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originally posted by: BlueJacket
Right...and wheres the disgust that our government spys on us and everyone else in the enrire world all the time.
you folks make me laugh getting up in arms about Isreal spying, Im no fan of their tactics, but give me a freaking break.
because in this case Obama and Kerry both have stated that this type of agreement needs no Congressional approval. They are ignoring the fact sanctions are in place, which Congress and only Congress can remove. The deal is calling for sanctions to be removed before Iran agrees to the rest of the treaty. Secondly those Presidents have not kept Congress in the dark.
Maybe I missed it but where has Obama asked Congress to remove the sanctions?
Then feel free to tell the IAEA your thoughts being they just stated they cant verify Iranian compliance because on 12 outstanding issues dealing with nuclear weapons, Iran has only agreed to address 1 issue. Iran has been caught buying items that can only be used in nuclear weapons development. If they are developing a bomb then why do they need those items? why does Iran need software for testing yield explosions?
No they are not when sanctions are present.
and yet the land Israel occupies was taken when Arab nations invaded Israel.
Considering Obama's track record I don't blame Israel for spying on the negotiations. After all they have an interest in the outcome and will be the ones forced to live with any agreement Obama makes. Since Obama is bound and determined to bypass Congress on the agreement it makes one wonder what exactly Obama is giving away he doesn't want others to see.
Israel is not the only nation condemning this action with the US and Iran so I am a bit curious as to why they are the focus.
Seriously, wake up and understand that you fight the people trying to kill you and not give them more time to go get bigger weapons to kill you with.
The deal an only deal worth talking about is the development of their Natural Gas resources which will power their country for a 1000 years in exchange for dismantling all nuclear technology.
I wonder why we are allies with a country that stole nuke secrets from us in the 1st place.
originally posted by: Xcathdra
a reply to: buster2010
Absolutely true.
Israel came into possession of the Golan Heights, Gaza, The Sinai and land bordering Lebanon. All Captured by Israel when Arab nations invaded.
Israel is a sovereign nation and can behave in any matter it sees fit for its own national security
originally posted by: tothetenthpower
And the agreement in itself does not, a provision of the final agreement does. This is why there's been nothing put forth towards congress. Yes, in the past, the state department has kept congress out of the loop until a final agreement is drafted and ready for approval.
Not required until the agreement is actually reached.
(CNSNews.com) – Secretary of State John Kerry on Wednesday declined to “get into” what negotiators are proposing to the Iranians in the nuclear talks, and defended the president’s authority to execute foreign policy, saying he did not believe a negotiated agreement should go through a “formal approval process” by Congress.
“I don’t think there ought to be a formal approval process,” he told the Senate Foreign Relations Committee, adding that the administration was consulting with Congress and that lawmakers would ultimately have to vote on lifting sanctions on Iran.
originally posted by: tothetenthpower
I was unaware of any of those things, I'd like to read about it actually. Although I don't think it would be untrue.
originally posted by: tothetenthpower
Can you provide a source that shows other treaties will sanctions were handled exclusively by congressional approval, during negotiations?
On March 21st, the semi-official Twitter account of Iranian Supreme Leader Ali Khamenei sent the following tweet: "We reject US fraudulent offer of reaching a deal w #Iran first then lifting sanctions. Lifting sanctions is a part of deal not its outcome."
originally posted by: tothetenthpower
I'd love to be proven wrong here, I don't like Obama or his admin, nor the state department.
~Tenth
originally posted by: msallo
SInce israel was reestablished, the US has been in at least 22 warring conflicts. Our "ally" israel has fought at our side in ZERO of them.
The people who support israel are people who believe in talking snakes.
originally posted by: Xcathdra
originally posted by: msallo
SInce israel was reestablished, the US has been in at least 22 warring conflicts. Our "ally" israel has fought at our side in ZERO of them.
The people who support israel are people who believe in talking snakes.
Do the terms of our alliances with Israel require them to act on our behalf during times of war?
Secondly Israel has in fact provided support to the US in terms of intelligence.
hrrm so how did we catch them spying on us? by spying on them of course! dont see much coming out of this ,they spy on us we spy on them every one spies on every one .
Israel spied on confidential talks last year between Iran and the US on Tehran's nuclear program, then used the information gathered to campaign against a deal, White House officials say. The ruse was discovered when US intel agencies spying on Israel intercepted messages with details on the closed-door talks. It is believed Israel also learned of confidential US briefings and informants in Europe, the Wall Street Journal reports. But what really angered US officials, they say, was that Israeli Ambassador Ron Dermer shared details of the talks with US lawmakers to warn against a deal shortly before an interim agreement was signed in November 2013 and continued to do so leading up to Benjamin Netanyahu's visit to Congress. "It is one thing for the US and Israel to spy on each other. It is another thing for Israel to steal US secrets and play them back to US legislators to undermine US diplomacy," a senior official tells the Journal.
Cyberspace is one big snoop-fest where even allies tend to tolerate one another’s espionage. Israel, a routine geopolitical ally of the United States, has been caught spying on the U.S.’s nuclear negotiations with Iran, reports the Wall Street Journal. The state’s surveillance came to the attention of the White House after the U.S., somewhat ironically, intercepted Israeli communications containing confidential information that could have only come, officials believe, from access to its private talks, government officials told the paper. So goes the one-upmanship of the intelligence world.
so more mad about trying to back door a sitting president during diplomatic talks
What perturbed the White House most, reports the Journal, was not so much Israel’s eavesdropping—that’s to be expected between nation states these days, I guess—but it was the way Israel used the information to influence Congress.
originally posted by: Xcathdra
a reply to: CranialSponge
There are 5 other nations involved and then there is Iran.
The US was not the only nation Israel obtained information from.
originally posted by: Xcathdra
a reply to: msallo
You are the one who claimed Israel, as an ally of the US, never got involved in our conflicts.
So I ask the question again - does the terms of our alliance with Israel require them to support us militarily?
If you aren't going to answer the question and take it seriously then maybe you should not make claims you cant support.