Musical Score Found in "The Last Supper"

Originally posted by TheExaminer
Has anybody recorded their own performance of this music on other instruments than the pipe organ? Perhaps the human voice?

As an experiment, could someone record these notes and share them.

Yes, its from Right to Left...

well, what are the notes?

all i gathered was he 'think's it is in 3/4 and it is 'painfully' slow so it's adagissimo...

edit*

also, what you're hearing in the vid(the organ behind the narration) is not playing this hiddden score.....it's just some church like music...

this is only a 40 second long 'score' and that music played for more than 2 minutes.



[edit on 10-11-2007 by Boondock78]

reply to post by TheBorg


Here is a link to the actual music played!!! 20 sec. of audio!

hosted.ap.org...

Was located along with the news story here in the Dallas News:

www.dallasnews.com...



[edit on 10-11-2007 by thatblissguy]

reply to post by thatblissguy


yup.
sounds like a pipe organ

reply to post by thatblissguy


Hmm. I thought that the music in the background of that vid was the music that they found. Must just be my head playing games with me. Either way, good find!!!

Also, I liked the sound. It has an air of remorse about it that makes it all that much more intriguing.


Boondock,

While you may be right, that this is nothing more than a researcher's crazy notion of looking for things that aren't there, might I inquire as to how one can not see the Hebrew characters shown there? Don't you believe that every object in a painting was intentionally put there by the artist for a reason? The only reason that I mention this is because we are talking about one of the greatest geniuses to have ever lived. Isn't it just possible that he put that in there just as it's been found? True, it's possible that it's a fantasy created by this researcher, but that remains to be seen.

Sometimes, people feel the need to understand what it is that he's trying to say through his artwork; whether it be something real or imagined is not the point. The point here is that this is just an interesting tidbit that may yet yield some interesting clues as to the nature of this painting, and maybe even shed some light on the mind of the genius that was Leonardo Da Vinci.

Best Regards,
TheBorg

Originally posted by TheBorg
Boondock,

While you may be right, that this is nothing more than a researcher's crazy notion of looking for things that aren't there, might I inquire as to how one can not see the Hebrew characters shown there? Don't you believe that every object in a painting was intentionally put there by the artist for a reason? The only reason that I mention this is because we are talking about one of the greatest geniuses to have ever lived. Isn't it just possible that he put that in there just as it's been found? True, it's possible that it's a fantasy created by this researcher, but that remains to be seen.

Leonardo da Vinci may have been a genius be he wasn't, in my opinion, as great a genius as some people like to make him.

He was a great painter but he wasn't a great sculpture; he is considered a scientist be he was only half a scientist, he only observed and analyzed things without theorising about anything; he was an inventor but many of his inventions were impractical.

Most (or all) of his studies were related to his primary interest, art, so he studied anatomy and light and nature.

He did not had a classical education, he had to learn Latin by himself (the only language used by the scholars), so I doubt that he would have put some Hebrew characters in "the last supper".

Also, as I said in a previous post, the technique used was a wrong one, making the painting need repairs after some years of being made.

So, not all things we see on that painting were made by Leonardo, if we use the link provided by wathletic (welcome to ATS ) we can see that the painting is in a bad shape, in many areas it looks like the pigment used was eaten by something and that colour is almost completely gone.

In conclusion, I don't think that there is any hidden secret in any of Leonardo's paintings, he wasn't a man of secrets, he was a man of work and a man that studied to be better in his work.

This is great! Thank you for posting, theBorg.

bo neser usbi - "with Him consecration and glory"

He had access to secrets, so maybe this was his way of sharing.

This is interesting. I've always been skeptical about peoples claims of seeing secret things in his paintings. Like the theory about the two templars on either side of the table and someone whos appearing to be choked.

I never once doubted Da Vinci hid secret things in his paintings though. The man was a genius.

I'm prone to believe this story a little more then the other stories i've read about Da Vinci paintings.

Originally posted by TheBorg


Boondock,

While you may be right, that this is nothing more than a researcher's crazy notion of looking for things that aren't there, might I inquire as to how one can not see the Hebrew characters shown there? Don't you believe that every object in a painting was intentionally put there by the artist for a reason?

i saw the hebrew characters on there. about th eartist putting things in there for a reason, yeah, cause it was part of the painting...he put bread in there cause they were eating bread in the painting...
i don't think for one second that he put the bread in a specific spot to notate where a musical note will be placed..

to me, it looks like he took random(probably not random to him) points as a starting point and MADE them work. as in it didn't work the first way so i had to go right to left.
as in he used a 5 line staff.
i think he just guesed. how does he know it is in 3/4 if it is music? if leo was such a rad genious, maybe it was in 16/8 and composed for a lute...

he us using the pipe organ cause that makes 'church music'...he is using th emost common time signature of that day and he is 'finding' these notes...i just don't think it is possible....

music imo is far too complex to be decyphered from a worn out 600 year old painting...


maybe it's true...i don't know....i have never been one to think there is all this hidden stuff in his paintings.....
to see if this is just this guy seeing what he wants, i'd like to see someone else use another of leos paintings to see if he can come up with 40 seconds of a musical 'score'

A very interesting subject.

