UK General Election - My own dilemma...

a reply to: ufoorbhunter

Labour really destroyed our car manufacturing.

Let's get some sense of balance here. The following all went bust under a Conservative Government.

Talbot Cars Coventry

Heavy Commercial Vehicle Manufacturers AEC, Bedford, Foden, Guy, Scammell.

The U.K. produces ZERO Heavy Commercial Vehicles.

a reply to: ukmicky1980

I’m in London and am in my 50’s. Unlike you, neither me nor my wife have stable jobs. We both work on our start-up companies, and probably earn far less than what you do since we leave whatever we can in the companies to have reserves to pay salaries, corporation taxes and to be able to grow the companies and take on more staff. And since we are employed by our own companies rather than somebody else's, we can't even get a mortgage however much deposit we put in. Our companies are almost entirely dependant on immigrants since very few UK citizens have the skills and experience that we are looking for, and being small companies we don’t fulfil the government’s quite strict and onerous (and costly) criteria for being able to sponsor tier 2 visas for the people that we need. Although Labour is not too adverse to immigration, a new Labour government would be devastating for entrepreneurs and small businesses due to most of their policies. The Conservaties promise of a EU poll creates a lot of uncertainty for years to come. Our back-up plan is to move at least parts of our businesses to another EU country and expand there instead of in the UK.

UKIP wants the UK to leave the EU so that “we can protect our own borders”. We can even within the EU. Perhaps he is referring to the Schengen area, that the UK is not a member of (and which Ireland would like to be a member of, if it wasn’t for the UK). The fact is that the UK would be unfit to join the Schengen area. In exchange for abolishing internal border controls (just like between states in the USA). they have agreed to increase their common border protection outwards - including for the UK. That’s why you see the “junker bunkers” whenever you go to most other EU countries, an installation that raise envy in Russia as well as the USA.

Immigration. I recently moved to one of the “bad” parts of London. Most of my neighbours are immigrants, from Eastern Europe and further abroad. A very nice, hard-working, decent bunch of people. There has been some crime, such as parcels stolen and car burglary. Luckily, I have a professional CCTV system (the kind that companies buy, not what you buy at Maplin) installed and in every single case the perpetuator has been a white, British guy. If that is the state of our country then I say let’s bring more foreigners in to make our country become a decent one.

On healthcare, the UKIP emits bombastic phrases that at the outset are easy to agree with, but not if you think about it. There are around 2 million EU citizens living in the UK. At the same time there is around 2 million UK citizens living in other parts of the EU. Remove the right for non-UK citizens to receive healthcare for two years or at all (despite them paying taxes and national insurance here), and the same could happen to our citizens living abroad, however since they don’t pay taxes in the UK, they would not be able to claim any healthcare benefits in the UK either. To what benefit for anybody, other than the feel-good factor of UKIP and their voters?

Also, I have lived for a fair number of years outside the UK, where free public healthcare is far better and quicker than in the UK. I do not believe that people choose to come to the UK for “health tourism” (as there are other, far better options for that) but rather for opportunities and ease of doing and growing business. The Conservaties want to implement a policy that nobody should be able to immigrate to the UK without a job offer. Do they mean that they do not want entrepreneurs looking to set up companies to possibly employ more people in the country anymore? That is sending the wrong message. The more I think about it, the more I find myself agreeing with the Lib Dems, however much I dislike it. I see a lot of populist propaganda in the UKIP messaging, the Labour is just unthinkable since they appear to be against anything and everything that small businesses want to achieve, and the Conservaties are bending over backwards to appeal to both UKIP’ers and to Labour voters, causing their message to become severely diluted.

Given the opportunity, I’d rather vote for a bit of everything rather than the full agenda of any single party. Party politics tend to only serve the parties themselves and not the needs of their constituents.

originally posted by: alldaylong
a reply to: ufoorbhunter

Labour really destroyed our car manufacturing.

Let's get some sense of balance here. The following all went bust under a Conservative Government.

Talbot Cars Coventry

Heavy Commercial Vehicle Manufacturers AEC, Bedford, Foden, Guy, Scammell.

