Secret Cloning Projects

I have reasons to believe that cloning and genetic manipulation of humans and animals is being done - in secret as not to cause public outrage.

Why is it being done? Because its possible.

Why is it being kept secret? Because its either banned or frowned upon.

On a whim I googled up some hints that there might be some cover-up happening.


Clandestine Cloning in South Korea

CNN: South Korean Cloning

BBCs rebuttal:

South Korean Cloning was Fake

But:

Dr Hwang said he would resign, but he did not admit his research was faked.

From here:

In 1978 David Rorvik claimed in his book In His Image: The Cloning of a Man that he had personal knowledge of the creation of a human clone. A court case followed. He failed to produce corroborating evidence to back up his claims; now regarded as a hoax.

If anybody can help shed more light on this that would be greatly appreciated.


To all naysayers/debunkers: "Cover-up" presupposes that evidence is scarce. In order to find out whether there indeed is or is not a secret program of cloning or genetic manipulation or even cross-breeding happening, please allow for some speculation.

More leads:

Ban human clones or expect them soon U.N. says


Scientists in California make human embryo clone

The possibility is that this is already happening and these "small leaks" are meant as a slow preparation on things to come - just like the military harbours technology 10 years before it becomes public.

Some ATS Threads for researchers/authors:


Pet Cloning available today


The cloning revolution


New cloning could produce human child


Cloning Timeline (Link to)

Italian Doctor makes cloning claim


First cloned dog

FDA: Cloned Livestock OK to eat

Cross-Breeding & Genetic Engineering

[edit on 27-5-2008 by Skyfloating]

The reason I believe cloning to be happening in secret is...

...about 8 years ago I was sitting in a Hotel sitting in a Hotel in Switzerland watching the news on TV. A newsreel matter-of-factly stated that police had raided a builing in which human cloning and genetic cross-breeding of humans had been going on. I startled and sat up. What? After 30 seconds the newsreel was over and my mind raced because I wasnt aware that such a thing was even possible.

Funny thing is I never heard of it again. I waited for the next news show but they did not repeat that newsreel. The next day I looked for confirmation of the report and found nothing. I checked the newspapers. Nothing. I even checked with Reuters and AP and again...nothing. Where had the piece of news dissappeared to? Had I only pretended to see it?

So thats when and why I started thinking about a cover-up.

[edit on 28-5-2008 by Skyfloating]

A few peculiarities in wording:

Referring to Dr. Hwang:

"Prosecutors on Friday indicted a disgraced cloning scientist on embezzlement and bioethics law violations linked to faked stem cell research, officials said.

from NY Times article

What bioethics laws had he violated if his claims were fraudulent?

Also like to point out that some sources say Dr. Hwang created clones while others say he created human stem cells. I would assume the claims of a clone are just people seeing the words cloning or genetic research and jumping to conclusions, but inconsistency is sometimes a marker of cover up.

In the sources that say that Dr Hwang created stem cells, the panel that investigated his claims (an internal panel at Seoul National University) dismissed 9 of the total 11 stem cells claimed to be produced as fake. The other two were never determined to be fake (or real for that matter).

Another hint that there might have been more going on is the embezzlement charge leveled against Dr. Hwang. Hwang was found to have embezzled approximately 3 million dollars with which he bought ova that he used in his experiments. The fact that Dr. Hwang exposed himself to punishment in such a blatant way seems to me to suggest that he was working on something he thought was worth possible prison time.

The most interesting part of this case is the money trail. Dr. Hwang embezzled money given to him in grants and private donations; that is abundantly clear. He used a good deal of that money to buy gifts for politicians and prominent businessmen (bribes to keep his research going?). There is also and interesting exchange between him and an American scientist.

Why not dismiss this as a classic case of embezzlement and assume Dr. Hwang was just using the money for personal gain and enjoyment? While he did spend money on personal things like cars and gifts for family, the vast majority of it went to the above sources. Dr. Hwang could have easily lived the high life, but instead invested it into his work (including grease money to keep politicians and corporations friendly to his work).

Perhaps the most important question is was he able to clone a human or even a stem cell? Well, he received 475 MILLION in grants and donations over three years, that’s a pretty big testament of faith isn’t it?

Great topic.

Thanks for being the detective. Im surprised I missed all of these inconsistencies despite the paranoid-eye. Those who would like to cover something up bank on our laziness not to notice.

