New Developments In The Steven Avery Case From Making a Murderer

I agree. Clean-up of the garage crime scene would have been a nightmare.

ETA, according to that member here who is a retired guard from the WI DOC, Avery tries to come off as an idiot, but he is actually a chameleon. He can't be trusted either.

originally posted by: strongfp

originally posted by: SouthernForkway26
a reply to: strongfp
Linking the phone calls to the murderer is circumstantial, the Avery's had hundreds of cars and used autotrader relatively frequently. Teresa had been there before.

My belief is a yet unknown murderer killed Teresa nearby with little to no evidence the police could use. Somebody drives her car on the property and plants some remains in the pit. The bones in the pit are the only damning evidence. The valet key found by cops who weren't supposed to be there and other slimeball stuff means there is plenty of 'reasonable doubt' about the case.

Her remains were found in two separate spots. Down in a quarry and in the pit.
People testified against Avery saying he was not on the immediate property for some time, but saw smoke off in the distance. There's a lot of evidence and witnesses that the documentary are not telling.
Also, Avery had no explanation of his whereabouts the whole time. It's a little fishy isn't it?

First off, the documentary got me interested in the case which led me to read the trial transcripts, watch interviews, watch the trial parts that are available, etc. I am not basing my opinion on the matter on a documentary, but on the facts.

Your knowledge of the case and the evidence, not the fictional tale that was spun by Ken Kratz, is lacking. Did you know Kratz used one murder scenario for Brendan's trial and an entirely different one for Avery's. Wonder why he'd need to do that if there is SO much evidence against Steven?

The only DNA of Teresa's that was found any where near Avery's home was on one bullet, the bullet that Kratz and some expert of his said went through her skull...The same bullet that was grossly contaminated by the crime lab lady, but in a move that is unheard of, was allowed into the trial.

Only, after it was reexamined by one of the top ballistic experts, item FL (the bullet) never went through Teresa's skull. Repeated testing showed that there would have been microscopic bone fragments embedded in the bullet if it had been shot through her head.

You know what they did find? Wood and red paint...Here, have a look at the affidavit yourself. Item FL Testing Results from Lucien Haag

He does have an alibi and there is evidence to prove it.

She left Avery's and went to Zipperer's which was her last scheduled appointment. Her cell phone pinged off of a tower in Whitelaw, WI after she left. Whitelaw is several miles away from the Avery Salvage Yard and where he lived. Oh, and there WAS evidence to prove this that mysteriously disappeared and was not part of the discovery given to the defense. No one seems to know what happened to that CD recording proving she went to Zipperer's after Avery's but it did exist...

Claiming he called her, so he must've killed her is just ignorant. He called her back to place another ad...She, like other posters have stated, had been there many times because they sold cars quite frequently. He made the appointment in his sister's name with Auto Trader because she was the owner on the title of the van, not Steven.

The harassing phone calls she had been receiving in the weeks leading up to her death were not from Avery, but I believe her ex boyfriend and the person who most likely killed her.

Smoke in the distance? That is not factual or even true. Makes no sense.

They found some of her cremains at the quarry and right outside his trailer but those remains were never 100% identified as belonging to her. The state refused to turn this over to Zellner for testing. I wonder why?

Also, there is/was a shallow grave that someone gave information about and that cadaver dogs went right to...So did he also bury her at some point?

Just how did he remove every single trace of DNA from his trailer, etc. But forgot about a bullet, the bullet that wasn't found until months later? What about the detective telling the crime lab lady (Sherry Culhane) to "put her in the garage or trailer..." The only piece of (contaminated) evidence that had any of her DNA on it? That's still item FL, the bulled that didn't go through her skull but went through wood and paint.

Talk about fishy.

originally posted by: 123143
Her SUV was found, partially obscured by brush, in his scrapyard.

The only thing I really question about the prosecution's case is the key fob found in his bedroom. Was it really under the slippers, or was it placed there? Why wasn't it found during the initial search?

That is a legitimate question.

The one that was just retested and found to be covered with a prolific amount of oral DNA? The key to her car that had only Avery's DNA, not Teresa's? That key?

That's the key one of the Manitowoc officers threw on the floor and acted surprised when it appeared. The Manitowoc officers who weren't even supposed to be near there because of the huge conflict of interest.

As for the Wisconsin whomever, I'd take what they claim about Steven with a grain of salt. Especially a corrections officer. If they have something to share, that's great, but totally unethical and I believe it breaks all sorts of rules. I know plenty of people who work at the Super Max here in Colorado...They do not share any information about the prisoners due to ethics and privacy issues. Kind of like doctors, etc. So, the fact that this Wisconsin CO shares disparaging remarks about Avery says more about them and their unprofessionalism than it ever will about Avery.

About that RAV 4, he had access to a car crusher...If he wanted to get rid of evidence, he would have used the car crusher. He also had a smelter but decided to burn her with some old tires instead? Some chameleon.

Avery guity or not doesn't hide the fact the Police were guilty of a number of things. Planting evidence, losing evidence, taking advantage of a boy with a mental age of a 8 year old and coercing him into a admission of guilt and also lying in court.

Avery had all the time in the world to get rid of that car, He could have crushed it, taken it away and dumped it in a lake, Buried it, but no, he hid it under a tree branch for days.

What police force allows members of the family and an ex boyfrind, 'who was persistantly harrassing her with phone calls' to not only search a suspected crime scene, but allow the brother and ex to take control of the search of the scrap yard.

The investigation reeks to the high heavens and the case against Avery should never have seen the inside of a court of law.

originally posted by: 123143
You don't know this person, so you know where you can stick your opinion.

