To China and the world - We do NOT apologize

reply to post by MRuss


Um go reread my post (and why not the one on page 8 of this why'll your at it) that wasnt my point at all, I'm saying the world doesnt care about us Americans they blame our governments evil deeds on us as if it benefits us in some way

reply to post by Chinesis


I don't STFU and sweep the dirt under the rug, my friend. I speak out in places like ATS. I write. I think. I actually BE THE CHANGE I WANT TO SEE.

But I'll do it in the safety of the United States, thank you very much.

My daughters have made it to college! They weren't thrown in a trash barrel like 15 MILLION infant baby girls.
15 MILLION!

And I'll pray today here in the safety of my own home without fear of imprisonment.

I'll try to change the way the world works, yes, but with running water, electricity and fairly clean air.

And I'm sorry..but anything "beautiful" in China is cancelled out--at least to me--by the harshness of their Government. By the atrocities that are committed there on a daily basis.

reply to post by Misoir


Exactly, China can kiss our arses. We will even bend over for them to show them our respect before we drop our drawers!

reply to post by FrancoUn-American

You are completely right about that.

Our government is deplorable.

But we can work to change that together.

In the relative safety of our own homes. In a country that DOES have some kind of human rights record.

The fact that you are even on ATS says something important about our country.

Originally posted by MRuss
Dear China,

I think you owe the entire world an apology.

Apologize to the 15 MILLION baby girls that disappeared when they were born. Explain this holocaust of infant baby girls. Explain why brutal neglect is the common theme in your orphanages.

Apologize to the 1,207,387 Tibetans who were killed, tortured and imprisoned. And while you're apologizing, admit that their peaceful religion frightened you.

Apologize to the world for Tiananman Square as we watched your tanks crush innocent civilians. On the day of the crackdown, Chinese Red Cross sources told reporters that 2,600 people died and 10,000 were injured, although the organization later denied it. What's the truth China?

Apologize to the hundreds of thousands of women who were forced to be sterilized. And admit that the numbers are probably in the millions.

Apologize to the world that is struggling to come to terms with human rights---how you have so blatantly taken us a step backwards. That the human life holds no value to you.

People are merely your pawns.

You owe the world an apology.

But even that wouldn't be enough.

Again, you are mixing truth with outright complete lies. Here is an example tibet before Chinese rule was a horrible place. The people were slaves and starving, and ruled by warlords. I suggest you do some research before you believ the make-believe. Also, if you are going to say all this, why not say all the terrible things America has done, or doesn't that count because America is great!

Lets talk about Iraq, The illeagal invasion that has killed thousands of inoccent iraq people, not including the American soldiers who lost their lives all for the greed of oil. I could go on and on, but i think its pointless.

See, this is the difefrence between you and me. I have been to China, i can prove it, can you? Also, i see the bad and good in all nations. China is not perfect, and has done terrible things. America is not perfect, and has done terrible things.

Originally posted by LadySkadi
Well, well - it didn't take long for posters to attempt to change the topic and focus to the US, now did it?
Typical.... Just once I'd love to see an attempt made to focus on the points of the opening post (geez, at least in the first few pages of a thread) before getting to the games so many love to play.

the point is the OP is slating china so much hes forgetting how bad america is...he even says his country loves liberty? i beg to differ...im almost sure the leaders of the country would love to take away freedom and liberty...partly why we are all on this site.

the OP is basically being hipocrytical...and the post he talks about that apologises is right to do so...a member of the public apologising for the outrageous behaviour of its its government is a bold thing to do...there comes a time when you need to stop and say no to your government...he did it....you should to...so should the OP...both of you are the ones who blindly follow our crazy leaders

Originally posted by Misoir
We have made mistakes in our path such as torture, suppression of equal rights, placed ethnic groups in camps, and torture terrorists.

edit on 11/17/2010 by Misoir because: (no reason given)

Unbelieveable...... Are you for real! And 79 flags.. Cop on to yourself man you reckon these are mere mistakes. Just little blips on the path to greatness. You support a goverment of warmungers who produce wepons of mass destruction.. Pay millions of your hard earned tax to produce wepons and tools of death. While your country crumbles down around you. Your towns plagued with Desese and addiction. Your leaders currupt with welth and greed.. Wake up and smell the coffie

I'm going to post this reply in both rival threads.

Emotions are running high on both sides of the topic.

NO!

