If SHTF, this is the gun I would bring

reply to post by HattoriHanzou


Unless you plan on staying in one place all the time, then stockpiling loads of ammo isnt reasonable. You cant carry loads and loads of ammo plus water and other supplies....

Thanks for the insult tho, video games NOT in mind, ive done my fair share of combat USMC. And given situations where you are moving around a lot and scavenging , you are bound to come across places where you do find ammo.

And given you could be in combat situations with people fighting for resources AND food, your more likely to come across ammo that is more common.

Take my advice or not......in the end the decisions are all up to personal preference

But dont insult everyone by assuming they are 16 year old kids who play too much call of duty.

Myself I carry my side arm .40 s and w and an armalite AR-10

reply to post by projectvxn


Project, thnx for the heads up on the bushy. I've been thinking about that but TBH I never even considered the tool-less barrel swap. I've had good luck with my SOC16 it's a little heavier than I expected it to be with the full composite stock but was hitting half dollar size pieces of block 200yds out with it. Love the iron sights.

reply to post by Romans 10:9


Romans, it stinks that you had a bad run with your SOC16. It's been a pretty reliable brush gun for me and a well rounded range gun. I haven't ever had an FTF, FTE, or issues with mags. The accuracy as you said gets wicked iffy at a few hundred yards but if the sights are zeroed in properly up to 200 - 250 yds this rifle was pretty accurate. I had a SWAT sniper actually teach me how to shoot a rifle about 3 years ago and he zeroed this rifle for me then. I used to have a beretta 9000S back when I was running special detail for a private security firm. It had issues with FTF, FTE but I chalked it up to a picky gun and carbon build up on the ejector hook for the ejection issues. I'm happy with my FNP9 now and have never had any issues with it. I shoot a 295 on the marksmen tests for blue cards. Not terribly difficult to do but it shows that out of 60 - 70 rds you only miss once. Mine is always my first shot (DA never treats me well).

I like the Mosin and have many. The ammo is common and cheap in my part of the US. The stockpiles are many and the users of this weapon are many as well.

I would not trade my FN FAL for one but I like to have a number of extras of these rifles on hand to give to others so I have some long range backup. Sometimes having more guns trained on your target from more directions is more important than how common the ammo is from a tactical stand point.

The equipping others quickly and cheaply and training them to be effective in a fight stand point should not be ignored. It takes a lot of unified gunfire to win a battle not just one nice gun.

reply to post by RedBird


Ill probably join the zombie apocalypse to overthrow the corporate whip masters.

reply to post by HattoriHanzou


Again I agree with MBTM. You do find ammo in real life, i mean after all people will carry ammo. I may not be as simple as video games make it seem but you do find ammo.

reply to post by RedBird


IF THE S. HITS THE FAN THE STAR SHOULD BE CLOSE ENOUGH TO GUIDE BY THEN
PIECE I MEAN PEACE LOL

Originally posted by ManBehindTheMask
reply to post by HattoriHanzou

 

Unless you plan on staying in one place all the time, then stockpiling loads of ammo isnt reasonable. You cant carry loads and loads of ammo plus water and other supplies....

Thanks for the insult tho, video games NOT in mind, ive done my fair share of combat USMC. And given situations where you are moving around a lot and scavenging , you are bound to come across places where you do find ammo.

And given you could be in combat situations with people fighting for resources AND food, your more likely to come across ammo that is more common.

Take my advice or not......in the end the decisions are all up to personal preference

But dont insult everyone by assuming they are 16 year old kids who play too much call of duty.

Myself I carry my side arm .40 s and w and an armalite AR-10

No need to get sore, I was just pointing out that you don't "find" ammo, you "take" it or store it.

Besides that, if you were in the Marine Corps, you'd know that having tons of ammo is totally unnecessary. If you're smart you keep a low profile and use at most a few shots at a time. Combat situations if the # hits the fan wouldn't be the most common thing if you were careful - more like hunting.

However, if you were more hip to the gun scene here in the USA you'd know that after .30-06, .308, and .223, the most common calibers are 7.62x54R and 7.62x39 because of the millions of Mosin Nagants and SKS and AK platform weapons in circulation. All the major ammo makers now offer these calibers which are produced domestically, in addition to the imports.

