Iran's Military is Overrated and Outdated

For crying out loud....We are not going to attack Iran...Nor is England. This is going to be a political dance for the American and English administrations there will be no war. Iran is using this as political ploy to disengage the sanctions being implied. Man...As if enough of our own brothers and sisters haven't lost lives this is not what America needs. Were tipping 4 thousand dead and 30 thousand injured and local military hospitals here in Washington have roachs and all kinda things wrong and were thinking about smacking another hornets nest...While were at it we might as well throw a couple nukes in hu?

Originally posted by DCP
If a sleeper cell hits a western city, Iran looses a city. That is how you win a war.

I am willing to bet my life on this.
If you do indeed take out a city, you will be doing the exact opposite to winning a war.
When they hit your city, they arent using an army, they are using their ideals.
If you wipe out a city, all you do is create MORE of these idealistic people willing to sacrifice themselves in the name of revenge.

Do you really think, after watching Iraq unfold, that wiping out an Iranian city will bring them to NOT want to attack you?

For every child/mother or father you kill in Iran (if we do strike) you will be breeding double the amount of fanatics willing to strike you again.

America needs to learn, that you cannot beat an idealouge that 'islamic-jihad' started by using an army and smart bombs.

You need to find out why they are willing to die for their cause, and do what you can to ensure that cause doesnt exist in their minds.

Originally posted by tsloan
Were tipping 4 thousand dead and 30 thousand injured and local military hospitals here in Washington have roachs and all kinda things wrong and were thinking about smacking another hornets nest...While were at it we might as well throw a couple nukes in hu?

true , but you cant help people for being jumpy when this is how it all started for Iraq.

and even then it was WMD not nukes.

America grew tired of the sanctions on Iraq and there non compliance after 10 years.

well its only been a few days and Iran is non compliant.

and don't forget the troops.

sloan I feel for what you say, but from this side of the pond it does seem that the good ol USA are gunning for another war, as for us Brits well we will more than likely be there with you cus our Mr. Tony Blair is just a glory hunter at the end of the day.

My question is why do we need to be over the Middle East, why cannot Iran have nuclear facilities, who the hell decided who and who cannot have nuclear technology, countries develop at different speeds do they not.

I just wish people would stop thinking within the bounderies of their country and expand their thinking to the world, it is the only one we have and if we don't frig it up totally within, then sometime a external force in time will, you know like a giant friggin asteroid.

BAH........the human race.........total bunch of losers

Originally posted by Wolfie_UK
BAH........the human race.........total bunch of losers

Wolfie,

You don't know how right you are. This is precisely why we are ...

over in the Middle East

And it's why you will never get people to:

stop thinking within the bounderies of their country and expand their thinking to the world

Competition for resources, quest for power, and the imposition of the will of the powerful on the weak are uniquely human traits that we have lived with for a long, long time, and that we show no signs of abandoning.

No country or culture is any more, or any less at fault than any other. It's just that the power distribution is unequal.

You must face this reality.

"You must face this reality". as said by darkbluesky

dbs I have only one reality and that is when I stop breathing then I'm dead, hopefully the world will still be here and humanity in some shape or form will be thriving.

I just hope the population of the world realise that they / we / it are not a country on their own but a piece of the puzzle that is the world.



I hate politics and religion with pure bile, but I do love the humankind

Hmm... Iran's military and how it could cope with the US, interesting topic but as has been pointed out they cannot last in a long high intensity war. Anyway, out of all their conventional weapons I think their subs and IRBM's are their best bet...

maybe not today maybe not tomorrow , but ...................

That map is not entirely accurate, the US has at least one unacknowledged air field in Jordan and I'm pretty sure we have bases in the U.A.E.

I'm no expert on the military i just found it amazing the control the US already exerts on the region.

it would seem Iran is the last bastion of defiance

If we're talking strictly on the basis of government military, i'm sure The United States could overcome a great number of countries in the world. As an American, this doesn't make me proud, and it doesn't make me feel any safer. Iran wants to keep poking the bear in the cage, and that bear is going to lash out. Sure, we're already in Iraq & Afghanistan, and there is serious talk about cutting funding for the war and FORCING the administration to withdraw for that reason. I think we've spent a good bit too much time with our noses in Iraq, and we're not prepared when a real problem arises.

If this conflict keeps escalating, countries in the middle east will have to choose sides. Other larger countries like Russia have an interest in keeping Iran around for basic reasons, and that creates another conflict. I don't think we'll find as much terrorism in Iran, but the world will erupt.

Originally posted by thedigirati
With the The SS-N-22s Sunburn and SS-N-27B Sizzler anti-ship cruise missile a few ships WILL be lost, dunno for sure if Iran has the SS-N-27B or not but they might

just found out they Do have these YAKHONT (SS-N-26) ASCM

www.bharat-rakshak.com...

www.globalsecurity.org...

www.bharat-rakshak.com...

[edit on 26-3-2007 by thedigirati]

When did all this happen?

Sunburns, moskits and Yakhonts in Iranian possession?!!

The Sizzler has a pesky range 15 nm..

Originally posted by Zaphod58
They CAN be shot down, but it's going to take some luck, and some stupidity to do it.

Luck?

Stupidity?

I think you should talk to Colonel Zoltan Dani.