Nobody has the right to apologize for me for my actions, thinking and beliefs. suffice it to say if someone is going to write a thread and just slam the US for it's deeds without a proper rebuttal then so be it. Recognize it for what it is a US SLAM-FEST. Meanwhile a proper thread would not have posted scenarios out of context.

YES!

I too see things the US has done wrong that needs to be addressed. This however doesn't mean that we are the only ones nor does it mean that Americans are ignoring the truths.


These threads have deteriorated into a giant game of


HE SAID, SHE SAID. WHO STRUCK PAUL?

reply to post by Misoir


Madness! -

You can't be serious with this post?... Or has the amerikan education system really done you that well? /chuckle

This is all so simple -
1 - Show me a perfect government?

Since that is not possible, lets look for a moment at a few things a government (and its citizens on whole) could do to move towards that perfect government everyone would like to see..

1 - Understand mistakes happen, people are not perfect and sometimes bad stuff happens. Understanding is the first item that needs to be looked at.. Now if the mistake or issue was on purpose, that also needs to be addressed, but everything must start with that original understanding..

2 - Acknowledge the mistakes or issues. Make other governments and other people aware one is acknowledging the mistakes that have happened.. With Acknowledgment comes the "Am Sorry" statement, and grievances can be/are addressed. Man up to not being perfect, no one is except in amerikan public education and TV.

3 - Learn, and prevent - don't keep making the same mistake.

Ok, so I've dumb-ed this down tremendously.. Am hoping that you are able to follow it through to the end.

The strongest people, also acknowledge their mistakes, and when you really separate the wanna-be's from those that are the real thing.. One will see statements of Am Sorry, along with the other 3 items I've listed above.

Its called being human and using that gift we have all been given called Compassion..

Lastly - You do not speak for me, you do not represent me, and I would never allow you to do such.. That being said, your entire post is nothing more then 8th grade playground drama.

Enjoy the marry-go-round while you are there.

/Lunchman

Originally posted by MRuss
I don't STFU and sweep the dirt under the rug, my friend. I speak out in places like ATS. I write. I think. I actually BE THE CHANGE I WANT TO SEE.

Your emotions have taken over your ability to comprehend what I said.
OUR Gov't does this routinely-in the name of "National Security." (Which is BS)

Guess what? Your voice isn't heard.
It's just complain-mongering...nothing more will ever come of your voice other than for your
own perception that it made a difference (when it comes to the U.S. Gov't)

Originally posted by MRussMy daughters have made it to college! They weren't thrown in a trash barrel like 15 MILLION infant baby girls.

Question for you...
If one of your children had developed autism...
Does this mean you are better than the Chinese because of your
irrelevant comparisons between nations? The fact the Chinese are (to you) horrible
doesn't change the fact your daughter would have autism, would it?

Originally posted by MRussAnd I'm sorry..but anything "beautiful" in China is cancelled out--at least to me--by the harshness of their Government. By the atrocities that are committed there on a daily basis.

edit on 18-11-2010 by MRuss because: wrong word

So, your ignorance is further perpetuated by your willingness to turn a blind eye
to the Atrocities the U.S. has committed, yet you still find America "a great place to live"
despite these horrible actions? So because China is (perceived by YOU) to be
an unsuitable place to live, this must mean it ISN'T because they treat their people
worse than the U.S. treats it people? It's a contest to you? A measurement
of National Superiority?

Do you see you're sitting next to hypocrisy?

reply to post by Jay-morris


Mr. Morriss,

I don't fear America's downward slide.

The greed, the deplorable government, the consumerism and materialism.....we had it coming. I certainly don't wish the repercussions on the good people of this country, but maybe it will cause us to take a hard look at ourselves and re-evaluate our direction.

But fear? No. Sadness? Maybe.

The claims I make about China are true. Very sad but very true.

Everything I've said is easily checked from good sources and reputable news outlets. Go look for yourself.

I'm sure your wife is a lovely person. It is not her that I blame.

But, certainly, each and every citizen in the world is somehow complicit in the affairs of their country. There is saying that goes something like this: "for the forces of evil to succeed is for enough good men to remain silent" In other words, remaining silent and not being willing to step up for human rights and goodness is just as evil as the acts that are committed. Wasn't Hitler's Germany proof of that?

A world that does not respect human rights is a world never to succeed, to grow, to become enlightened.

China's human rights violations are well-know and obvious and a concern for people who care about such things.