You'd have much worse luck "finding" ammo if you chose your AR-10 in .243 (which it is offered in) over something like a Mosin-Nagant.

Aside from that fact, you can get 5 Mosin Nagants and 2500 rounds of ammo for the price of an AR-10. It's the ideal survival weapon - hell you could bury a bunch of them and not worry about it.

The Mosin-Nagant is also just about indestructible and will work without any servicing or lubrication for years. Try that with the frail Stoner designed weapons!

Guns are only going to make it for so long...

Ammos will become rare... If # hits the fan for long term I'm counting on a bow/katana and throwing knife and ambushing navaho style when its dark. Although a roman gladius or kukri are to be fearful tools... no reload, no jam, silent and always ready to go no matter the weather/condition... And I rarely miss with a throwing knife from 5-25ish feet away and there's always plenty of scrap metal to do makeshift throwing knives, spikes, axes...

I don't plan on staying around densely populated areas neither when food/water will become rare its going to be a bloodbath...

Originally posted by _R4t_
Guns are only going to make it for so long...

Ammos will become rare... If # hits the fan for long term I'm counting on a bow/katana and throwing knife and ambushing navaho style when its dark. Although a roman gladius or kukri are to be fearful tools... no reload, no jam, silent and always ready to go no matter the weather/condition... And I rarely miss with a throwing knife from 5-25ish feet away and there's always plenty of scrap metal to do makeshift throwing knives, spikes, axes...

I don't plan on staying around densely populated areas neither when food/water will become rare its going to be a bloodbath...

Har har.

It's been fairly well proven that unless you can measure the distance ahead of time, you will hit with the handle and not the blade of a knife 50% of the time.

Gunpowder can be manufactured pretty easily if you know how, even from scratch.

reply to post by HattoriHanzou


I've been throwing knives for the last 15 years... If you use the same knives or similar in shape/weight/balance and you NEVER always throw from the same distance it becomes sort of natural after a while. You can gauge the distance well enough...

Ive got a Mosin but it would not be used for a scavenge mission unless i was providing distance overwatch...

My ar15 is my street walkin/building clearing/zombie killin machine. Ive got the ol glock 17 loaded up ready to go when the AR breaks down.

The 7.62x54r round is absolutely devastating. I watched enemy at the gates the other day and chuckled out load when the russian popped off a quick round at the german and hit him in the hand and it looked like a .22 hit him...These rounds would literally blow a mans hand off!

If you have the skill and ability to use the mosin as a sniper its as good as any modern rifle and 440 rounds will last you a long time if youre killing everything with 1 shot (which you should be able to drop ANYTHING with 1 shot shooting those bowling balls).

reply to post by HattoriHanzou



I would venture to guess he has an AR-10 in .308 if he had a .243 he wouldnt have an argument about ammo being readily available

What you take with you is pretty irrelevant.

You will more than likely lose your firearm for one reason or another and you will come across plenty more as time goes by.

In NH there's at least a dozen guns in every other home. Sooner or later I'm bound to get my hands on a firearm and some ammo if I dont have them in hand already.

And if you're lugging some rifle you havent found any ammo for in 3 days are you going to keep carrying it when you come across another rifle with ammo that isnt compatible with the one on your back or dump it for the working combo?

Of course how far you;re traveling, whether or not you have a camp nearby, how many in your party all matter but in the end what you take with you when the "SHTF" most likely wont be what's in your hand when you end up dead weeks or months or even years later.

Some already gun-phobic place like NYC or DC will be different. Probably not as much on hand unless you're in with the ghetto trash gangsters and acquiring what you need from law enforcement or military will no doubt be extremely difficult. But in the rest of the country you could bet your life that at least half the houses on your street contain a gun or 2 or 20.

reply to post by thisguyrighthere


Reminds me of that line from We Were Soldiers when Mel Gibson told his right hand man that he might want to get himself one of those new M16's out of the armory for the battle and the guy said (paraphrasing) "When I need one, there will be plenty of them lying on the ground"

If SHTF, you can bet there are going to be stupid people that have guns...those stupid people probably never really put any real serious thought into the psychological battle involved in dropping the hammer on a real person and will hesitate...Thats the moment that they will be incapacitated and lose their guns...

