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You think abortion or giving up a child for adoption are walking away scott free? Ignorance of staggering levels.
Just to simplify it for you, what about carrying the child, even for a month? What about the hormonal changes, physical changes and psychological effects of pregnancy?
Stress is a term in psychology and biology, first coined in the biological context in the 1930s, which has in more recent decades become commonly used in popular parlance. It refers to the consequence of the failure of an organism – human or animal – to respond appropriately to emotional or physical threats, whether actual or imagined.
Stress symptoms commonly include a state of alarm and adrenaline production, short-term resistance as a coping mechanism, and exhaustion, as well as irritability, muscular tension, inability to concentrate and a variety of physiological reactions such as headache and elevated heart rate.
Divorce leaves men ten times more likely than women to commit suicide. The "ten times" ratio is under normal circumstances of divorce. No season is less normal, of course, than the holiday season -- long-known as a breeding ground for depression and suicide. And for millions of men this double jeopardy of being a divorced man during the holidays is magnified when he has children he cannot see -- the holidays are the season of the Home Alone Dad.
A distraught father struggling with overdue child support obligations and
adverse family court decisions committed suicide on the steps of the
downtown San Diego courthouse Monday. Angrily waving court documents, 43
year-old Derrick Miller walked up to court personnel at the entrance, said
"You did this to me," and shot himself in the head.
Miller is one of 300,000 Americans who have taken their own lives over the
past decade--as many Americans as were killed in combat in World War II.
America is in the throes of a largely unrecognized suicide epidemic, as
suicide has become the eighth leading cause of death in the United States
today, and the third leading cause of death among adolescents. All
Americans recognize that our country is rife with violent crime, but few
know that 50% more Americans kill themselves than are murdered.
Originally posted by Hefficide
Originally posted by Becoming
You would have a point if no protection was used.
But they should have the right to decline fatherhood if the woman was on the pill and/or a condom was used and a pregnancy still resulted.
Under these circumstances both of the parties took a gamble upon the chances of pregnancy - as no form of birth control, other than abstinence is 100% effective. The use of a condom or believing a woman who says she is on the pill does not absolve either party of the consequences of their actions.
Originally posted by Becoming
Women have the right to decline mother hood if she chooses to spread her legs. Why must the father be held responsible if a one night fling ended up with a pregnancy and the mother chooses to keep the child?
I don't agree with this logic at all. A one night stand or not, if you're man enough to play, you are man enough to pay. Any man who has sex does so understanding the risks and chooses to run them.
Originally posted by CONFLAG
His quote is better than yours. Explain to me why that logic is wrong. Women have a choice, men don't. Explain the fairness and why the logic doesn't apply?
If a woman has sex with a man, she can have an abortion, or she can give the child away. But the man has to let the mother take the decisions. Why can he not financially and legally step away from the table?
Originally posted by Hefficide
Imagine a world where this d-bag would be allowed to just "walk away" out of "gender fairness" from responsibility. In fact, don't imagine it because even with this system, that's what he is doing. If he was utterly free to do this, without any recourse or hassle, imagine the number of WIC vouchers and welfare checks that this ONE man would be laying at the door of society in general.
Originally posted by mamabeth
I agree with this member.If you want to play
adult games,then you have to pay the adult
price!
Originally posted by mayertuck
Sadly that isn't the case, one gender gets the out and the other is expected to just man up. That is ridiculous in my opinion. And i know this is a longshot, but if a female knew that there is a possibility she would be held more accountable for her actions (i.e. if she decides to bring a life into the world) she might weild her choice more responsibily.
Originally posted by mayertuck
I just want both people to be held to the same standard, the way it is now smacks of the old jim crow laws. And seperate but equal is never equal.
Originally posted by mayertuck
reply to post by hotbakedtater
This is off topic, but you do they both do not have the same reproductive choices.
REPRODUCTIVE CHOICE
Female
Abortion
Adoption
Reproduce
Condom
Morning After Pill
Diaphragm
Withdrawl
Absitnence
IUD
Depo shot
Keep the child
Unprotected sex
Male
Condom
Abstinence
Vascetomy
Unprotected sex
Willingly pay child support
Willingly have a child
Withdrawl
Might of missed some, now if gender isn't an issue shouldnt both sides of the above quick and dirty table have the same number of choices Regardless of what column their gender is? Now do they?
edit on 26-10-2010 by mayertuck because: (no reason given)edit on 26-10-2010 by mayertuck because: (no reason given)
Originally posted by Dark Ghost
Why are you trying to make this thread about "anti-Abortionists"? This thread is about securing rights for men and asking women to be held responsible for their actions just like men are. It is about acknowledging that while women might undergo 9 months of physical labour, there is MUCH more to consider besides this TEMPORARY uncomfortable experience.
Originally posted by Dark Ghost
It is about bringing attention to the unfair social and legal advantages women have over men in these areas. Wanting equal rights and fair treatment for BOTH sexes does not make me a Misogynist. If the actions of Women's groups did not have negative consequences on Men and their rights, Men would have no problems with them.
Originally posted by Dark Ghost
I am all for helping women escape oppression and achieve happiness. What I do no support is giving them extra rights or preferential treatment over men in situations where they seek to gain at man's expense, while denying men the same freedom in areas they seek to gain because women seek to lose in these situations. This is very much the problem with modern Women's movements. This is what men such as me are speaking out against. It is not about being a Misogynist or feeling bitter towards Women.
Originally posted by Hefficide
Then write your Congressional representation and lobby against abortion. You have that right. And, frankly, with your level of opinion on this subject, the responsibility to do so. Become the catalyst for the change that you seek. If the SCOTUS bans abortions then it will be the law of the land and you can say that you had a hand in bringing this to pass.
But coming at this issue from such a backwards angle lends little credence to that cause. Demanding an equality that violates biology cannot be made to happen no matter what the motives or how motivated a person or group of people are.
~Heff
Originally posted by SevenBeans
reply to post by Hefficide
Heff, one very simple question...
When you make a unilateral decision, do you think the law should ever hold someone else equally responsible for the results of your decision, under threat of jail?
If so, why? Can you think of any time that the law does this for you?
Thanks.
For conviction, there needs to be proof that the parent meets the following criteria:
* Delinquent payments over a year or the amount owed greater than $5,000, when child and non-custodial parent live in two different states
* Non-custodial parent was able to pay
* Intentionally did not pay
You don't have to run from the law if you have the inability to pay child support. You need to make this information known and work with the court system in to try to find a way to provide as much as possible. There are counselors available that can help you budget the money you have left over each month after paying your support to your children. Child support may not be something you want to deal with for the next several years but a prison sentence will last much longer than that. Fulfill your duties as a father and take care of your children; your freedom depends on it..
Originally posted by Hefficide
We keep coming back to this "the woman made a choice to get pregnant and that's the whole of the issue" argument while ignoring the very basic reality that unless somebody steals your sperm against your will, then it was NOT a unilateral decision. It was the cumulative effect of the decisions and actions of both parties which result in pregnancy.
Originally posted by Hefficide
And, yes, regarding your specific query about other situations where the actions or decisions of another can effect you, I offer the legal concept of being an accessory to a crime.
Originally posted by Hefficide
I speak specifically about the birth of an infant as a direct result of procreative practices engaged in by both the mother than the father. Both are culpable for the support of that child.
Originally posted by SevenBeans
Sex and pregnancy does not cause the birth of a child requiring 20 years of support, only the unilateral choice of a Woman can cause that.