(Which, of course, still doesn't give semi-literate "authors" a la... you-know-who - the one who isn't familiar with even the most rudimentary iconography of St. John - to call Leonardo by what's not even his surname... The only proper, i.e. non-ridiculous and ignorant, way to call him is Leonardo - e basta )

Regarding Leonardo's music, I've come across a very short composition attributed to him online. (Don't remember the URL, but it should be easy enough to find.)
I wonder, is it the same one?


P.S. Here it is (I wasn't THAT lazy, after all...)

/23am9b

But it seems I am "heard of hearing", as the website says. I hear nothing.
(I certainly did the first time I visited it, a few years ago.)


P.S. (encore): Only after posting this message I noticed that some of the posters above also used the form "da Vinci". While it is, of course, incorrect to the point of absurdity, I just want to make it clear that I certainly didn't mean to offend anyone (unless Dan Brown is on this board, too, of course...) - so please, do not feel offended or slighted.






[edit on 10-11-2007 by Vanitas]

Due to some further discussions I've had with WickedStar, I'd like to retract my statement made about this concept being debunked. Music was in flux when Da Vinci painted "The Last Supper" and it's therefore not inconceivable that an innovator like the artist could have been experimenting with a new style of notation.

Originally posted by SimiusDei

Honestly, I find it a bit hard to believe that any "music" found in "The Last Supper" was put their on purpose. Anything that has structure can be translated musically.

I agree with this 100%. As a composer and recording engineer I can tell you that anything with uniform structure can be translated musically. The painting is very well balanced and symmetrical. I can hear music in my head when my toilet drips in an accidentally organized way. Keep in mind that somebody has written a book and wants you to buy it.

What an ingenious artist - never cessing to amaze.
To me, music and the art can reach right down in to your core (soul) to something so innate, it evokes gutteral responses. Just as certain geometric figures carry metaphysical connonations. These 'depictions' of life by way of art or music can literally catch your breath.
I doubt we even now fully understand the 'heredity' behind such reactions. Of course we have seen some 'symbols' in such repetiton, we have been indoctrinated into it for millenium (the Cross). But other just seem to be naturally a symbol- the triangle represents 3 (triads), concensus, base/foundation, building/ reaching for the peak- to stand upon the peak. Just like the Cross, an event or common knowledge must have preceeded our reverence of it. Why are some symbols more 'biological' and others indoctrinated? Who figured out how to use these symbols as tools (or vise versa)- Triangle= Mason Compass. Why does a chalice make sense as a representative of the sacred feminine, the sword is obvious. To me somethings carry more 'core' meaning than others ( seem the newer flavor of symbology. Not as natural). Santana Abraxas - that'll make ya feel like dancing around the fire naked (Anthro minor). All art is powerful (if truely art), but music reaches farther down to the innermost.....spirit?
I think we'll be discovering something new and interesting regarding Leonardo for many centuries to come. Gotta love his 'Mind Games".

reply to post by superheterodyne


totally agreed.
not much else to say....i hear 'music' all the time

its interesting what he gets out of it, but his basic asumption that there is a code in it ruins the whole idea.

Well, as I've said before, I don't know that this theory is 100% factual, as there's other evidence that the painting isn't entirely genuine anymore. As has been pointed out, it's had several "restorative renditions" over the past 600 years, so it's quite possible that something may have been added in as a result of someone else's artistic license.

This, however, doesn't detract from the intrigue that surrounds something so amazing. Just to think that someone could hide music in a painting, as has been suggested, is phenomenal. I'm truly anxious to hear what comes next.

TheBorg

Originally posted by ArMaP
Leonardo da Vinci may have been a genius be he wasn't, in my opinion, as great a genius as some people like to make him.

He was a great painter but he wasn't a great sculpture; he is considered a scientist be he was only half a scientist, he only observed and analyzed things without theorising about anything; he was an inventor but many of his inventions were impractical.

Most (or all) of his studies were related to his primary interest, art, so he studied anatomy and light and nature.

He did not had a classical education, he had to learn Latin by himself (the only language used by the scholars), so I doubt that he would have put some Hebrew characters in "the last supper".

Also, as I said in a previous post, the technique used was a wrong one, making the painting need repairs after some years of being made.

So, not all things we see on that painting were made by Leonardo, if we use the link provided by wathletic (welcome to ATS

) we can see that the painting is in a bad shape, in many areas it looks like the pigment used was eaten by something and that colour is almost completely gone.

In conclusion, I don't think that there is any hidden secret in any of Leonardo's paintings, he wasn't a man of secrets, he was a man of work and a man that studied to be better in his work.

I agree I have a book on his writings. Based on his beliefs and thoughts I highly doubt he was hiding deep allegories of gnostic thought or the more popular thought that he knew some secret truth of Christianity. Like the painting of John and Jesus kissing. However it struck me, since there is some weird stuff with John/s' and Freemasonry.

If I wanted to I could find a musical score from the peas on my plate.

heres a strange theory im juggling around in my head..its possible after watching jake kotze and friends describe the theory that hidden in the arms of christ are the pyramid and the three windows behind represent the 2 pillars and space in between (cosmic illumination), also the image fits with the crop circle image of the checker floor, doors on each side image.
That the entire thing was an early masonic secret to the pyramid ritual, perhaps if its true that higher intelligences can be contacted using pyramid aether helix, that the sound encoded is a dialtone of sorts, to a certain being?

though please dont respond like I fully believe this as the operative word is 'theory' ..thanks. Though i like the score though, sounds like some techno could go behind it.












[edit on 11-11-2007 by mastermind77]