It is by speaking out---and telling China that this is unacceptable--that things may one day change.

reply to post by Chinesis


Thanks again,

By the way the Bund is nice and the beers were ice cold. Also burbon street and shanghia sally's was pretty amazing too..

Thanks again,

Mr. Black

What to say about China. Everything is going to collapse sooner or later.

dave,

reply to post by Chinesis


Oh, boy.

I really didn;t want to respond to this, because your arguments don't make a lot of sense to me, but here it goes:

I am not saying that America is perfect. I said our government is deplorable. I do believe the people of the United States are generally good people, though. That is said often by people of the world. The average American is a hard working, honest and good human being, willing to help their neighbors.

I also said that we can't sit around and complain about our corrupt and horrible government without being willing to stand up and fight the atrocities. I think I do that. With my vote. With my words. With the way I am raising my children. And by becoming educated and informed and making my voice count.

But I'd much rather contribute to this work living in the United States.

Do you want to live in China?

I certainly don't.

Simple human rights don't exist there.

I'd much rather find a way to exploit the United States government, the NWO, etc, and create change through the PEOPLE------. We have so much power and we don't use it.

I'd love to create a country where so many of the atrocoties do not exist anymore.

But no, I don't want to leave.

I want to fight to make it better.

reply to post by MRuss


Hello Russ,

Though I agree with 90% of your statement. I dis agree labeling chinese as bad and evil. People are only evil as their dictators dirct them. Going to some of the most rural areas of the Chinese people are very friendly, caring and curious.


Care full how we label as we don't like being lump in with everyone.

Proud Hardcore AMERICAN.

Live Free or Die.

That where is live. Anyone know the state.

reply to post by MRuss


Yes, and i am saying that America is just as bad, in their own way. Instead of killing their own people, they have killed thousands of people outside the USA, and that is bad. What p*sses me off is all these people saying that China is this and that, when America is terrible too. Oh, and by the way, my wife came from the country side. Her family lived near the borders of Russia and North Korea. In fact, i am quite proad that i have been somewhere where no other uk person has been, or American for that matter. My wifes uncle was high up in the army and he took me to the boarders and up a tower where the Chinese watch. It was quite weird being somewhere not many western people, if any, have been in a long time. Anyways, enough of that.

My wifes family were poor. Her dad worked in the mines, but had to retire because of a bad back. Anyways, they still had a good life. Always food on the table and a roof over their heads. That changed when my wifes brother made it big in China owning his own tv company. My wife has never come across the stuff you are saying. Im not saying it does not happen, but there is alot of "over the top" talk in here.

It does frustrate my wife, and i tend not to show her this sort of stuff. It frustrates her because while she knows China is not perfect, she can read this thread and see the lies too, and that upsets her. I just tell her that China will get alot of hate the bigger they get. As it happens with every country.

reply to post by Rocky Black


Wow I'm sorry with my posts lately. My spelling and grammer are horrible and I never check what I type sorry.

Mr. Black...

Ps How do I put in an avatar, or picture of myself as many of you have some cool picks.

thanks again.
B

Originally posted by MRuss
reply to post by FrancoUn-American

 

No one cares?

Um. Yes they do.

I care.

My educated neighbors care.

Human rights is one of the most important issues of our times.

You obviously are young and grew up in a world where blacks and women had voting rights. You grew up in a country that cares about HUMAN RIGHTS----- rights that you take for granted because you don't know any better.

I don't think America is perfect.

But I DO KNOW THIS:

My daughters weren't thrown in the trash when they were born. I was not sterilized against my will. I can practice my religion without fear of penalty or imprisonment.

I don't live in fear.

I live in the United States of America.

Perfect or not, I am happy to be here.

No your right about that but you live in a country that kills people on mass for its own economical gain...

I'd rather live in a crap-ass country than be a part of what you call your UNITED STATES OF AMERICA...

Originally posted by SLAYER69

YES!

I too see things the US has done wrong that needs to be addressed. This however doesn't mean that we are the only ones nor does it mean that Americans are ignoring the truths.

HE SAID, SHE SAID. WHO STRUCK PAUL?

It’s not very hard to see the wrong that was done.. And just because you’re reasonable enough to admit it was wrong it doesn’t mean anything is going to change. American and English young lads are still dyeing every day. Iraq and Afghanistan and any other country you’re using still have a foreign occupation.

The only way its ever going to change is if you do something. You know there is a problem and an election and a bailout is not going to change it.

The system has to change.

reply to post by Misoir


more angels and demons stuff.