The first thing you should worry about in a SHTF situation is how much you can carry. The discussion which caliber can kill deader isn largely irrelevant because your main objective WILL be to avoid confrontation, unless you plan on robbing. Don´t depend on hunting unless you´re prepared to go into the deepest woods, because hundred thousands of other people will have the same idea, which mill most likely produce a mass of dead hunters and make game extinct anywhere close to human settlements. So much for sustainable hunting.

Also, one shouldnt overestimate ones own cold-bloodedness (or capabilities), or that of your fellow men. One can PREPARE to shoot other people 300 meters away - its an entirely different thing to convince yourself to do it. Armed confrontations will most likely happen at short distances when it is clear they are inevitable, in which case even trained professionals like police or soldiers shoot and shoot and shoot until theyre out of ammo or the target is clearly incapacitated. The same will be true for YOU. Which means your choice of weapons should at least include a large capacity, fast-firing weapon fed by small lightweight munitions of which you can carry a respectable stockpile.

Which leads us to the overarching importance of ammunition: in a complete breakdown of civilisation ammunition and cigarettes will become the de rigueur currency. And just like the brand of cigarettes is not that important as long as you HAVE them, the sort of bullets you carry will not have that much effect on your wealth: Yes, a large rifle round will buy you a night under a roof by the fire and a soup, but so does a 9mm pistol round - of which you can carry hundreds more.

My personal choice of weapons would be a solid semiautomatic 9mm handgun paired with either a shotgun or bolt-action 5.56mm.

Originally posted by RedBird
Mosin-Nagant 91/30



Powerful, reliable, accurate. And the bolt action is smooth enough once your hand gets used to it. You'll bruise your palm if you fire off too many rounds too fast, but quite frankly it should hurt a little bit to use a weapon.

Whether you're walking into the bush, fighting off the zombie apocalypse, or rebelling against your corporate overlords, this is the firearm.

I've tried a few different rifles, but nothing provides the same raw power and satisfaction while still being comofrtable and familiar to the marksman's hand.

edit on 11-11-2010 by RedBird because: (no reason given)

I would bring this because it can hit its targets at long range and the perp woulden't see it comming. www.youtube.com...

reply to post by nite owl


nite owl this gun assumes that you are on nothing more than a killing mission. A SHTF scenario is one that is survival. At the range of this gun you have NO IDEA what the intentions of the "invading" force is coming for. For all you know they may be looking for survivors so we can rebuild what's left of the community/civilization. Bands of people working in unison is what will rebuild a society, not Rambo dramatics.

reply to post by RedBird


so you would take this over a sks 7.62x39 semi-auto with an ammo clip?...you would take a bolt action?....gee, i hope they come at you one at a time, evenly spaced, and and also firing bolt actions.

reply to post by Stryker Ops


I am speaking about survival. When you are in this scenario you have to admitt that if you band together with others to protect a particular area, you need help and armed guards at posts to keep an area safe. A sniper inside can protect the guards outside the perimeter. did you see the movie postman? towards the end he came upon a village and that village was protected by an armed guard at the entrance. Well, im sure WTSHTF that a sniper would protect guards outside the perimeter where the sniper may not see. If you have watches, you can be better equipped to handle an armed conflict and the citizens inside can feel safe. This only makes sense. People will band together for safety reasons. Just like in the wild how the animals and fish band together in numbers. Does this make sense? Enable communications,Protect the village, secure food source (farmers, hunters), enable standard laws,recruit members, and a barter and trade post established. A modern day BARTER TOWN, like the movie so to speak only with laws to protect the peoples.

reply to post by nite owl


OK, I'll concede to perimeter protection as a must but there will have to be rules of engagement within the borders of what you're protecting. If you see 10 - 20 people making their way towards town and they have guns you can't assume that they're going to try and over run your newly established town. The only way I see a sniper lookout as a viable option is in a scenario that you eluded to. If your perimeter forces are engaged in a battle you can provide coverage that they might not be able to see or if that force of 10 -20 people are known enemies or renegades who are bent on messing with your town.

What I fear with scenarios like you've suggested for a sniper like that is I'll be walking towards a town to establish a civil life with like minded folk loaded with my small arms only to realize half my torso is missing just before death.

ALSO Project, thnx for the heads up on the Bushy I think I'm going to move towards the AR and or M4 models. I have become interested in the Colt M4 but I've heard some bad news on the tolerances make it a somewhat picky gun.