The U.K. produces ZERO Heavy Commercial Vehicles.

Was it because of a Conservative government, or simply because of changing market conditions during their term (that Conservative governments prefer not to interfere with)?

originally posted by: doobydoll
I can't tell the difference between Tory and Labour, and I hate the Tories so I guess that means I also hate Labour.

Libdems can forget it, they let the Tories lead the coalition with hardly so much as a whimper in protest, they were just happy for their only chance to sit at the gov table for 5 years in return for keeping quiet.

I'm just fuming I can't vote for SNP, but if Labour will agree to co-ally with SNP then I will vote Labour (just to hoof the Tory pigs out) and hope SNP are as good as they are sounding, we'll need them to keep blue Labour in check.

If there is to be no Labour-SNP coaliton, then I'm voting Greens.

I don't really want to vote for any of the main 3 parties, they're all criminal and corrupt and will never serve to make life better in UK society. They'll only serve themselves, with our money. Screw them.

What makes you think that the Greens or any other party with a supposedly idealistic agenda would be any better when and if they happen to be in power?

Politics is all about promising and appealing to the populace to entice them to vote for you, so that you can get into power and then do whatever you want for the coming five years.

originally posted by: DAZ21

People still try and scaremonger and it's disturbing. These people are usually the type of people that read a news title and take it as fact before reading the whole story. For instance you will see all major MSM give a scary title like ' Farage blames foreign HIV for NHS Woes' but then you'll find out that Farage gave facts that others had tried to hide and the news story turns out to be that Nigel's comments were actually just common sense.

Think about the HIV statement from Farage for a minute, read his actually words, he didn't say he hated foreigners with HIV he said they 60% of HIV cases are from non British born people, and on the NHS they can get the antiretroviral drugs that cost the tax payer 25000 pounds a year, which roughly equates to 2 billion a year.

Yeah, but if you care to look up the Facts[/url ] on HIV you will find Farage was talking out his arse as usual. More Racist BS. The True figure was 30% 0r less.

[url=https://aliberallife.wordpress.com/2015/04/03/farage-and-the-hiv-lie/]Farage and the HIV Lie



DAZ has been Duped.....or is he a Government Shill trying his/her best in trying to dupe the rest of us?....I'll go with Shill.

This site playing up today...??

originally posted by: moniker

originally posted by: doobydoll
I can't tell the difference between Tory and Labour, and I hate the Tories so I guess that means I also hate Labour.

Libdems can forget it, they let the Tories lead the coalition with hardly so much as a whimper in protest, they were just happy for their only chance to sit at the gov table for 5 years in return for keeping quiet.

I'm just fuming I can't vote for SNP, but if Labour will agree to co-ally with SNP then I will vote Labour (just to hoof the Tory pigs out) and hope SNP are as good as they are sounding, we'll need them to keep blue Labour in check.

If there is to be no Labour-SNP coaliton, then I'm voting Greens.

I don't really want to vote for any of the main 3 parties, they're all criminal and corrupt and will never serve to make life better in UK society. They'll only serve themselves, with our money. Screw them.

What makes you think that the Greens or any other party with a supposedly idealistic agenda would be any better when and if they happen to be in power?

I don't. All I know is I don't want a hateful gov that despises anyone who isn't wealthy and does its utmost to trample average citizens into destitution and despair, and flatly refuses to help any citizen who needs it. Tories have broken every single promise they made in 2010, helped themselves to huge pay rises, destroyed documents relating to expenses claims to avoid investigations and justice, given their rich donors generous tax cuts paid for by withholding poverty-related and other welfare benefits, delayed investigations into corruption and cover-ups over Westminster paedo-ring allegations, cash for access, the list of criminality is obscene. Why would I vote for them?

Maybe you were in a coma whilst all this was being reported, but if not then why do you want a criminal mafia for a government?

Politics is all about promising and appealing to the populace to entice them to vote for you, so that you can get into power and then do whatever you want for the coming five years.

In other words, it's a lying contest. We already know that.