In summary you bring this up on Dr.Hwang:

1. If he was a fraud what bioethic laws has he violated?

2. If he was a fraud why did he receive 475 Million in donations?

3. If he was a fraud, why didnt he admit it?

4. If he was a fraud, why did he use most of his money for the research?

____________________________________________


I´ll add that an indicator of something being kept from the public is the fact that we have laws in place for something that supposedly doesnt exist yet.

Looking at your first link I immediately got the wheels turning with this:

Source: www.guitarzone.com...

The scientists were led by South Korea's Hwang Woo-Suk, Gerald Schatten of the University of Pittsburgh School of Medicine, and the creator of the cloned sheep Dolly, Professor Ian Wilmut of Scotland's Roslin Institute

These stem cells carry the identical genes of patients because they are extracted from cloned human embryos produced by combining adult cells from the patients and human eggs from donors, the scientists said.

Then from Wiki showing the relationship to the Roslin Institute to the infamous chapel. en.wikipedia.org...

The village sits on the west side of Roslin Glen, now a country park. Overlooking the Glen are Rosslyn Chapel and Roslin Castle.

Roslin (sometimes spelt Rosslyn or Roslyn) is a village in Midlothian, Scotland, to the south of the Scottish capital city Edinburgh

The elaborately carved chapel has long been associated with the Knights Templars and the Grail legend, and featured in the best selling book The Da Vinci Code. The popularity of the book and the use of the chapel as a location in the subsequent film greatly increased the number of visitors to the village

Grail legend, Knights Templars and Cloning..................

Smells like Bloodline Tweaking Potential to me!

edit to add: Not taking away from the seriousness of the thread, just trying to catch every angle!

[edit on 28-5-2008 by interestedalways]

Since dna is readily available in tooth enamel sometimes upwards to 100,000 years,why wouldnt they just clone another Albert E?Good qs would this make him just as smart as this original?Some wack job can go ahead and clone another Hitler...crazy.

[edit on 28-5-2008 by alienstar]

Dr. Samuel Wood, a medical doctor and chief executive of the company, along with a colleague, donated skin cells to begin the process of making human clones. DNA from those cells was transferred to human eggs. Creating human clones is not considered groundbreaking. But the next step, which could have been a landmark -- generating viable stem cells from human clones -- did not occur.

So that's what happens with the "stuff" they "scoop" out of your arm!!!

What if there were certain bloodlines being preserved or being moved off planet to survive potential catastrophe???



edit to add source: www.newsday.com...

[edit on 28-5-2008 by interestedalways]

Originally posted by alienstar
Since dna is readily available in tooth enamel sometimes upwards to 100,000,why wouldnt they just clone another Albert E?Good qs would this make him just as smart as this original?Some wack job can go ahead and clone another Hilter...crazy.

I don't know, do you think the consciousness would follow the body?

I would think it would be more of a programmed being than a life sparked human.

Whats better for a government to have a programmed smartest man alive within thier control.

Originally posted by interestedalways

Grail legend, Knights Templars and Cloning..................

I did notice that little coincidence but didnt mention it. I figured someone would pick up on it

Good link to bloodlines, an interesting point.

Some people whc have organ transplants report to have memories/characteristics etc of the person it was originally from, perhaps some form of a consciousness could follow aswell.

I don't think this would be used to bring famous or noble people back like tesla for example, i think it would be used to preserve and intergrate existing bloodlines.

Peace

Skyfloating
The reason I believe cloning to be happening in secret is...

...about 8 years ago I was sitting in a Hotel sitting in a Hotel in Switzerland watching the news on TV. A newsreel matter-of-factly stated that police had raided a builing in which human cloning and genetic cross-breeding of humans had been going on. I startled and sat up. What? After 30 seconds the newsreel was over and my mind raced because I wasnt aware that such a thing was even possible.

Funny thing is I never heard of it again. I waited for the next news show but they did not repeat that newsreel. The next day I looked for confirmation of the report and found nothing. I checked the newspapers. Nothing. I even checked with Reuters and AP and again...nothing. Where had the piece of news dissappeared to? Had I only pretended to see it?

So thats when and why I started thinking about a cover-up.

[edit on 28-5-2008 by Skyfloating]

Hi Sky,

I nearly started a clone thread, thank God I had presence of time to do a deep search on the ATS engine, I have MUCH more to say on this subject but...I wanted to bump this thread and add this tidbit to the ongoing discussion, although it's been 5 years.

This is not a full movie list of the idea of cloning for movies going back to whenever they started the idea of putting clones in movies, it's more of a high return on movies that had cloning in them. I think nearly every year I watch movies, I see at least 2-3 per year that has a cloning theme to it, obviously I'm a big sci-fi fan.

