Why must a child have a SS# in order to be a dependant

Technically a SS# is not to be used for anything other than employment purposes so entitlements can be credit to a persons account.

Schools can not use it to identify a child,nor can states on things like licenses.

reply to post by Oneolddude


Technically speaking the Social Security Number is simply an identifying number for the express purpose of Social Security, and has nothing at all to do with employment.

How do we know you are telling the truth, that you have a kid? Get some proof, like a SS# for him to prove to me he exists and belongs to you and then come back with your story and I'll tell you why they do it.

Originally posted by KrispyB
How do we know you are telling the truth, that you have a kid? Get some proof, like a SS# for him to prove to me he exists and belongs to you and then come back with your story and I'll tell you why they do it.

I live in an area of a large metropolis where several people are in the black market of supplying illegal immigrants with identification including Social Security Numbers. There's your proof of existence my friend!

Unless you are illegal. Perhaps what the employers are shunning is people working for them who have been branded like cattle for someone else.
Wouldn't be wise to be accused of rustling now would it?

Originally posted by Jean Paul Zodeaux

Originally posted by KrispyB
How do we know you are telling the truth, that you have a kid? Get some proof, like a SS# for him to prove to me he exists and belongs to you and then come back with your story and I'll tell you why they do it.

I live in an area of a large metropolis where several people are in the black market of supplying illegal immigrants with identification including Social Security Numbers. There's your proof of existence my friend!

Hmmm, several(meaning three) people supplying hundreds of thousands, maybe millions of people with SS cards. Three people can manage that many people, I want thier business secret. I also want proof this is happening. I sooo want to believe you my friend but my bs detector is lock, drop and poppin'!

reply to post by KrispyB


First you play a game of deceit where you imply I claimed that "three" people were supplying millions of illegal immigrants with Social Security Numbers and then understandably so you claim you don't believe me. Thieves always lock their doors and liars always think others are lying. If you choose to not believe me this is your problem and not mine. If you think most are as foolish as you to believe that identity theft and fake identification doesn't exist, then you are even more foolish than you have appeared to be in these posts.

www.ssa.gov...

ssa-custhelp.ssa.gov...

www.msnbc.msn.com...

www.scambusters.org...

www.examiner.com...

And if you can't be bothered to read any of those links, and since this thread is about a child not having a Social Security Number, the least you could do is read this story by The New York Times:

www.nytimes.com...

Or you can rely on your silly little emoticons to show how easy it is to indicate how smart you think you are by remaining ignorant. The choice is entirely yours.

reply to post by Jean Paul Zodeaux


I didn't advise anyone to do anything. Or not do anything. I simply pointed out that schools (at least in Missouri) do require you to show a SS card when you enroll you child, and that employers do require you do show one when you're hired. I didn't say they can legally force you to.

I also stated that employers must fill out an I-9 form which proves your eligibility to work in the US. Almost all the documents listed as acceptable verification (those which apply to US citizens and not resident aliens etc) are things which you must've shown a social security card to acquire in the first place (such as a state ID).

reply to post by riiver


The law that I all ready posted shows that employers are not required to make a demand that a Social Security be shown, and are only required to request one. Further, public schools can not make any requirement of proof of Social Security, particularly because they are a government agency separate from the Social Security Agency, and while they certainly have a right to request one as proof of identity, they can not demand, as a term of enrollment, such number. It would be a gross conflict of interest, and bring about many problems for the School Board. Further, Social Security Numbers do not function as proof of eligibility to work in the U.S., and I will keep stating this until it is understood; the only purpose of a Social Security Number is for Social Security itself, and this fiat I.D. number nonsense has only happened through mistakes of fact, and misinterpretation of law.

People are free to request a Social Security Number, but people may not make such a demand as a term of a contract or this will amount to extortion and/or coercion. The only agency that may demand a Social Security Number is the SSA, and then only when a person is making an application for Social Security benefits. The S.S. Number has become a fiat national I.D. number because so many are willing to put out false information about what is required. All people have the right to contract without government interference, unless that contract is breaking an existing law. The right to contract does not demand any Social Security Numbers unless that contract is with the SSA.

Originally posted by Jean Paul Zodeaux
reply to post by KrispyB

 

And if you can't be bothered to read any of those links, and since this thread is about a child not having a Social Security Number, the least you could do is read this story by The New York Times:

www.nytimes.com...

Or you can rely on your silly little emoticons to show how easy it is to indicate how smart you think you are by remaining ignorant. The choice is entirely yours.

That was a very good article and thanks to everyone for the feedback. The bottom line is I cannot help but feel screwed by Social Security and the IRS especially when it comes to my son. Mainly, because he has no reason whatsoever to volunteer to be numbered, tracked, and have some indeterminable amount of his income stolen at the whimb and discretion of a bunch of lying, cheating, criminal imbeciles. Will he have any say in how the money is spent, what wars will be fought, will he be paying to have a camera or chip installed on him; I know I certainly don't feel as though I have or will have any say when it comes to those things. Doesn't it just seem as though you are making a deal with the devil, barcoding your child with a SS#, or is that just me?

reply to post by Jean Paul Zodeaux
Hmmm, FIRST OF ALL, I was talking to the person that started this thread, not you Mr. Man. What the hell compelles you to just jump mouth first in front of someone when they aren't talking to you? Don't you know that's rude! Oh, pardon me, I didn't see the part where he said, " Hey dick, please do my argueing for me." Do you want to do his eating and defecating for him too? Good job side stepping my point by the way, I guess I never will know thier business secrets. And what do I care about some slanted jewish paper. Haaaaa!

Others have correctly pointed a SSN is needed in order for the IRS to verify a dependent. A common problem that happens with parents who are not married is that they will both claim the same child as a dependent, when the law only allows a child to be claimed as a dependent on one tax return. A SSN is a very useful tool in preventing parents from doing this.

When one claims a child as a dependent on a tax return, they are doing so in order to get a deduction , exemption, or credit. Court do not view taxpayers as having a "right" to an exemption, credit, or deduction. But rather, they view these as "legislative graces." Taxpayers, therefore, have an obligation to play by all the rules in order to take advantage of a "legislative grace" because it is not a "right."

I was in 7th or 8th grade when I got my SS#. That was back in the 60s. As many have already pointed out, it was to prevent people from claiming dependants that they had no right to claim. I know for a fact that my biological father continued to claim me and my two brother for years after we went to live with my mom and step-dad. So for years the government gave double deductions for the three of us. Multiply that by thousands or more trying to get one up on the government and you can see why they implemented ss# for all dependants. While I disagree with mandatory ss# for children, I do understand.

Two of my kids have no ssn and I have been claiming them as dependants for the past 8 years. One is adopted, one is our natural child and there has not been a problem.

I don't do my own taxes, so its possible that the cpa who does does something particular, don't know, but I do know for sure that I'm getting the deductions

reply to post by dolphinfan
I hope not but I wonder if the IRS is going to pay you a visit some day.