We know now that the Tories are nothing but poor-hating, lying tyrants, and are planning more misery for citizens so I'm not voting for them. We know Labour agree with the Tories so they're not getting my vote either. We know LibDems are a limp lettuce with no spine as evidenced during the last 5 years. All these have had a bash at the job and proved they were worse than useless, so why would I vote for any of them again?

The proverbial 'Devil you know' isn't always better, so I'm giving the Greens a chance.

One thing you must essentially do is take not the slightest bit of notice printed or spoken information when put out by any oppositions people.
You must do what ANY sensible person must do (without being too nasty) is get off your fat arse and go and speak directly with your chosen candidates and get your answers from them. If then they get into power and go against what they said to you (just like what the conservatives and the liberals did) then you can with a clear conscience shout out your outrage from the rooftops and in the local papers.
That really is the real problem THEY LIE, you just have to choose which parties lies are going to affect you the most and don't vote for them.

originally posted by: doobydoll

originally posted by: moniker

originally posted by: doobydoll
I can't tell the difference between Tory and Labour, and I hate the Tories so I guess that means I also hate Labour.

Libdems can forget it, they let the Tories lead the coalition with hardly so much as a whimper in protest, they were just happy for their only chance to sit at the gov table for 5 years in return for keeping quiet.

I'm just fuming I can't vote for SNP, but if Labour will agree to co-ally with SNP then I will vote Labour (just to hoof the Tory pigs out) and hope SNP are as good as they are sounding, we'll need them to keep blue Labour in check.

If there is to be no Labour-SNP coaliton, then I'm voting Greens.

I don't really want to vote for any of the main 3 parties, they're all criminal and corrupt and will never serve to make life better in UK society. They'll only serve themselves, with our money. Screw them.

What makes you think that the Greens or any other party with a supposedly idealistic agenda would be any better when and if they happen to be in power?

I don't. All I know is I don't want a hateful gov that despises anyone who isn't wealthy and does its utmost to trample average citizens into destitution and despair, and flatly refuses to help any citizen who needs it. Tories have broken every single promise they made in 2010, helped themselves to huge pay rises, destroyed documents relating to expenses claims to avoid investigations and justice, given their rich donors generous tax cuts paid for by withholding poverty-related and other welfare benefits, delayed investigations into corruption and cover-ups over Westminster paedo-ring allegations, cash for access, the list of criminality is obscene. Why would I vote for them?

Maybe you were in a coma whilst all this was being reported, but if not then why do you want a criminal mafia for a government?

Regardless of whether I was or not, much of that originally happened during non-Tory governments, which makes them all the same to time. It is one branch of TPTB helping another of the same out.

The proverbial 'Devil you know' isn't always better, so I'm giving the Greens a chance.

I think we will all come to realise that they, too, are of the same ilk if not worse, judging from the questionable cleanliness of green parties in other parts of Europe.

There are more options than just the four main parties. There will be other minor parties and independent candidates too. Its worth looking into their policies also, and if they tick your boxes then vote for them. If not then just spoil your ballot.

originally posted by: ufoorbhunter
a reply to: ukmicky1980

Ok mate you work in industry, like me. Maunufacturing, we are a rare breed these days, me ceramics you cars. We both rely on exporting our products to other parts of the world. Things are better when you work in industry under the Conservatives. Your Nissan plant was gained under Maggie

I'm sorry but what????? This is the complete opposite to reality.

Maggie singlehandedly destroyed british manufacturing and left it open to gutting by The City. Millions of UK skilled manual labourers and working class people lost their jobs - maggies response? 'There's no such thing as society'.

I strongly suggest you watch the Mayfair Set or other similar documentaries if you think the nasty party have ever lifted a finger to help the common working person in the UK.

Sadly nowadays Labour are equally as Thatcherite, Greens would put car anufacturing out of business, UKIP are complete and utter mentals who couldn't run a tap without thinking it was the fault of asylum seaekers, so your only real option are lib dems who are #e. There aren't really any parties who could care less about manufacturing, although the greens are very keen on major wage boosts and improvement in working conditions for teachers but it's best to read fact checks of their own manifestos than my personal biased opinion.

originally posted by: DAZ21

Think about the HIV statement from Farage for a minute, read his actually words, he didn't say he hated foreigners with HIV he said they 60% of HIV cases are from non British born people, and on the NHS they can get the antiretroviral drugs that cost the tax payer 25000 pounds a year, which roughly equates to 2 billion a year.

