd says: "I'm confident that President Lee Myung-bak will handle this appropriately. I'm less confident that the North Koreans are capable of handling these things competently. But we in Australia will stand in support of [South Korea's] response to this provocative act."




1253: ole999 emails from Russia: "North Korea is trying to distract its citizens from other issues. There is no smoke without a fire. I really hope this won't have any grave consequences."

1251: The United Nations Security Council could hold an emergency meeting in the next day or two to discuss the attack, a French diplomatic source is quoted by Reuters as saying.

1242: Robert Kelly of Pusan National University in South Korea tells BBC World Service he believes Pyongyang may have felt affronted by South Korea's high-profile recent staging of the G20 summit. North Korea does not like being made to feel like "the younger child" on the international stage... South Korea is extremely vulnerable - 50% of the population live within 50 miles of the demilitarised zone, and so retaliation by South Korea is very risky.


1238: The BBC's Steve Kingstone in Washington says US President Barack Obama was woken up just before 4am with the news. There is concern here about the situation. The Americans are pointing their finger firmly at North Korea. President Obama is expected to speak to South Korea's president shortly.

Ooozy Ooozy Oozy OI OI OI lol

Originally posted by oozyism

I still don't think you get it.

Chinese, and N-Korea military is heavily concentrated.

War is strategy based, you need to read some books, and expand your mind, take in to consideration details etc etc.

You have much to learn

And You, again, don't get it.

South Korea is China's 4th largest trading partner, AND South Korean corporations are huge employers in China.
Conversely, North Korea is China's largest supplier of refugees, and one of the largest recipients of foreign aid.

Let that sink in, and compare/contrast it with the apocalyptic nonsense you've been polluting this thread with.

Of all the nations in the world that stand to LOSE from South Korea being attacked, CHINA is at the top - to the tune of $190,000,000,000 a year in trade alone. Adding in foreign investment and local employment and the single-year total would be significantly higher.

War is about strategy, see. And one of the biggest parts of that strategy is not getting involved in stupid fights that will decimate your economy. Get it yet?

reply to post by Clisen33


Coward, I'd risk my life to defend S. Korea. You know why? Because they value the same principles as us, same with the Japanese. You don't befriend someone and stab them in the back when they need your help. I'm sure they would come to our aid if we were attacked. What makes you think N. Korea won't stop at S. Korea and Japan.


Standing applause to you! Well said and good to see a man with heart and honour! x

reply to post by fooks


China will not "deal with" North Korea. They will just let North Korea continue doing whatever they like.

I was just stating for illustrative purposes, what it would take to defeat North Korea in any meaningful way. There is no purpose in actually considering it as a real possibility.

The orders still stand...
"I'm a soldier in the South Korean Army. I live in Seoul, but my military camp is located on the frontline with North Korea. I have to go back to my camp tomorrow so I am quite worried and anxious about this crisis. South Korean people are very angry.

South Koreans troops will still be called up and deployed tomorrow morning... this might raise tensions too high.

Originally posted by HattoriHanzou
reply to post by MikeboydUS

 

All that would do is kill a bunch of senior citizens and peasants. The military would turtle underground.

We would have to use bunker busters, and even then it would not be a foregone conclusion that we would get anything useful. They have been preparing to be nuked for half a century, you know, and the reason the peasants (ie the non-military citizens of North Korea) are starving and have no electricity is because all resources are bent on tunneling, creating underground factories and power plants, and stockpiling resources.

We'd basically have to cut into thousands of different facilities and manually inspect them in order to ascertain whether or not "we got 'em." This would be difficult to impossible, at least without conscription. Even then it'd be really, really hairy.

I agree carpet bombing would primarily only kill civilians. I'm just being realistic about how we would retaliate against DPRK if they hit the south or Japan with a nuclear weapon.

The underground facilities still need fresh air and water, plus waste disposed of. No one has ever perfected a system that makes separate biosphere. The Soviets tried and never got it. That presents a weakness that can be exploited. Instead of getting them out, its more likely we would seal them in. Their bunkers would become their tombs.

Originally posted by HattoriHanzou
reply to post by MikeboydUS

 

Nobody's striking China.

Carriers don't mean # anymore either, against an adversary that has submarines. In case you didn't hear, just a few weeks ago a Chinese sub popped up right in the middle of one of our carrier groups. It was the second time they managed to get inside past the escorts in the recent past.

You can bet your butt that any one of those relics of WWII that gets within 4000 miles of China is being shadowed and will be destroyed if hostilities commence.

Not to mention, if we invade China they will likely just pop us with some nukes from some of their ballistic missile subs.

China and the USA will not be engaging in any wars directly. If anything happens it will be in proxy areas, and there will be a strict "no nukes allowed" rule.

no dude someone quoted that story from 2007. aircraft carriers can play a very large role in any military campaign even with submarines present. i dont understand why everything has to be solved with nukes first hand lol

Originally posted by Misterlondon
reply to post by luchini33334

 

The reason it's not big news is because it is not big news, these guys are at each others throats all the time..
No way would the un and most civilised nations on earth allow this to happen.. There is far to much to lose, for everyone concerned..

It certainly is big news simply because this is the biggest provocation NK has made since the end of the Korean war.

Lets not forget what they have done here. They have deliberately and systematically attacked an island under the control of SK.
There is no denying that that have done this. Unlike their sinking of the SK ship previously.

If this is simply more posturing by NK, they have taken a very big risk. They've chosen a large target, visible by the rest of the world.
They risked an immediate and complete attack on their own military by striking this island.

IMO, it doesn't make sense to risk an attack on your country by making such a move unless you are prepared for an ongoing and escalating conflict. That is why I think this is more than just posturing.

It's up to the South now. If they do retaliate with considerable force it will start another war. If they don't NK might just carry on attacking, for whatever justification.

Personally, I think NK is in turmoil within. This was a stupid move that no sensible government would make (even the usual NK!)
That leads me to wonder just who is in control and making such stupid decisions.

reply to post by Stormflower007



That's an excellent attitude for a soldier. Perfectly commendable and something to hold in your heart if indeed you are ever made to die for South Korea or Japan.

Truth is, we are only involved in either of those nations for strategic purposes, and that is the only reason we have ever been involved there. The friendship is necessary to have a genuine relationship, but it is not the goal of the relationship. The goal is hegemony and strategic position.

North Korea is a test poligon for NWO almost 50 years ...their leader is controled by elite
these actions and moves are from elite