Perhaps he could tell you a few ways of shooting down the "invisible bomber".

How to Take Down an F-117

• Zoltan had about 200 troops under his command. He got to know them well, trained hard and made sure everyone could do what was expected of them. This level of quality leadership was essential, for Zoltan's achievements were a group effort.
  
  
• Zoltan used a lot of effective techniques that American air defense experts expected, but did not expect to encounter because of poor leadership by the enemy. For example, Zoltan knew that his major foe was HARM (anti-radar) missiles and electronic detection systems used by the Americans, as well as smart bombs from aircraft who had spotted him. To get around this, he used landlines for all his communications (no cell phones or radio). This was more of a hassle, often requiring him to use messengers on foot or in cars. But it meant the American intel people overhead were never sure where he was.
  
  
• His radars and missile launchers were moved frequently, meaning that some of his people were always busy looking for new sites to set up in, or setting up or taking down the equipment. His battery traveled over 100,000 kilometers during the 78 day NATO bombing campaign, just to avoid getting hit. They did, and his troops knew all that effort was worth the effort.
  
  
• he spies and observers enabled Zoltan to keep his radars on for a minimal amount of time. This made it difficult for the American SEAD (Suppression of Enemy Air Defenses) to use their HARM missiles (that homed in on radar transmissions.) Zoltan never lost a radar to a HARM missile.

How "Lucky" and "Stupid" Colonel Zoltan really was ey?

He actually shot down the F-117 with 21 foot long, 880 pound SA-3 missile - which entered service in 1961 and was considered no threat to most allied warplanes at that time. Colonel Zoltan shot down 2 aircraft (or more but we will never find out) and caused several dozen others to abort. He never lost a radar and all of his men are still alive today.

My point is - NEVER underestimate your enemy!

Hiroshima
Nagasaki

I would even argue that the Japanese of 1940's were more "hard core" then the terrorist of today. There was more Kamikaze acts then, then their are Homicide Bombers today. Dropping two bomb, acts of utter violence, saved millions of lives.

Japanese people witnessed whole families wiped out after the attacks you don't think mad them a little mad...wanted some revenge?? (I know i would be mad if i turned off my lights and saw a green glow.) but it made them stop.

America burned her own cities during the civil war. When i visited the Coke factory down in Atlanta, they didn't say "No Coke for you, Yankee...next"

Anger is a strong emotion, yes, but it's hard to hold. People get mad then they calm down.

Talk them out of it...LOL...do you think you can talk the Pope out of being Catholic?? Talk an Orthodox Jew into believing that Jesus is the lord and Savior? Yet some people believe you can talk a little jihadist out of being a jihadist...i hope i am wrong and that you can do it, but....

Iran is the last baby standing, in the Middle east.

War would be candy.

No candy for baby!

China gets almost all of it's oil from Iran. If we go into Iran and muck with the flow of oil to China, then China will not sit still for it.

I do not see the US entering Iran anytime soon.

Originally posted by WestPoint23
Hmm... Iran's military and how it could cope with the US, interesting topic but as has been pointed out they cannot last in a long high intensity war.

That is funny since Iran and Iraq fought for 8 years. Imagine an army that cannot last in a high intensity war fighting Iraq for 8 years, yet the US who is TOTALLY prepared for a high intensity war is still there bogged down and bleeding resources all over the place while mighty dollars flow into the bank accounts of Bush's friends.

You can bet that the US would not be going to war anytime soon if there were no profit in it for the military industrial complex.

Originally posted by groingrinder

Originally posted by WestPoint23
Hmm... Iran's military and how it could cope with the US, interesting topic but as has been pointed out they cannot last in a long high intensity war.

That is funny since Iran and Iraq fought for 8 years. Imagine an army that cannot last in a high intensity war fighting Iraq for 8 years, yet the US who is TOTALLY prepared for a high intensity war is still there bogged down and bleeding resources all over the place while mighty dollars flow into the bank accounts of Bush's friends.

What is funny, is that there are so many people who cannot understand the difference between high intensity warfare and what's going on in Iraq right now. The high intensity warfare in Iraq ended about one week after it started in March 2003.

Originally posted by groingrinder
That is funny since Iran and Iraq fought for 8 years.

Yeah and during those eight years of war Iran never once seriously threatened Iraq strategically, but it did lose more soldiers and equipment and sustained more overall damages. The US held back, even so the limited amount of support we gave to the Iraqis was enough to force Iran to end the war. One example of US power at the time is OP. Praying Mantis in which only the US Gulf fleet was able to destroy a good portion of Iran's navy within few days. And I need not remind you that the military Iran could not defeat during eight years of war, the US lead coalition decimated within one month.

Originally posted by groingrinder
...yet the US who is TOTALLY prepared for a high intensity war is still there...

The US lead coalition defeated Iraq's military in two weeks, that marked the end of the conventional high intensity war. Ever since we have been in occupation mode and we are trying to keep the entire country stable while waging a conflict with a robust insurgency. That is very difficult to do as has been proven time and again throughout military history. Make no mistake about it I have always maintained on these boards that if the US were to try and occupy Iran it would not do too well. All I'm saying is that as far as non occupation options go the conventional military match up is no contest for the US.

[edit on 27-3-2007 by WestPoint23]