Problem is not a single claim in that is true, the figures are a fraction of that. Why would any sane person vote for a party that'd rather lie about foreigners instead of telling the truth about their banker mates?

Even if it was true, the cost is less per year than the amount farrage's old city firm illegally dodge in tax per year, ALONE, nearly 100 billion are lost per year via tax loopholes. So would you rather politicians save lives or line the pockets of multimillionaires as Farage clearly prefers the later and will raedilly remove healthcare to boost their profits further, as evidenced in their privatising the NHS docs.

a reply to: Soloprotocol

Yea you got me I'm a shill, because I want the establishment out.

I think it's obvious to anyone who reads your posts, that you are pro SNP and break up of the union.

So if anything I'd say you're an SNP Shill, how much of the English taxpayers money do they use up there for all of this propaganda that they have you spewing?

a reply to: DAZ21

Oh aye, he's an angry Scot with a chip on his shoulder, there is no doubt...but, one can hardly blame him. The way the conservatives have been running things, I don't blame any Scot for wanting out.

Don't get me wrong, I'm glad we stayed together, I'm half Scottish on my mothers side (Elder), I live about 30 miles from the border and have business contracts in Scotland.....but not everyone feels that way, especially the Scots further north and most Glaswegians.

If anyone is to blame, it's Whitehall.

originally posted by: DAZ21
a reply to: Soloprotocol

Yea you got me I'm a shill, because I want the establishment out.

I think it's obvious to anyone who reads your posts, that you are pro SNP and break up of the union.

So if anything I'd say you're an SNP Shill, how much of the English taxpayers money do they use up there for all of this propaganda that they have you spewing?

I Believe your question should be how much Scottish taxpayers money you spend down there as we pay more tax per head than any other part of the UK and we have done so for the past 34 years...Look it up.

Once again, You're Just Regurgitating more Farage BS from the other night...Care to comment on his racist HIV Lie also, or will you simply skip that particular nugget.

Vote for This guy, He has no shame whatsoever..

Nah............... Maggie did a great job. Transformed the country and made it what it is today

a reply to: bastion

originally posted by: moniker

originally posted by: alldaylong
a reply to: ufoorbhunter

Labour really destroyed our car manufacturing.

Let's get some sense of balance here. The following all went bust under a Conservative Government.

Talbot Cars Coventry

Heavy Commercial Vehicle Manufacturers AEC, Bedford, Foden, Guy, Scammell.

The U.K. produces ZERO Heavy Commercial Vehicles.

Was it because of a Conservative government, or simply because of changing market conditions during their term (that Conservative governments prefer not to interfere with)?

Eaxactly Moniker

So much of British industry was crap and not competitive. Why save sinking ships when they will drown you too. The car industry should be left to compete on what it offers, if it means supporting it through my taxes then no, let it sink

originally posted by: alldaylong
a reply to: ufoorbhunter

Labour really destroyed our car manufacturing.

Let's get some sense of balance here. The following all went bust under a Conservative Government.

Talbot Cars Coventry

Heavy Commercial Vehicle Manufacturers AEC, Bedford, Foden, Guy, Scammell.

The U.K. produces ZERO Heavy Commercial Vehicles.

Tabot was shut down by the French, it was their business. Hey we still make DAF trucks at Leyland. Bedford is now Vauxhall. The local company ERF or was it Foden was bought by Mann and it was harshly treated but didn't that transfer to DAF in Leyland? Hey they'll all be under the Paccar label one day.

Industry should stand and make a profit or die, or we'll all end up supporting the companies through our taxes.

a reply to: alldaylong

The remains of what was MG Rover, that is present Mini and Jaguar Landrover is a far better company than the dregs that was Mg Rover. K Series engines that dropped to pieces. Sorry but Rover was bad stuff, they were not making cars capable of competing and had a workforce that ultimately shot itself in the foot through their left wing leanings and strikes.