You are obviously biased in favor of Avery, so I will withdraw from the thread as it's pointless to argue with a mule.

Good idea.

originally posted by: Soloprotocol
Avery guity or not doesn't hide the fact the Police were guilty of a number of things. Planting evidence, losing evidence, taking advantage of a boy with a mental age of a 8 year old and coercing him into a admission of guilt and also lying in court.

Avery had all the time in the world to get rid of that car, He could have crushed it, taken it away and dumped it in a lake, Buried it, but no, he hid it under a tree branch for days.

What police force allows members of the family and an ex boyfrind, 'who was persistantly harrassing her with phone calls' to not only search a suspected crime scene, but allow the brother and ex to take control of the search of the scrap yard.

The investigation reeks to the high heavens and the case against Avery should never have seen the inside of a court of law.

Thank you. Glad to see some folks get it.

With Kathleen Zellner filing her prolific, and very damaging to the state's entire case, brief this week the trolls are out in force on all sites. Twitter, Reddit, Facebook, etc.

Anyhow, they never questioned or looked at anyone, including her abusive/stalker ex, the married man she was having an affair with or her current boyfriend/roommate (who was the best friend of her ex, Ryan) as suspects. Only Steven Avery, a man who knew her in a professional sense, who had no prior relationship with her other than when she came to the yard to take the photos for Auto Trader and who certainly had zero motive to murder her.

Ken Kratz, aka The Prize, actually referred to her ex Ryan as an "untrained law enforcement officer" during the trial. He literally addressed him as that.

He was not a member of the Manitowoc County SO or the Calument County SO, or any other law enforcement office. He was a nurse, or getting ready to graduate nursing school, IIRC. So why refer to him as something he is clearly not? That has always bothered me, him addressing him as that, and why.

To cover their rear-ends for how many times this ex boyfriend was on the property, that we know of? He also signed in with a fake name "Ryan Kilgus" on one of the days he was there? Idk...

He had unfettered access to the "crime scene" and Avery Salvage Yard and when it came time for the RAV 4 to be "found" he gave a camera, map and a direct line to Sheriff Pagel to two searchers, Pam Strum and her daughter Nicole.

Pam Strum, in her testimony at trial, said "God" led her right to it. Over 4,000 cars in that salvage yard but she found it in less that 15 minutes. Amazeballs. Truly. It was a miracle. /s

There were also reports at the time that it was found only after investigators acted on a tip...
Here's a link to a local news cast from that day, if you're interested: Link

However, the RAV is not seen on the fly over video taken on November 4, 2005...but, amazingly was found the very next morning. Again, amazeballs!

I am getting ready to start on my Doctorate this fall so the Avery case has been a way to brush up on my researching skills, etc. but it's a very deep rabbit hole to fall down, with tunnels and twists and more turns than you can imagine. It's better than any mystery/crime novel I've ever read, fiction or no. Idk if anything has grabbed my attention like this case has. It pisses me right off, so that's probably why.

There is so much evidence of manipulation in order to frame and convict Steven Avery it is unprecedented. From the very start of the investigation, the "evidence," the forced confession from Brendan, to the disgusting press conferences held by Kratz in order to taint (more like destroy) the jury pool, the judge's rulings and even talk of jury tampering.

Steven had zero chance of being acquitted. Neither did Brendan, which is strange since his confession wasn't allowed to be used during Steven's trial and there is ZERO DNA or other evidence putting him at the scene of the "crime." Brendan's conviction was overturned, btw. Hopefully the Circuit Court will rule on the State's appeal very soon and he will be out of prison before the end of summer.

If you haven't yet, read the expert's affidavits. They aren't very long, some of their CV's are longer than the actual affidavit, but it is a very good read.

Affidavits

a reply to: Wardaddy454

Did you read the 300 pages?

For those who have not seen season II yet...please watch.

Way more than just assertions.

Clear evidence of evidence tamperer, planting,. falsifying evidence, and concealing....

The Coroner was never allowed on the scene and gagged.

If that does not add paint to the canvas, maybe this helps.

Steven Avery Administered Brain Fingerprinting Test =Brain fingerprinting is a technique that uses electroencephalography to determine whether or not specific information is stored in a subject’s brain,


Avery is cleared in season II numerous times, thanks to the brilliant defense attorney Kathleen Zellner

If this is America Justice and what men and women have been fighting to defend...God help us all.

Where is Jeff Sessions...the must be at least 6 or more involved with this obstruction of Justice.

I just finished part 2 .... I'm not out to declare anyone's guilt or innocence - documentaries are generally made to sway opinion in the direction of the producer.

But what strikes me, is the cover up and clear misdeeds in evidence collection and handling. I also found it very telling that the coroner was not allowed on site, or to examine any of the evidence and was dismissed outright and threatened with arrest if she were to pursue it.

Also that stands out to me, is that if the coroner were to be recused because of a conflict of interest due to the law suit, then why were the detectives/LEO's and others allowed to resume and even given access to the Avery property.

In my opinion, this was a clear cover up, in, if nothing else, the blatant disregard to follow evidence, leads and witness statements to look anywhere other than S. Avery.

With all of that said, to me, it shows just how easy it is for corrupt officials, in any capacity, to skew the lines of truth and the difficulty for every day Americans to bring those truths to light.

If this can happen here, what do think is happening with our higher up officials and representatives?

Things like this are why I just dont trust the system and especially the police. Instead of telling my kids to respect police I'm now telling them to be afraid and avoid them.