It's a splinter in the back of my mind that never festers and never goes away, but from time to time...I have to wounder. i watched the movie Oblivion great movie

OBLIVION

A Surge in Clone-Centric Movies

There has been such a surge in movies about clones ever since the late 1970s, from Logan's Run and Blade Runner, to the iconic Jurassic Park and Star Wars, to lesser known films like Cloned: The Recreator Chronicles. Looking back at the time-line of these films, it is interesting to note that, in the past 21 years, almost every single year produced a clone-centric movie, and in many cases far more.

What is our culture's obsession with recreation? Some people might argue that creativity has a cycle, and that we are facing that pattern of recycling and renewal. Indeed, the fact that movies are more and more churning out sequels, prequels and remakes and that some of the most popular blockbusters are trilogies, says a great deal. Consumers form attachments to concepts, characters, and ideas, and the thought of saying goodbye is more painful than forking over $20 for a ticket.

Is that same concept true with clones as well? Do we like the idea of cloning so much that we are willing to endure the same theme for the past 20-plus years? I decided to look back in history and find examples throughout the years to illustrate this point. While there were several years that featured over four clone movies, I was interested to note that most films really took a different approach with the theme. While there were the familiar recurring storylines of Star Wars, Star Trek, and Superman, there were many other concepts that brought an extra dimension to the clone school of thought, and definitely warranted release.

Here are some highlights from film history's cloned time-line:

1976 Logan's Run
1978 The Boys from Brazil
1982 Blade Runner
1985 D.A.R.Y.L
1987 Superman IV The Quest For Peace
1991 Aeon Flux, TV Series
1993 Louis & Clark, TV Series
1993 Jurassic Park
1996 Multiplicity
1997 Alien: Resurrection
1997 The Lost World: Jurassic Park
1997 The Fifth Element
1998 The Avengers
1999 Futurama, TV Series
2000 The 6th Day
2000 Titan A.E.
2001 Jurassic Park III
2001 Smallvile, TV Series
2001 Imposter
2001 Replicant
2002 Resident Evil
2002 Star Trek: Nemesis
2003 Star Wars: The Clone Wars, TV Series
2004 Resident Evil: Apocalypse
2004 Battlestar Galactica
2004 Godsend
2005 Aeon Flux
2005 The Island
2006 Ultra Violet
2007 Resident Evil: Extinction
2008 Babylon A.D.
2009 Avatar
2009 Monsters vs Aliens
2010 Resident Evil: Afterlife
2011 Source Code
2012 Cloned: The Recreator Chronicles
2012 Cloud Atlas

What are your thoughts on the surge of clone movies?

Skyfloating
More leads:

Ban human clones or expect them soon U.N. says


Scientists in California make human embryo clone

The possibility is that this is already happening and these "small leaks" are meant as a slow preparation on things to come - just like the military harbours technology 10 years before it becomes public.

wanted to add the entire article to your first link above before it's gone.. it's still up and I'm curious as to why ..

LONDON (AP) — The international community faces a stark choice: outlaw human cloning or prepare for the creation of cloned humans, U.N. researchers said Saturday.
Previous attempts to reach a binding worldwide treaty foundered over divisions on whether to outlaw all cloning or permit cloning of cells for research.

The best solution may be to ban human cloning, but to allow countries to conduct strictly controlled therapeutic research, including stem cell research, according to the report from the Japan-based United Nations University Institute for Advanced Studies.

Almost all countries oppose human cloning and more than 50 nations have introduced laws banning it. But lack of binding global legislation gives scientists an opening to create human clones in countries where bans do not exist.

"Failure to outlaw reproductive cloning means it is just a matter of time until cloned individuals share the planet," said Brendan Tobin, a human rights lawyer who co-authored the report.

"If failure to compromise continues, the world community must accept responsibility and ensure that any cloned individual receives full human rights protection," he said.

Cloning research proponents argue it offers great hope for producing replacement tissue and the potential for a cure for diseases such as cancer, Alzheimer's, Parkinson's and diabetes.

The report recommends permitting cloning cells for research — but not cloning aimed at duplicating a person or animal. It also calls for strict controls to prevent the uncontrolled production and destruction of embryos.

Copyright 2007 The Associated Press. All rights reserved. This material may not be published, broadcast, rewritten or redistributed.

ok .. I 'guess' I'm totally Naive when it comes to this subject.. but.. as I was doing some light research, skimming across google .. I landed this site and was shocked to find it was a dot GOV site....If I understand this correctly, the HGP (human genome project) was the main source of this department being created?!

Genome.Gov